The Palpable and Uninformed Hate and Dismissal of POE1 Veterans Sounding the Alarm is Worrying

Dash you get in POE2 = limitless no cd dodge roll
Dash you get in POE1R = cooldown dodge

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Querker#1809 wrote:

Both become used at best once every 15 seconds at lategame.

Dodging the comparison (not surprising this will repeat a lot in your points)

What? You use dodge roll way more than once every 15 seconds. ESPECIALLY in mapping.

And that doesnt mean anything either. Theres no cd on one, and there is a clear cd on the other.


Vendors in POE2 = get +1 skills on the first vendor and rares
Vendors in POE1R = Get you nothing as you cant even afford anything from them with your limited currency. No rares no + gems

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Querker#1809 wrote:

Adding more numbers doesnt change that you still use vendors to progress. Two systems have a bit of a different scaling, but result is the same.

Yes it does. Adding more numbers means everything as you GO BACK even at level 80+ to the vendors to buy from them. Items from vendors in POE2 have... a magnitude of difference of more weight to your character than items from vendors in POE1 much less Ruthless where you cant even afford them or dont want to as they are horrific items.

Gems in POE2 = you have them all before you are even halfway through the campaign
Gems in POE1R = you have to RNG drop what you want or work with what you have

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Querker#1809 wrote:

You can simly buy all required gems from trade site so with such huge trading playerbase that would never have been a problem in po2 if gem remained the same.

You cant buy all the required gems during ... or even half way into mapping in POE1R. You wont even have the sockets much less the currency for them.


POE2: Flasks are just health and mana
POE1R: Flasks are Utility, health and mana

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Querker#1809 wrote:

Renaming flask to charm doesnt change its function. Yep, ots not giving me 40% damage, but flasks in poe 2 are so rarely fully charged that you always consider keeping them primed for certain ailments rather than used constantly.

Utility flasks in POE1 dont just remove ailments they also buff your character. They function nothing alike to charms. Charms only function is flask enchantments you can give them and removing an ailment. Not giving you more projectiles, or more max res, or more armour/evasion, phasing, etc...

Charms in POE2 and utility flasks in POE1 are nothing alike.



POE2: Ascendancies arent weaker versions of some basetype ascendancy in the game
POE1R: Ascendancies are weaker versions of the base game

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Querker#1809 wrote:

Doesnt change the fact that theyre both weak, no?

Ascendancies are not weak in POE2 you're trolling now.

And you are dodging(not surprising) the comparison as well. There is no baseform difference between a gamemode in POE2, its just one gamemode.

There is in POE1 and POE1R.


POE2: All currency is able to drop
POE1R: DIsabled list of currency you can find in the link above

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Querker#1809 wrote:

And thats why that currency is not in poe2, wow.

Again dodging the comparison (not surprising) and also admitting you dont know how to generate currency in POE2, which I didnt ask but ok.

POE2: All released mechanics are available
POE1R: Mechanics are disabled (pantheon, map rolling etc..)

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Querker#1809 wrote:

And thats why those mechanics are not presented in poe2, wow

Again dodging the comparison (not surprising)

There are no alternate mechanics to map rolling in POE2 there is no seperate version of POE2.

There are no disabled mechanics from a different version of POE2, there is not seperate version of POE2

There is in POE1 and POE1R


Again make sure you understand when you call something ruthless you dont pick and choose what you watch your favorite streamer do on ruthless, and then say POE2 is ruthless. It seems you dont really even know what ruthless is as a gamemode.

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Querker#1809 wrote:

no, ive bought my lvl93 occultist.

Yea thats the odd part is you have a ruthless character but seem to not know much about the mode you played and why calling POE2 or even comparing to ruthless, is inappropriate.

You are free to believe POE2 is like... or worse than ruthless I guess but then you believe I know more about ruthless than you since I have NONE of the issues you have in POE2.

But that would require staying consistent

skill? the #1 thing that boosts your character is your gear. that is why poe1 was such a miserable niche experience. if someone followed a guide and got the right gear they make it to maps and beyond.

it makes no sense that if i want to explore 7 different characters that i have to invest hundreds of hours and give up the rest of my life to do so. most of you don't seem to understand that life is short and about priorities. it's bad design to force people to level up every character especially when leagues reset and oops all my hard work is gone. especially for such a LONG campaign as in poe2. much longer than poe1. it's just horrible stupid design.\

the solution i outlines does not eliminate leveling. it just means you have to level Half of your characters rather than all of them.


