Player damage is out of control. POWER CREEPER
" Another thread for the buzz of it? i'm not the one making the buzz, you guys are, because you feel concerned in a way or another. I never asked for nerfs myself, i even havent asked for challenging content for thoses "godlikes" characters that can carelessly faceroll everything, as you suggest. I was just crying about the actual powercreep. The problem is not the available power but the power available against the content available! After two hours of facerolling maps and bosses, what's left? Oh well it has been fun, now imma try something else! We optimized for 100 hours to reach the maximum out of something, for 2 hours worth of gameplay : YEAAH MY CREATION WORKS BUT I CANT USE IT AGAINST MEANINGFULL CONTENT ! POWERCREEP----------------------------------------------------------> (gazillion dps) Content-----------------> oneshot ability---------------> ( you dont need gazillion dps to OS packs and rape bosses) Fun-------------------------------> ( it stops shortly after the oneshot ability) In D2, it was ultra easy to kill bosses in merciless, and ultra easy to MF farm, the only challenging content was the uber tristram with all the bosses at once and only few builds could do them easy peasy ( hello smiter!). It was already a bad balance. But the "endgame" was so meaningless from the start that it didnt matter, there was no content after merciless after all,only some few additions to keep the addicteds. In PoE, it's very different, MF is a noob trap, the farm is slower, the endgame is "meaningfull" (maps, masters, atziri, challenges etc), a lot of builds can destroy the endgame content ( come on, far more than 10, closer than 50, 100+ if we include variation of gear/tree and skill gem) - yes i pull out thoses numbers out of my ass. So yeah, Powercreep vs content is a problem since 2.0 and becomes more evident with ascendancy 8 points. It will not ruin the game, it makes it too fast and less enjoyable in my opinion. I kill Uber izaro within 1-2 seconds and abyss kaom within 3 seconds max. It's fun the first time, but we cannot call it challenging. Is it my fault to play a very powerfull build - that is not maintstream nor considered op? i dont think. It's just the powarcreep for ya. So i could shoot an arrow in my knee.... but it's stupid, right? Come on, my max dps was less than 500 000 before ascendancy, i sit now between a minimum of 5M to a max of 20M (480 DPS TWO HAND SWORD) and i could get 35 M with a mirrored 2H exquisite blade I will never be good but always I try to improve. Last edited by Geisalt on Jun 21, 2016, 7:48:52 AM
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I agree with pretty much everything OP said.
Core problem is though, damage balance is just so poorly done in this game. Your build doesn't matter. 7-8k Life, capped resists & armor reduction, max block. Or 3-4k Life glasscannon. Both build will occasionally get oneshot. |
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" Good stuff here they should hire you. Yeah was 30% on the melee classes. And they are doing that here with ascendancy. Juggs for example can get full EC like 8-9 pretty easy and thats over 30% phys reduction. Then his fortify is better than anyone elses. Ascendancy stuff is great. One of the good moves they made since i been here. They still need to tone shit down until they hire you. Power creep is real and really boring. Like god mode hack up to 14 maps with most builds these days. Git R Dun! Last edited by Aim_Deep on Jun 21, 2016, 8:13:29 AM
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Spoiler
" To be honest: sorry. I realised pretty soon that i accused you of something you did not do. My bad. I missed the topic of powercreep a bit i would say ;) Maybe i was triggered by the "hardcore-noob" shit i quoted. The buzz was not on you. But still i believe that all the problems come from one thing: This game cannot be balanced around the same concepts as other arpg. Just because tree, ascendancy classes, skill- and gearsystem and so on are so diverse that there is only one way imo to solve this "problem": Give us more challenges. True challenges. Handmade and focussed on the actual game. I hate that english is not my mothertongue. I could describe way better what i mean if it would be ... To say it this way: In it's actual state, this game is designed around nothing but a motto or a philosophy, that's how i see it. Something like "POE is meant to be this and that way and so we do it like this". But the game has changed. People like mathil (the pros, let's leave it with that) are pushing the game to it's limits constantly in terms of "what is possible". People like me (the casuals) are pushing it constantly in terms of "what is necessary". A philosophy is necessary. But at some point not only the players havge to adapt to a game. The game has to adapt to it's players. Take the lab for example. As an implementation for more game-content it is okay or even great (i mean, it's for free!). But as soon as it got to become a philosophy ("That's how we roll!") it became dangerous. It forced the players (possible / necessary) to adapt to it without adapting to them. If this makes any sense at all xD @aim: Thanks! I also think that ascendancy stuff is great. But things like your example still force people to chose certain paths to achieve what in my opinion should be a general thing: Give damage reduction to melee skills. It would be cool, i think. Imagine a general "less damage taken" earthquake marauder combined with the Juggernaut perk! ;) Damn. Tuff topic. The Sirus fight is a disgrace. Last edited by ghamadvar on Jun 21, 2016, 8:18:15 AM
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thank for your understanding :3
