Why is GGG caving in to casuals' demands?

What could possibly be easier than trading? Also casual is usually tied to time constraints not difficulty..

"

deteego wrote:

"

TheAnuhart wrote:

The comparison was a week to end game.

You say end game is 70+ maps.

I started a character 4 days ago.
Didn't play it exclusively, played others too.
Went direct to Merciless Piety and killed her at 59.
Was doing 66/67 maps at 60.
Was doing 70 maps at 65.
Am doing 70+ maps now.

Completely self found.
1 day 6 hours /played.

Thats nice, it appears that you are doing a combination of

1. Playing 6+ hours a day
2. Playing a broken FotM build
3. Leveling with highest rolled uniques/rares

No, but that is what the game, by design, would have me do.
Buy gear rather than use only what I have.
Buy boss kills rather than kill them myself.
Farm Ledge/Fellshrine/Docks and over level, rather than go direct, underleveled.
Get 6 man carried through maps thereafter.

So, what I did was NOT take the DESIGNED CASUAL GAME ROUTE.

If I had, which most do, AND THAT IS THE DESIGN, it would have been even more pretend hardcore than it is.

Case in point, OP says the game is being casualised. IT ALWAYS FUCKING WAS BY DESIGN, to a MASSIVE degree.

"

mushioov wrote:

I see it happen all the time more and more. I had over 6 months break from this game and it has gotten 200% easier after I left. The reason? GGG has caved in for the casuals' demands about permanent loot, etc. nonsense that makes the game so much easier.

GGG seeing all these "active" threads (in reality it's 1 or 2 loudmouth demanders shouting to each other) thinks that these are somehow issues that "need" to be fixed. Well they aren't. The game was/is good when it's hard and the more casual demands go through, the more people who want to play PoE for the challenge are pushed away.

Why is GGG caving in to please the flimsy casuals who we all know will abandon this game the instant their instant-gratification meter is full? I hope the answer isn't that they are stupid, because I'm quite sure they aren't. Is it the money?

Discuss.

Being that I've had my bouts of vacation time from here too, I always thought that players who spend too much time away from the game don't have a lot of right to be doing much bitching about the state of the game when they return... it doesn't matter what kind of glitzy super supporter tattoo they've bought their way into.

So role a scion, learn how to use a couple trigger gems properly, and grind act 5 solo constantly if you want a challenge. Quit'cher bitchin about an improved game. If you don't want to apply improvements to your gameplay, then don't.

I have spoken.

"

Temper wrote:

Maybe he deleted and rerolled when he came back,maybe he plays solo self found/gambled,maybe he deletes characters at level 80,maybe he started a fresh account,maybe he plays to level 60 and then restarts over and over and over because he finds no joy in playing further content,maybe he has played more hours than both of us combined.


Could be far from casual.

It's possible, however proof would be necessary given the topic.

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Ten_of_Swords wrote:

Spoiler

"

clabornd wrote:

The fact that people lobbied against permanent loot still baffles me.

What IS baffeling to me is how people voice loud opinions wihtout taking time to understand the topic or opposing view.

maybe this will stir memories for some?

http://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/42552

I remember at one point during the arguments with the PA supporters that they pleaded to "just allow them to have a league that did not have loot-tension" - many even were fine if it was a pay-only league at that. Does anyone remember what happened? I'll tell you. it was DENIED because of the rule that "no leagues would be allowed to be EASIER then the default/standard league"

The problem here is that "options" DO NOT WORK when the choices are not equal.

This season I played almost exclusively pub games in nemesis and only joined SA games. The moment anyone didn’t get an item before the timer they asked to change the setting to PA, and the host did, (or the host will change it after the group starts because they forgot to change it) the few times I was the host people left if I didn’t change it.

I DO asked people a lot why they change the game to PA and almost 100% of the time I got some variation of “it’s easier, we don’t have to pay attention to what drops, we can just watch the monsters etc.” and I cannot argue with that.

Whatever the case, whatever your preferences are you have to admit that the whole game is PA now. Loot tension is dead, "options" are a FAIL if the intention was some kind of compromise.

The 6 people wanting SA are free to party as they like and play SA. Everyone who wants PA (which is clearly the extreme majority) can play PA. Seems options are working as intended.

That's possible if you're handing down loot fom one character to another. Try playing that way without cross-character trading and display results.

"

Ten_of_Swords wrote:

"

clabornd wrote:

The fact that people lobbied against permanent loot still baffles me.

