Will there be a new atlas every league now?

"

Kellog wrote:

"

Antigegner wrote:

I'm trying to find an explanation from GGG as to why they want/need to change the map series every league now. Have you guys found anything?

Chris from the most recent Baeclast: Transcript

"

It's a full scramble. The goal here is diversity so you can't expect the same layout, the same maps in the same places. Obviously there's restrictions where the ones with crazy bosses have to go near the end, and ones with baby bosses have to go near the start, but the intention is replayability, because things are subtly different league to league, the pathing is different and so on. This is a thing we're trying to do, we've come up with tools for it now, where we think that we'll actually extend player retention in maps by having them be different, you're not subconsciously getting bored by them. It's maybe a boring game designer thing to do in the background, but we think it's been helping so far. We'll continue to do that.

Screwing players over based on a feeling ("we think it's been helping") is a shit move. Stop doing it until you find a way to preserve Standard players' maps. Or collect REAL EVIDENCE-BASED DATA. But stop fucking players over on "I think" bullshit.

-Z

"

sofocle10000 wrote:

May I remind you that I was talking about Standard, and my proposed solution would actually apply the "latest league map tab" rule to Standard too, due to Atlas shuffling every 3 months.

Obviously we are talking about standard, because leagues will never have the issue of legacy maps at all (until GGG would decide to shuffle the atlas while a league is running...)

"

ALL "latest league" map tabs should come with a "convert all" button

But ('my') never-league affected regular map tab in standard may also hold old series maps, and there is no way to change this or move the maps into a 'league' map tab (because these will always be remove-only in perma)

Looking over the history of the game, decisions made, and the general dumpster mentality that GGG has shown since at least the end of Ambush, I'm quickly going from apathetic, to bitter about the chances that they are actually going to do anything about it.

They'll give us plenty of lip service, and they'll give us plenty of "We're working on it", while they continuously kick the solution down the line, because they just don't care about Standard enough to care, and Standard players have (for the most part), been the most stable portion of their business model.

From what I've been seeing, in talking with people in standard, most of us Standard players are "veteran" players, who have been around for a while. We may come and go for times, but a lot of us have been around in some way shape or form since Open Beta, or early on.

We seem to be the "always there" players, and so far, none of the mistakes they have made in dealing with Standard have made much of a difference.

With that being said, the only way that we are going to affect change on this, is to either walk away from the game, or simply stop spending money.

I've been playing in Synthesis, just because I'm mad enough about losing the progress AGAIN, that I just haven't wanted to even bother trying to fix it, again. Synthesis has been "Ok", but the league itself is pretty lackluster, and I'm beginning to long for Standard, my stash, and my characters.

I'm going to give it a little longer, and see if I can make a game of it in Maps, and maybe end up with enough baubles from Synthesis to come back to standard at the end of the league and make some bank. I'm not sure if it will happen (staying), but the desire to kill finally kill shaper is muted by my frustration with the state of the league that I play.

Which sucks. I'm not giving them anymore money for a while, but I'm also trying to derive some joy out of playing the game right now.

"

Mr_Cee wrote:

Spoiler

"

sofocle10000 wrote:

May I remind you that I was talking about Standard, and my proposed solution would actually apply the "latest league map tab" rule to Standard too, due to Atlas shuffling every 3 months.

Obviously we are talking about standard, because leagues will never have the issue of legacy maps at all (until GGG would decide to shuffle the atlas while a league is running...)

"

ALL "latest league" map tabs should come with a "convert all" button

But ('my') never-league affected regular map tab in standard may also hold old series maps, and there is no way to change this or move the maps into a 'league' map tab (because these will always be remove-only in perma)

Well, having the button to "convert all" on those remove only tabs, could make it easy to convert all legacy maps in it to current version equivalents.

But that aspect relies on TencentGGG granting that functionality mainly to the current edition related map tab, as I don't think they would "go the distance" and add it to all the legacy editions - albeit that would solve some other problems too.

They've changed the value of maps. Players haven't accepted that yet. Once players realize that maps have an expiration date on them now, this problem will pretty much vanish. Hoarding maps no longer makes sense, so the tab you think you value has become less valuable.

It's a dick move, but the players can respond to it by adapting their value system. Throw out the old maps. They're not worth keeping. Keep a few for nostalgia. But time to dump the idea that your hoard is worth something.

