Worst Death Penalty mechanics I've ever seen!

[/quote]Again, dying isn't the problem, it's the associated penalty.

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I don't see anything wrong with the penalty being 10% though. If you die, you just need to bring your character down a map tier/reroll certain map mods and keep farming until you hit the next level. 10% might take an hour to recover even in the mid 90's with a medium clear speed build and perhaps 10 minutes in mid 80's. The only time you would need to farm a few hours to recover 10% xp would be lvl 95+ even if you waste tons of time between maps. If you can't level up more, it just means your character is not ready for that level of content consistently yet.

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"Cramming" isn't a thing. You play the cards you're dealt, there is no trading in SSF that would max out all resistances, get me 7k+ life and 3k+ armour.

And yet there are still high level ssf players every league with insane gear comparable to trade league. Of course, it's not as easy to get, but you chose ssf on your own. And armour should not be your main focus. Life, res, life leech, life recovery rate, regen, damage reduction, etc. are better. And cramming is most definitely a thing. Every little thing counts when you add them all up. Why do you think top tier gear is so expensive? People min-max and the more you stack, the stronger it gets, especially since there are so many more multipliers in this game.

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And even if you did, that's not a sure thing against sudden, unexpected and completely out of the blue, off-screen one-hit deaths that frequently plagues this game. When one, just one of those happens, the entire "git gud" advice is shit.

Idk I don't encounter these sudden, out of the blue deaths outside of being ridiculously underleveled with uncapped res and leveling gear. When I have half geared my characters, cheap feeling deaths happens extremely rarely. When I die, it's usually because I've made some stupid mistake with my play like run into a slam or my character is simply not strong enough (in which case I would die very, very often.) I would take a look at how some of the high level hc people build their characters, since most of them utilize layers and layers of defense to make it as safe as possible.

The penalty as it stands now at 10% really isn't really that much. If filters out undergeared characters and makes higher levels mean more without making it feel completely over the top difficult and bullshit. And if you've just leveled up, you can die as much as you want without care since you'll just stay at 0% xp anyways. And the solutions you've outlined really don't fit as well as the xp penalty as it is right now.

Never myself have I been a fan of it, I can understand it being in a league but id like them to take it out of standard. But from what I hear on certain servers u can purchase points to negate the 10 percent loss. Id certainly buy more points if that were the case here on this server.

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lagwin1980 wrote:

It's fine, just because you don't like the implementation dose not mean that it is wrong.

I.E it is a tool to HURT you enough into re evaluating your build.

You clearly didn't even read his post.

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panmisiek123 wrote:

This is something GGG could learn from games like WoW. When you die it tells you what killed you.

Poison, reflect, savage strike and so on.

GGG logic : It would make the game too easy if players had more information at their disposal that could improve their gameplay!

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Vresiberba wrote:

... And even if you did, that's not a sure thing against sudden, unexpected and completely out of the blue, off-screen one-hit deaths that frequently plagues this game. When one, just one of those happens, the entire "git gud" advice is shit.

Because there is no possible way to avoid dying in this game? Playing better won't keep you alive? Putting in more effort to farm better gear before taking on greater challenges never helps?

I guess no one ever got to 100 in HC, it's all just GGG propaganda to give you hope.

Or maybe it's just too much effort for you to do these things. You are entirely the kid who came in last and really believed he deserved a trophy just like the harder working kid who took first.

You don't need to "get gud", play the way you enjoy, but if you don't then you shouldn't expect to reach the highest levels of this game. If you could do things that way then no achievement would mean anything, and the most passionate fans of this game would leave to seek their challenges elsewhere.

Remember this is a game by serious gamers for serious gamers, and it's meant to be punishing. Providing that high skill/knowledge ceiling is central to the design of the game. There are a ton of other games out there for people who want to be spoon fed victory.

All I hear in any of these posts is "I'm a whiny entitled child, and I want to have the shiny things these other people have, but I don't want to have to earn it or put in any effort for it." Not a single one of you has made any kind of convincing argument, it's all about how you want to reach higher levels while playing badly.

And before you go off using your ridiculous name calling argument and saying I'm an elitist you should understand that while there are some elitists around here I'm just a casual scrub like most players. I just believe that there should be something to achieve through skill and effort.

The death penalty in SC is perfect the way it is.

I can't help but feel a bit entertained by this thread, particularly the responses full of self-entitlement.

Instead of simply realizing that hitting max level isn't worth the effort for most people, they pursue this fruitless endeavor with overflowing passion as this injustice crushes their soul.