What IS baffeling to me is how people voice loud opinions wihtout taking time to understand the topic or opposing view.

maybe this will stir memories for some?

http://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/42552

I remember at one point during the arguments with the PA supporters that they pleaded to "just allow them to have a league that did not have loot-tension" - many even were fine if it was a pay-only league at that. Does anyone remember what happened? I'll tell you. it was DENIED because of the rule that "no leagues would be allowed to be EASIER then the default/standard league"

The problem here is that "options" DO NOT WORK when the choices are not equal.

This season I played almost exclusively pub games in nemesis and only joined SA games. The moment anyone didn’t get an item before the timer they asked to change the setting to PA, and the host did, (or the host will change it after the group starts because they forgot to change it) the few times I was the host people left if I didn’t change it.

I DO asked people a lot why they change the game to PA and almost 100% of the time I got some variation of “it’s easier, we don’t have to pay attention to what drops, we can just watch the monsters etc.” and I cannot argue with that.

Whatever the case, whatever your preferences are you have to admit that the whole game is PA now. Loot tension is dead, "options" are a FAIL if the intention was some kind of compromise.

it's not really ABOUT being easier...sure, it makes it a tiny bit easier, but the real issue is that loot names take up the entire screen (especially in maps with an MFer), and if the loot is on FFA or SA, you have to keep them on all the time. In hardcore maps, it's good to be able to see your surroundings and the monsters instead of blindly firing while not being able to see anything because your screen is filled with text. I imagine the only people who really prefer having the text cover their screens are totem users and summoners, since they just stand there and collect loot in any case.

edit: it appears none of your characters are higher than 67, perhaps you haven't yet experienced piles of MF loot in maps

"

bluefalcon74 wrote:

That's possible if you're handing down loot fom one character to another. Try playing that way without cross-character trading and display results.

You mean playing the game not only without trading, not only without account self found, but completely single character self found?

Do you see the point?
While a much better experience, a lot more 'hardcore', a lot less carebear..

The game is designed that one actually just buys gear and progress.

The game isn't being casualised, it always was, by design. It in fact actively tries harder than any game, ever, to 'disincentivise', 'restrict', 'prevent' anything but a casual game play.
There are purposely designed blocks against anything not faceroll.

I mean, gating content behind fucking trading and grouping? WTF?

"

mushioov wrote:

I see it happen all the time more and more. I had over 6 months break from this game and it has gotten 200% easier after I left. The reason? GGG has caved in for the casuals' demands about permanent loot, etc. nonsense that makes the game so much easier.

GGG seeing all these "active" threads (in reality it's 1 or 2 loudmouth demanders shouting to each other) thinks that these are somehow issues that "need" to be fixed. Well they aren't. The game was/is good when it's hard and the more casual demands go through, the more people who want to play PoE for the challenge are pushed away.

Why is GGG caving in to please the flimsy casuals who we all know will abandon this game the instant their instant-gratification meter is full? I hope the answer isn't that they are stupid, because I'm quite sure they aren't. Is it the money?

Discuss.

I'm casual and have been for a long time. Guess what, I also pay the bills and play nemesis league.

I also have two small kids and a career.

Poe has plenty to be challenging but you don't define what that is. Nor do you define what "casual" is and you do not explain what it is you think will make the game better or harder.

As an older gamer, I've been doing this a while (30 years) and I have noticed a distinct change in the way people interact and deal with games. Especially younger players.

1. They don't see games as entertainment. (Seems to me there is some sort of attitude that being good at a video game is like being some sort of star athlete. I assure you, it's not)

2. Many I've played with, younger guys, don't handle losing very well. I've seen people quit the game simply because they died too early in a race or lost their hardcore character.

3. Theorycrafters. All too often I'll be told that I have to do a build a certain way or it's shit. I dunno, if it's enjoyable to play, is it shit?

4. Hardcorelitist. Now I play hardcore, because I do enjoy the challenge and sense of loss when I lose a character to softcore. I get it. What I don't get is the attitude that if someone doesn't have 16 hours a day to play, they are a "baddie". No, I would argue they are just "employed".

So comes the fine line between satisfying these archetypes or everyone else. Me, I enjoy the game. I have at least 1000 hours playing which is saying a lot for me, that's roughly 1/8th of my time.


So my tips for making the game more enjoyable start with you, not the game. Try not building the super min-max builds but rather something interesting and difficult to level.

Try building something that does not do 24k dps or 8k life.