What the Hell Happened to Gamers?

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Been gaming since pong, gamers are still the same across the board, just more of them that's all.

I would say there is a bit of a difference.

We oldschool gamer are used to be more patient and to enjoy seasonal games for almost the full lenghth of 3-4 months and have challanging gameplay thoughout the whole period.

The younger generation of gamer is way more impatient and want to zoom zoom finish everything a game and the league has to offer within 1-2 weeks....idealy with 0 effort farming & difficulty vise.

I don't know why gamer nowdays can't enjoy games that offer a little bit of a challange and instantly freak out if it does....very interesting to watch, I bet they're holding theyr breath at home till they get what they want. ^^

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Stryfer#0953 wrote:

I agree with a lot of what OP said. It's similar to what I alluded to in my thread about comparing this to Diablo 2, though I leaned more into illustrating how the genre changed and suggested players think about what they really want from it today.

The fact is, we are in a place where ARPGs have split across two different design philosophies: loot farming dopamine versus overcoming a challenge dopamine. It's remarkable just how polarizing these two sides are in the community.

This is at the core of the issue. GGG is trying to merge two genres of gameplay that are on opposite ends of the spectrum. They are really not similar at all, and the issue is that if you did a Venn diagram of Loot ARPG (with depth) and Souls like ARPG (with random loot) the intersection of those two groups is very very small. And GGG is starting to see that. Ultimately they will need to choose one path or the other.

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johnnysd#1172 wrote:

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Stryfer#0953 wrote:

I agree with a lot of what OP said. It's similar to what I alluded to in my thread about comparing this to Diablo 2, though I leaned more into illustrating how the genre changed and suggested players think about what they really want from it today.

The fact is, we are in a place where ARPGs have split across two different design philosophies: loot farming dopamine versus overcoming a challenge dopamine. It's remarkable just how polarizing these two sides are in the community.

This is at the core of the issue. GGG is trying to merge two genres of gameplay that are on opposite ends of the spectrum. They are really not similar at all, and the issue is that if you did a Venn diagram of Loot ARPG (with depth) and Souls like ARPG (with random loot) the intersection of those two groups is very very small. And GGG is starting to see that. Ultimately they will need to choose one path or the other.

Don't think so at all.

I think if the community supported them, and gave them good feedback. They could totally pull a generational game out of their ass.

Just like they did with PoE 1, superseding Diablo 1/2 ARPG style games.

I've seen some game combinations that on paper, seem like they wouldn't work at all, but are actually incredibly fun. It all comes down to the passion of the developers, and the support they get. Just look at what Palworld did recently. Balatro. A roguelike poker game.

Stop saying it can't be done. It totally 1000% can. But it won't happen if the viewpoint everyone has is that it's impossible.

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Gkek#1581 wrote:

I'm not saying HCSSF shouldn't exist, but we don't want a Ruthless/HCSSF based game. I would rather jam a live cactus into my rectum than play that, and 99% of players agree lol

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Trade for people who just want to gear up burn the game and move on.
SSF for those who enjoy the loot hunt and craft.
Hardcore for those who like to nail their foreskin to the wall.

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Glowie_Zigger#5018 wrote:

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chobo999#2010 wrote:

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Glowie_Zigger#5018 wrote:

Are live cactus pointier or less pointy than dead ones?

Sorry, but... what? Point pls?

Someone was talking about penetrating themselves and specified that they did not want the object to be a live cactus

Rmbr my Point earlier about Filtering?

Well...add "speed-reading" too... lol ;)

Excellent contribution here. It's still EA and a balance in difficult, yet fulfilling content is still in the process of being sought out. Slower paced, strategic combat while not being inundated with gratuitous amounts of trivialized loot is the vision and no amount of ingrates yelling for something different online should change that. Honest, objective criticism is warranted but finding the appropriate balance takes time and not making decisions on impulse against the sea of bloviating about the difficulty is paramount to finding an identity so I'm happy to see that isn't occurring.

This is shaping up to be a masterpiece and I'm so grateful for it. Stay the course, GGG.

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Defalto#9237 wrote:

Excellent contribution here. It's still EA and a balance in difficult, yet fulfilling content is still in the process of being sought out. Slower paced, strategic combat while not being inundated with gratuitous amounts of trivialized loot is the vision and no amount of ingrates yelling for something different online should change that. Honest, objective criticism is warranted but finding the appropriate balance takes time and not making decisions on impulse against the sea of bloviating about the difficulty is paramount to finding an identity so I'm happy to see that isn't occurring.

This is shaping up to be a masterpiece and I'm so grateful for it. Stay the course, GGG.

Perfectly explained....we can see in Diablo 4 what happens if devs make impulsive decisions when a loud minority screams for more and more power creep.

You can practicaly faceroll all content after a very short time doing 174 quadrupillions DMG with LMB only on avarage gear. ^^

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Akedomo#3573 wrote:

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johnnysd#1172 wrote:

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Stryfer#0953 wrote:

I agree with a lot of what OP said. It's similar to what I alluded to in my thread about comparing this to Diablo 2, though I leaned more into illustrating how the genre changed and suggested players think about what they really want from it today.

The fact is, we are in a place where ARPGs have split across two different design philosophies: loot farming dopamine versus overcoming a challenge dopamine. It's remarkable just how polarizing these two sides are in the community.

This is at the core of the issue. GGG is trying to merge two genres of gameplay that are on opposite ends of the spectrum. They are really not similar at all, and the issue is that if you did a Venn diagram of Loot ARPG (with depth) and Souls like ARPG (with random loot) the intersection of those two groups is very very small. And GGG is starting to see that. Ultimately they will need to choose one path or the other.

Don't think so at all.

I think if the community supported them, and gave them good feedback. They could totally pull a generational game out of their ass.

Just like they did with PoE 1, superseding Diablo 1/2 ARPG style games.

I've seen some game combinations that on paper, seem like they wouldn't work at all, but are actually incredibly fun. It all comes down to the passion of the developers, and the support they get. Just look at what Palworld did recently. Balatro. A roguelike poker game.

Stop saying it can't be done. It totally 1000% can. But it won't happen if the viewpoint everyone has is that it's impossible.

I did not say it could not be done. I said the interesection of people that would want this combination is very small and I stand by that.

But the issue is not really difficulty or pacing or even loot itself. The issue is determinism and control. What makes POE1 great is that for every hurdle there is a tool. Sigog did a great video on this. If I find an item that is very good but it is lacking in some detail there are many ways to address to it from the crafting bench, to the skill tree, to the crafting currency to being able to deterministically get a specific supplemental item.

POE2 has none of that. Add the tools to let players figure a path to solve an issue and the game will be successful. Right now it has literally none of that.

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CroDanZ#1818 wrote:

I just hope they don't listen to all the complainers who practicaly want to 1-tap all content the game has to offer after 2 days into a new league by playing broken builds, idealy with potato gear.

Had an area bossfight now with a whisp on the boss.....Best 4-5 minutes I've ever had in any ARPG for more than 2 decades now, super fun and thrilling fight.

Ofc it took me around 1 minute to see and learn the boss patterns in combination with whisp abilities but once you know the sequence it's easy to beat such encounter (just don't be to greedy, attacking in the wrong moment can casue a death)...I simply love it, no boring 1-tap playstyle and actuall fights vs bosses who deserve the wording "boss". :)

This is the experience I’m looking for.

GGG just needs to strike a balance between “brain off 1 shot everything” and “HCSSF spend 10 minutes on one campaign boss” gameplay.