The full campaign play through would still exist for half the characters.

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Querker#1809 wrote:

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IcyMistV#5121 wrote:

GGG could allow us to have a character that is leveled to L50 perhaps starting in Act 5/6 or something of that nature based on each new character that we beat the campaign with.

So if you have 2 new characters beat the campaign you end up with 2 free characters that can start at L50.

Campaign in POE is designed to set a certain amount of skill/build checks that make your character capable of entering early mapping. By removing that you effectively delete any off-meta gameplay from people who want to build a toon without third-party guidance. Its not like you can vendor some trash and go clear atlas quests, you actually need to invest resources to get to that point.

When you give an option to skip a crucial part of the game - is that the identity you want?

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Phrazz#3529 wrote:

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SlipShod69#2759 wrote:

What are you talking about "issues with the longevity of PoE 2?

If a player willing to put in hundred of hours into the game every league, can't see himself doing that because of certain design decisions, that speaks directly towards the game's longevity right from the get-go.

And some of these design decisions are so unbelievably unnecessary and inconvenient - and completely different from what we used to have. And while PoE 1 had A LOT of shortcomings, the thing PoE 1 did best of any game in the history of games (close to, at least), was making people come back for more. Every league. Also called "longevity". 10+ years and still going (somewhat) strong.

I get PoE 2 tries to make the "bad" things better, like one-button gameplay, overly zoomy gameplay and monster density so dense that it was impossible to balance. But why PoE 2 is hellbent on not holding on to what PoE 1 did great, is beyond me.

I bounced off of mapping in PoE2 in T1s. Seriously, T1s. It's just horrendous. It's boring, it's way too punishing, mechanics are awful (strongboxes, holy fuck they're bad). I have played almost every league and then some. I've been here sine 2011, playing since 2012. And I can't see myself playing PoE2 for longer than the campaign.

That should be a giant, flashing red light.

What's a PoE veteran exactly?

X streamer who has knowledge of the game but purposefully turns it into a circus for views. X streamer who's made variations on the same ED + Contagion build 20 times? Perhaps one who's consistently anti-meta, accidentally creating them. Maybe the one who consistently makes mult-mirror builds that are worse than 200 Div builds.

If you're a PoE veteran you probably know exactly which I'm talking about in that too btw.

PoE 1 was always intended to be a more hardcore version of Diablo 2 but they lost their way.
Now they have a chance to try again. Simple as that. PoE 1 was not fast or easy.

Every time they tried to make a healthy change to the game they would get review bombed.
Play PoE1 if you don't like Poe2. I for one could never go back.

The vast majority of players like POE2 how it is so it will stay this way and get better moving forward.

For everyone else; either stay at POE1, or get good. There's also D4.

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IcyMistV#5121 wrote:

skill? the #1 thing that boosts your character is your gear. that is why poe1 was such a miserable niche experience. if someone followed a guide and got the right gear they make it to maps and beyond. and just use one skill on repeat. there is no skill in that.

it makes no sense that if i want to explore 7 different characters that i have to invest hundreds of hours and give up the rest of my life to do so. most of you don't seem to understand that life is short and about priorities. it's bad design to force people to level up every character especially when leagues reset and oops all my hard work is gone. especially for such a LONG campaign as in poe2. much longer than poe1. it's just horrible stupid design. the philosophy that in order to play poe2 you need to give up every other game and your social life... that is horrible.

the solution i outlines does not eliminate leveling. it just means you have to level Half of your characters rather than all of them.


The full campaign play through would still exist for half the characters.

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Querker#1809 wrote:

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IcyMistV#5121 wrote:

GGG could allow us to have a character that is leveled to L50 perhaps starting in Act 5/6 or something of that nature based on each new character that we beat the campaign with.

So if you have 2 new characters beat the campaign you end up with 2 free characters that can start at L50.

Campaign in POE is designed to set a certain amount of skill/build checks that make your character capable of entering early mapping. By removing that you effectively delete any off-meta gameplay from people who want to build a toon without third-party guidance. Its not like you can vendor some trash and go clear atlas quests, you actually need to invest resources to get to that point.