I dont hope that they will change the game, at this point they will not nerf us and they will noooot change the balance midgame because it's actually quite balanced ( ACT 4 damage is still sometimes overtuned) Thoo we have, compared to the end game content, too many multiplicative options for our damage leading to a pack oneshot fest, it's a fact. GGG tried to counter that by making the labyrinth, it doesnt require a lot of dps, it has a lot of strategy and has a difficulty that "should" be always the same for every character, they failed completely but it was the main idea behind it, i guess. I dislike the lab but i approve the idea behind it. Now, path of exile has two choices: To create new map tier and multiply the monster's hp by 30 and grants more exp per mobs with more interesting rolls on rares items( higher ILVL items or more chance to get good ILVL affixes) and more currency per time spent. We kill slower, so we potentially take more damage; so we have a sense of accomplishment and a challenge. Bosses dont need to oneshot us, they will take more time. Or include a fast run system. If we clean the map extremely fast, we get a reward. A map, a currency, a card.... something that is RNG and motivating to keep rushing thoses maps at the speed of the light. With differents reward depending of the time spent in the map. an example for gorge Under 1:30 : a RNG card that could drop in the map itself Under 2:10 : a map one tier lower than the map used Under 2:40 : a little currency ( fusing, chaos, 3 jews...) ( thoses number should be balanced with the type of map and layout) Depending of the number of affixes on the map, the lime left to gain a reward is increased. 15 seconds per affix. With 6 affixes, 90 seconds ( with temp chain even the timer goes slower) OF course, when we die we lose a lot of time. This way, we have a goal, a reward, a challenge. The powercreep becomes usefull and we have a pressure, something to achieve. OR a mix of both is cool too. I will never be good but always I try to improve.
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Hm. A speed-reward could be a cool idea! But what about:
You have let's say 5 counters: Damage dealt / Damage taken / Time / Mobs left / Mods on map (counts double?) And you could add things like Boss time / flasks used / portals used and stuff. There are 6 grades in every categorie. A stands for the best, F stands for the worst result. Then there are different rewards for each categorie. In different tiers. Every categorie has different types of rewards. For damage dealt there can be rare diamond rings, rustic sashes and stuff. For damage taken there can be things like leather belts, resist rings and so on. Just examples, this has to be thought out very well. Now: If you reach A in DD, C in DT, A in T and A in ML with C in MoM you get 5 rewards. Tier A, Tier C, Tier A, Tier A, Tier C. I know that the problem at the moment is that high damage means high chances in all 5 categories, but this can be tuned or adapted. I would love something like this. Or maybe just one general rank by addition of each result and dividing it by 5 or 6? And then you have a loot table where you can chose your reward? If A to F does not do it, one could call it "race of the everthirsty souls" or some fluff shit. If this is designed well enough it could give some new incentives. Or is this nonsense? ;) The Sirus fight is a disgrace.
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"Because i love sweeping up currency like a vacuum and seeing people panic and die because of it lmao. Oh the good days where an exalt would drop and people would freak out on short allocation and die while vuln'd by a titty bitch pack. In all seriousness that shit was a blast, probably some of the most hilarious things ive seen happen, happened back then. You dont get that kind of entertainment anymore. Harvest sucks! But look at my decked out gear two weeks in!
Labyrinth salt farm miner. "But my build diversity" , "Game is too hard!" - Meta drone playing the same 1-3 builds for years. |
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I am actually fine with the current monster life... they do need a serious puff into their damage, sparkers+other casters are a good start
e: exiles/bosses should have like x10 amount of life and double damage d:-D* Last edited by PyleWarlord on Jun 21, 2016, 10:44:21 AM
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i understand your point, however it's more suited to a MOBA or STR or mmorpg gameplay than PoE
As you said, only kill speed matters and requires too many changes in the gameplay to use damage taken counter or tankability medal sysem... Differents grades or medals, why not, but they will all refer to the way of killing. In labyrinth it's another story and we could use your system. However i think it requires too much work, a lot of codings :/ for an inefficient system in the end: ppls will rush the maps and get reward for rushing stuff faster and faster. so let's attack the core of the problem: powercreep and fastrun system directly! I will never be good but always I try to improve.
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" yeah damage done by monster is already high, they just do not have the time to hit. SO if we give them more hp, first they will have time to attack and second they will not be stunned ALL THE TIME, so they can attack even more! Some bosses require more life, true but i do not believe that we should increase the difficulty of low tier maps... We need higher tier maps like Gorge, crematorium, excavation, abyss... but wih boosted HP. Or something else. " I will never be good but always I try to improve. Last edited by Geisalt on Jun 21, 2016, 11:41:31 AM
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