"

Shagsbeard wrote:

They've changed the value of maps. Players haven't accepted that yet. Once players realize that maps have an expiration date on them now, this problem will pretty much vanish. Hoarding maps no longer makes sense, so the tab you think you value has become less valuable.

It's a dick move, but the players can respond to it by adapting their value system. Throw out the old maps. They're not worth keeping. Keep a few for nostalgia. But time to dump the idea that your hoard is worth something.

With sextants scarabs and all the map specific master spawning maps now have more signifigance and value. You are wrong sir. Thats why this is a fucked up situation for ggg to put us in

Have all the versions of the atlas in standard league.

"

Shagsbeard wrote:

They've changed the value of maps. Players haven't accepted that yet. Once players realize that maps have an expiration date on them now, this problem will pretty much vanish. Hoarding maps no longer makes sense, so the tab you think you value has become less valuable.

It's a dick move, but the players can respond to it by adapting their value system. Throw out the old maps. They're not worth keeping. Keep a few for nostalgia. But time to dump the idea that your hoard is worth something.

The situation is so bungled that even the process of throwing out old maps (I guess you mean vending for 3:1 returns) is incredibly time consuming and inconvenient. Items with an “expiration date” shouldn’t require so much manual maintenance from us; at the very least this is a QoL crisis.

But even if what you’re saying is correct, my feedback would instead be “don’t devalue such essential items on Standard as that runs counter to our reasons for playing Standard and therefore makes some % of players more likely to quit your game.” Which is a legitimate argument.

"

demon9675 wrote:

"

Shagsbeard wrote:

They've changed the value of maps. Players haven't accepted that yet. Once players realize that maps have an expiration date on them now, this problem will pretty much vanish. Hoarding maps no longer makes sense, so the tab you think you value has become less valuable.

It's a dick move, but the players can respond to it by adapting their value system. Throw out the old maps. They're not worth keeping. Keep a few for nostalgia. But time to dump the idea that your hoard is worth something.

The situation is so bungled that even the process of throwing out old maps (I guess you mean vending for 3:1 returns) is incredibly time consuming and inconvenient. Items with an “expiration date” shouldn’t require so much manual maintenance from us; at the very least this is a QoL crisis.

But even if what you’re saying is correct, my feedback would instead be “don’t devalue such essential items on Standard as that runs counter to our reasons for playing Standard and therefore makes some % of players more likely to quit your game.” Which is a legitimate argument.

you think im going to vendor t13 - t15 maps you are fucking crazy
yes you can sell for current atlas maps but at a huge loss
not viable and your guardian maps are basically just free fragments no longer able to be used to gain u uber elder
its just dumb so uber elder farming is now dead unless you wanna rebuy guardians after every league just to waste any leftover after 3 months

"

RitualMurder wrote:

"

demon9675 wrote:

"

Shagsbeard wrote:

They've changed the value of maps. Players haven't accepted that yet. Once players realize that maps have an expiration date on them now, this problem will pretty much vanish. Hoarding maps no longer makes sense, so the tab you think you value has become less valuable.

It's a dick move, but the players can respond to it by adapting their value system. Throw out the old maps. They're not worth keeping. Keep a few for nostalgia. But time to dump the idea that your hoard is worth something.

The situation is so bungled that even the process of throwing out old maps (I guess you mean vending for 3:1 returns) is incredibly time consuming and inconvenient. Items with an “expiration date” shouldn’t require so much manual maintenance from us; at the very least this is a QoL crisis.

But even if what you’re saying is correct, my feedback would instead be “don’t devalue such essential items on Standard as that runs counter to our reasons for playing Standard and therefore makes some % of players more likely to quit your game.” Which is a legitimate argument.

you think im going to vendor t13 - t15 maps you are fucking crazy
yes you can sell for current atlas maps but at a huge loss
not viable and your guardian maps are basically just free fragments no longer able to be used to gain u uber elder
its just dumb so uber elder farming is now dead unless you wanna rebuy guardians after every league just to waste any leftover after 3 months

The other factor is finding free space to hold the new maps until the map series can be changed on the map tab. Last time around I had find ~6 free tabs worth of space and that was after losing two thirds of my maps. Now I'm expected to do the whole thing again. This time, however, I can't (not enough free space) and I won't (it's just bollocks)