Ways to balance low-life shavronnes builds and daggerers/wanders

"

Are you fucking serious? It's like playing a deck in MtG and finding some combination that basically cannot lose.

Excellent work comparing a competitive game to a ARPG gear grinder. As I said, you have literally not clue what youre talking about.

"

You aren't supposed to be able to faceroll PoE. The game was designed specifically to avoid that.

Guess I missed that memo when I purchased supporter packs. The idea of the game never was to end up being weak in end game, it was to make it challenging to finish your builds. And if I am required to invest a shit ton of time (read: hundreds of hours) into a character for it to be remotely powerful then I would say that this goal has been achieved.

"

ARPG's are very competitive by nature, mostly economically.

This delusion is unreal. Theres literally no competitive aspect to this game outside of races. There never was or will be. A bidding war could be considered competitive by nature, but not in the way people try to change a game.

The equation is simple
You dont like something -> you dont play it -> if its strong many others play it -> your shit gets cheaper automatically putting you in a better position while the others fight over gear

You like something -> you play it -> if its strong many others play it -> you have to pay more which automatically means you would want to nerf the build you want to play yourself for it to not be worth it anymore, which makes no sense. Ergo, you only want to nerf the build to change something and fuck over others, not because you have an actual reason to do so unless youre autistic and think perfect balance is something worth achieving.

So basically the only people who are (economically) fucked by broken builds are the people who want to play broken builds. Big fucking deal.

You're simply wrong/misguided. Sorry.

You have outdated knowledge of the meta, you mistake ppl like me who have been playing this game for years as "noobs" and write them off like nothing.

You even compared to CoE builds to fucking kripps old Kaom/FP build in terms of examples of "power builds"

Misguided to the max.

If you don't even understand the competitive nature of the economy in PoE, then you have likely never even HAD a strong build, and thus, why the fuck are you even commenting?

Gotta love that lack of experience speaking up.

"

Veruski wrote:

You're simply wrong/misguided. Sorry.

You have outdated knowledge of the meta, you mistake ppl like me who have been playing this game for years as "noobs" and write them off like nothing.

You even compared to CoE builds to fucking kripps old Kaom/FP build in terms of examples of "power builds"

Misguided to the max.

And you have literally no argument apart from comparing a competitive card game in which balance directly influences everyones experience to a PVE gear grinder in which is doesnt.

No wonder I cant take you serious. Thats like comparing Sims to Quake.

"

then you have likely never even HAD a strong build

Unfortunately for you I had plenty of LL Shavronnes builds in former HC leagues. You can search my history for finding the threads, I even created multiple guides. I just delete all my dead characters.

Yeah, it's not like the balance of philosophy of PoE wasn't modeled after MtG or anything.

Way to exposure your ignorance of PoE.

Go play the build, like many people in this thread have.

THEN you can discuss it with us, from a position of experience, rather than ignorance.

"

nynyny wrote:

I had plenty of LL Shavronnes builds in former HC leagues.

And we're trying to get it through your head that the CoE builds are on an entire different tier of effectiveness, and far more generic in their application ("works with any attack!")

It's pretty simple.

The main fun of PoE is build diversity and making several builds. When something is vastly better than every other choice that fun is removed and diversity gets limited.

It's currently the case at the highest wealth levels. It's honestly the most unbalanced a build has ever been by a wide range. Lowlife spork, closed beta lightning arrow, old cleave.. all don't even come close.

You still dont get that the general situation is the exact same as it always has been. There always were builds that trivialized content. They might not be strong anymore, but thats exactly what I am criticizing. If you think that BoR ST, LL Spork or FP, Kaoms FP or many other builds didnt make endgame a joke you have no clue what youre talking about.

It doesnt matter if a build ends up being even stronger or just on par, its about the general idea. The goal of this game is to be powerful, and the road to becoming powerful is rough. So nerfing builds as soon as the person arrived simply makes no fucking sense.

But I would like you to elaborate on the competitiveness of this game, especially how powerful builds influence it so you cant have fun playing it anymore. Because all youve spouted until now is competitive economy competitive economy competitive economy mum competitive economy without actually telling me in what way this influences you.

I already explained that a build being powerful AND popular only results you in you having to pay less for every other piece of item that doesnt have a connection to the build. So why dont you go ahead and finally enlighten me how such a build cripples you in any way.

"

The main fun of PoE is build diversity and making several builds. When something is vastly better than every other choice that fun is removed and diversity gets limited.

Which is the same bullshit that was wrong a year ago. Youre not forced to run something, hell if you decide against it you probably even end up saving currency. Something being more efficient doesnt mean that you have to play it, you simply choose to because you cant think of anything else yourself.

"

It's currently the case at the highest wealth levels

Which shouldnt even bother you unless your goal is to stack currency to sell it off for RM. You can and always were able to comfortably clear content in a reasonable amount of time with a lot of skill. X being better than Y doesnt mean that you cant run Y anymore, it simply means that X clears faster and might generate more loot but especially in the longrun its irrelevant because it will only skyrocket the item costs of the items you need for X but due to faster farming speed there will be more items for builds like Y which decreases their cost.

It has always been like that.

"

If you think that BoR ST, LL Spork or FP, Kaoms FP or many other builds didnt make endgame a joke you have no clue what youre talking about.

All your listed builds minus LL spork are currently stronger than they have ever been. Many builds can do endgame competently, that doesn't mean they're overpowered.

You don't seem to have a grasp of how vastly better CoE + shavs is compared to all your examples. Some of your examples were never toptier to begin with.

For example kaom FP. The damage output of a CoE + shav build can reach 20 times that.

"

nynyny wrote:

You still dont get that the general situation is the exact same as it always has been. There always were builds that trivialized content.

No. Not to this degree.

"

nynyny wrote:

They might not be strong anymore

It doesn't matter. You could un-nerf those builds, and compare them to the modern CoE situation and it would be a laughable comparison.

"

nynyny wrote:

If you think that BoR ST, LL Spork or FP, Kaoms FP or many other builds didnt make endgame a joke you have no clue what youre talking about.

I think you are the one who is exposing a massive amount of ignorance by even thinking to compare those builds to the ones under discussion in this thread.

Seriously. Just stop. It's kind of embarrassing to read.

"

nynyny wrote:

The goal of this game is to be powerful, and the road to becoming powerful is rough. So nerfing builds as soon as the person arrived simply makes no fucking sense.

How fucking powerful do you need to be?

How about a build where just load the map, press 1 button, and everything in the whole map instantly dies? Then you are free to just go around and collect the loot?

Would that satisfy you? That seems to be what you want out of PoE.

You just seem to have no concept for how stupidly OP the builds we're talking about are.

"

Some of your examples were never toptier to begin with.

Go ahead and enlighten me which one. Because saying that X build never was top tier because Y kills shit faster in the current version is probably the dumbest shit I have read until now.

The build trivialized content back then, so its on the same level as CoE/ST. It doesnt matter if the build deals more damage, the outcome is whats important. Every single one of them entire leagues. Do you think that happened because they were shit?

"

nynyny wrote:

so its on the same level as CoE/ST

No.