When you give an option to skip a crucial part of the game - is that the identity you want?

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Xzorn#7046 wrote:

What's a PoE veteran exactly?

X streamer who has knowledge of the game but purposefully turns it into a circus for views. X streamer who's made variations on the same ED + Contagion build 20 times? Perhaps one who's consistently anti-meta, accidentally creating them. Maybe the one who consistently makes mult-mirror builds that are worse than 200 Div builds.

If you're a PoE veteran you probably know exactly which I'm talking about in that too btw.

PoE 1 was always intended to be a more hardcore version of Diablo 2 but they lost their way.
Now they have a chance to try again. Simple as that. PoE 1 was not fast or easy.

Every time they tried to make a healthy change to the game they would get review bombed.
Play PoE1 if you don't like Poe2. I for one could never go back.

Quiite honestly yea.

And its just gonna keep getting better too with more development time. We dont even have all the ascensions yet.

Or skills gems

Games so rudimentary right now and ALREADY people want all these massive changes to make things silly easy.

"Because its ruthless" or "Worse than ruthless"

This is why we say you just want a reskinned version of POE1 this is how it all started with people:

1) Demanding easier time.
2) Outraged when their OP build gets nerfed
3) Outright removal of mechanics that would challenge you
4) Reverse of mechanics back to POE1 (Wanting movementskills not dodge roll)

And they all floock to these posts and go "+1"

And then here they go "Aw nah we dont want POE1 reskinned we never said that"


YES YOU DID LOL ALL YOUR +1'S to these issues are telling us this.

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rifraf-_-#9478 wrote:

The vast majority of players like POE2 how it is so it will stay this way and get better moving forward.

For everyone else; either stay at POE1, or get good. There's also D4.

New account, private. The hits keep comin' and they don't stop comin and they don't stop comin.

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IcyMistV#5121 wrote:

skill? the #1 thing that boosts your character is your gear. that is why poe1 was such a miserable niche experience. if someone followed a guide and got the right gear they make it to maps and beyond.

it makes no sense that if i want to explore 7 different characters that i have to invest hundreds of hours and give up the rest of my life to do so. most of you don't seem to understand that life is short and about priorities. it's bad design to force people to level up every character especially when leagues reset and oops all my hard work is gone. especially for such a LONG campaign as in poe2. much longer than poe1. it's just horrible stupid design.\

the solution i outlines does not eliminate leveling. it just means you have to level Half of your characters rather than all of them.


The full campaign play through would still exist for half the characters.

And here we have the quintessential POE newbie. Taking up arguments tghat have been definitively settled ages ago by GGG. There will be no quick level path. Each league is a full reset and you dont get to start at 50.

This is the problem the new people bring bad ideas from other games and fail to see what thousands of hours of playtime has taught the vets. If you listened to us you would learn. And no, not everyone in POE1 follows a build guide and there are a lot more end game things in POE1 than maps. Maps are just one of many routes.

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Poe2WarriorMan#6401 wrote:

But that would require staying consistent

But if you try to put a negative perspective that if mechanic is not present in both games, but in one it was deleted - then there is no point for arguement whatsoever, no? It was removed from ruth for a reason, and that fact kept in poe2 for exactly same reason.
Idk why you even bothered coming to vendors at lvl 80, cuz trade site can offer better items at a handful of ex (isnt like poe 2 vendors limited at ilvl 60 or so? What are you expecting to get from them other than trash for artificers?)
And you definetly can afford buying any gem you want in poe1 outside of certain aura skills, empower/enlighten/enchance and awakened gems which are chase items of sort. Anything else is 1 alch and most builds suffice with it.
Ranting about getting required sockets but ignoring my post about vendors selling them is avoiding arguement either and focusing on smaller things.
Active skills are delivered in abundance through quests/siosa. Hell, people were buying second gem tabs cuz they had no place for keeping gems with little market demands.
Flasks do buff your character, but you almost never get them to work as needed cus you either solve the problem without them active as a buff or their effect simply ends faster than you believe.
As for generating currency - you know, you can simply play a game and it... drops. Just as it drops in ruthless, but now reliably with ships instead of quantity crunching.