"GGG considers it impossible for melee to reach t15 "

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Legatus1982 wrote:

I can see you're used to standard league EHP values but you need to understand how temp leagues play.

I played Prophecy, was plenty of time to understand leagues. Attack elsewhere, thanks.

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Legatus1982 wrote:

Also, neither of your characters have anything resembling 13k life or ES as far as I can see, so IDK what you're even going on about.

And you don't play professional football, so you don't know anything about football? Idiotic argument to say my characters are not in the realm of this topic, so I don't know anything. Try again.

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Legatus1982 wrote:

Nobody gets 18-20k in temp leagues, that's not how this game works. 13k is a TON of EHP against elemental damage in a hardcore temp league.

Nobody? How wrong you are. Just look at the ladder for Essence right now. Heck, even hardcore Essence. Here's one at random I found, not even on the top page: https://www.pathofexile.com/account/view-profile/PoEDan79/characters ("DanShudaStartedWitch"). 976 ES on his VR.

So ekunholy wanted to race on the ladder in Hardcore Essence but couldn't keep up with this person who's around the same level.

If you're going to waltz into quad warband bosses who can do detonate dead, sit there and facetank, you better have something better than 13k ES. You can't argue that ekunholy was "smart" in doing that, nor that 13K is plenty for T15 end-game ladder hardcore if you plan on never dying. If you're stuck with 13k ES, you don't take risks like this.

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Legatus1982 wrote:

BTW, most people don't consider reave to be melee. It is at best pseudo-melee and at worst has better range than some casters/bows.

Sorry, it's melee. It needs to charge to get range, and I use concentrated effect on it, so even less AoE.

Just don't bother. You're arguing for the sake of arguing. If you don't agree fine, but I have no more interest in slapping down your rhetoric.

Jesus christ, another one of these trolls that want to write fucking books. Look man, it's not necessary to do a line by line response nor is it needed to even bother with every point. Pick and choose the important bits and stop wasting our fucking time.

Here's the short version of a response to that post.

1. Prophecy is not = HCP. There is a gear difference in HC vs regular leagues, please understand the point of the comment instead of getting butthurt and defensive and whining about it
2. You specifically stated that YOU would not take 12k hp into endgame, but your two characters don't have that much ES. That was the point of the comment. Furthermore life-based characters exist. Moot point even if WERE false. And odds are pretty good your characters in those temp leagues did not have 18k es, but again moot point anyways.
3. He also has a quiver instead of a shield and 64 es on his boots. But GJ finding a random guy who has a 900 es chest. If you check his tree, he has 330% es and +154 base. This amounts to roughly 2230 base ES rounded up (with items), and about 370% increase with items, which amounts to ~10480. I'll assume I missed something and say he might have 12000, but I doubt it.
So my congratulations to you on your search skills. Really top notch. Again moot point even if it were false because life based characters exist, and missing the point entirely, but well done.
4. Literally every person on this forum agrees reave is pseudo-melee, and every person who plays POE is well aware of the mechanics of reave, which is fully capable of clearing an entire map with a fully stacked reave reaching outside the screen. It's melee for the first two seconds and ranged the rest of the map. Don't act like you don't understand this.

So yes, the fact that life based characters exist and top out around 8k DOES mean I can argue 13k is an excessive ehp buffer, and you haven't even shown anyone who has more than 13k in the first place.

If there's one person on this forum arguing for the sake of arguing its you. Locating a 900 es chest to show that "people play with 18k ehp in temp leagues" when we all know they don't (and even the owner of that chest isn't even close), and knowing full well that life based characters exist, as well as calling reave melee because it has to build stacks at the start of a map? Unbelievable man. Are you even TRYING to have a serious conversation about this?

The conversation is about whether OHKO should exist or not. Maybe you could stop trolling about es values and reave's range and address the issue? WHY IS OHKO BETTER THAN CB OR FREEZE MECHANICS?

GGG, better stop developing new mechanics. Legatus says we don't need more than two mechanics for anything.

GGG is sure good at inventing mechanics that kills melee. :-v Nemesis, Bloodlines, Warbands - you name it, they have something nasty.

There are some anti-range mechanics, like Far Shot, or Piety shooting Balls of Whirling Death, if you don't stand next to her, but this is too few and between. :-p

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Legatus1982 wrote:

[...]and missing the point entirely[...]

You sure know something about it, I'll give you that.

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Perq wrote:

GGG is sure good at inventing mechanics that kills melee. :-v Nemesis, Bloodlines, Warbands - you name it, they have something nasty.

Well its not just anti melee, it's anti everybody ... but ranged have it much more easily ( volatile in a closed space on a contact mob can easily hit a range, even tho it's more easily avoidable, as an example ).

But I agree that most of the dangerous mechanics are much more unforgiving to melee characters, without a doubt.

I blame the people that said that Vaal was the best fight in the game.

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Fruz wrote:

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Legatus1982 wrote:

[...]and missing the point entirely[...]

You sure know something about it, I'll give you that.

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Perq wrote:

GGG is sure good at inventing mechanics that kills melee. :-v Nemesis, Bloodlines, Warbands - you name it, they have something nasty.

Well its not just anti melee, it's anti everybody ... but ranged have it much more easily ( volatile in a closed space on a contact mob can easily hit a range, even tho it's more easily avoidable, as an example ).

But I agree that most of the dangerous mechanics are much more unforgiving to melee characters, without a doubt.

Lets add to the fact that some anti-melee mechanics are pretty much impossible to do, without taking damage (taking damage = playing it wrong). There are no anti-ranged mechanics that require you to do so.
Yeah, you can sit all day saying that melee can use totems and all that jazz, but why does exactly melee has to have some extra mechanics, while ranged has none of it? (or maybe I'm missing something here - maybe there is wrong-by-default mechanic for ranged, too)

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ScrotieMcB wrote:

GGG, better stop developing new mechanics. Legatus says we don't need more than two mechanics for anything.

LOL!

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ScrotieMcB wrote:

GGG, better stop developing new mechanics. Legatus says we don't need more than two mechanics for anything.

Ok so basically you know you have no logical basis for your argument so you have resorted to making things up for personal attacks

Why you people are incapable of admitting you are wrong I have no idea.

An actually intelligent quote for consideration:

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Boem wrote:

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HoloPaladin wrote:

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Instant recovery mechanics needs a complete overhaul.

only after overhaul of oneshots mechanics.

They both go hand in hand, how some of you people don't comprehend this is beyond my comprehension.

Yes, damage needs to be lowered and yes they can't do that with instant recovery methods present in the current game design.

I wan't that feeling of pissing my pants for 5 seconds in a boss fight, rather then for 0,0001 seconds.

And i wan't to feel defeated when i see that "resurrect" screen.

Instead of just throwing my hands in the air \o/ going "eh, ok"

Peace,

-Boem-

This isn't rocket fucking science people.

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Legatus1982 wrote:

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ScrotieMcB wrote:

GGG, better stop developing new mechanics. Legatus says we don't need more than two mechanics for anything.

Ok so basically you know you have no logical basis for your argument so you have resorted to making things up for personal attacks

I do have a basis, but spelling it out would kill the humor.

Fuck it. You're asking how OHKOs are a better mechanic than, say, freezes. I'll say right now, I think freeze is a pretty righteous mechanic. But it's really irrelevant, because we're not comparing freeze and OHKOs directly. We're comparing a game using a smaller variety of mechanics to create dangerous situations, versus a game using a larger variety (ex: OHKO and freeze).

So, to take your argument to its logical conclusion, new mechanics can't be added for variety unless each is individually better than a mechanic we have now. Hence joke.