Every SC player has suffered the xp penalty for in-game death. Most of us just recognize why it exists. Play games where max level characters can be bought in microtransactions. You'll either acknowledge the value of players earning max level or be one of the players no one wants to play with because you thought your max level was a replacement for actually being proficient.

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Romulas19 wrote:

Never myself have I been a fan of it, I can understand it being in a league but id like them to take it out of standard. But from what I hear on certain servers u can purchase points to negate the 10 percent loss. Id certainly buy more points if that were the case here on this server.

And this is why this game is dead the moment Tencent gets the full rights.

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spoc002 wrote:

i think characters should Delevel when they die after 0%.
that would end the cast on death portal scroll tactics on endgame bosees.

I love this game and although I don't like the 10% penalty (I'd prefer 5%) I'm still having fun leveling chars above 90. But this would be the single one game change that would put me off the game indefinitely.

I mean, imagine all those mediocre players - like me - that would fall back a complete level just by trying to beat Shaper or uber Atziri? I guess I would be forced to avoid any tier 15+ boss at all. How would that be any fun?

And this has nothing to do with any form of self-entitlement. It's just that every poe player wants to experience the really fun fights, which are eventually also the hard fights in which you tend to die... a lot, at least in my case.

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beaniac wrote:

Because there is no possible way to avoid dying in this game? Playing better won't keep you alive? Putting in more effort to farm better gear before taking on greater challenges never helps?

Did you read this thread? It is not about "death penalty is bad", it is about "death penalty currently is bad, because you often don't know why you have died". I died during my first Elder fight - it is OK, because I know why. I have done over 150 T7-9 maps without any problems, but died 4 times in less than second (after going back to finish map, my life never dropped below 80%).

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beaniac wrote:

Remember this is a game by serious gamers for serious gamers, and it's meant to be punishing. Providing that high skill/knowledge ceiling is central to the design of the game. There are a ton of other games out there for people who want to be spoon fed victory.

PoE is not an eSport, so what do you mean by "serious gamers"? Difficult and punishing are two different things. Diablo 2 is difficult, PoE is punishing.
Do you know that Trescent bought GGG? It means that PoE must generate big income. Do you know what is the best source of income? Casual players with job, family and limited time. They want fun, not punishing. PoE should be more difficult, but less punishing.

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beaniac wrote:

And before you go off using your ridiculous name calling argument and saying I'm an elitist you should understand that while there are some elitists around here I'm just a casual scrub like most players. I just believe that there should be something to achieve through skill and effort.

Players have choice: leveling or fun. Playing safety is not fun in PoE and for casual players this means a few days of mapping without any challenges.

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vmt80 wrote:

So, what is the 'value of players earning max level' in PoE?

Why would a SSF player care about whether others want to play with him?

I must be playing PoE wrong, since to me it seems standard SC only exists until level 95 or so, after which everyone is forced to play HC if they want to level up. Of course, by definition it doesn't bother people who like to play HC. Strangely enough, if someone is masochistic enough for a few months and cuts out any other social activity, he can hit 100 and start playing softcore then (in other words, his prize of hitting max level is the right to finally start playing softcore, which, uh, he wished to play all along). Of course, any healthy person is burnt out long before, because it denies him the game mode he wished to play in the first place.

I think one can argue softcore players aren't supposed to hit level 100 at all. One could argue for example, that getting those last levels makes their character too strong or something, and their level cap should be placed to 95. But it is complete b'llshit to tell people a video game should be a mind-numbing chore and devoid of any satisfaction because otherwise it isn't prestigious enough. I could actually see arguments for denying SC players levels 96-100 altogether, it's the argument made that irritates me to no end.

Original HC (Diablo 1/2) - 1 Death, everything's gone, no transfer to SC, and you're needing to dual box on a separate account or grab a friend to loot your corpse.

PoE HC - 1 Death, everything moved to SC, Stash isn't linked on a character basis and HC inventory remains intact

Diablo 1/2 Ladder - Long seasons with no official end until announced at their discretion. Economy and Trade a mess between duping and even basic trading. Third party sites take advantage.

PoE League - short ladder, economies a bit more under control having a much more frequent reset. Better tools available make trade much more accessible while still remaining inconvenient enough to help weed out lower value trades.

It's not that SC folks aren't supposed to hit 100.

The power value for those last few levels won't increase any build by magical leaps and bounds. It's really just another time sink of the usual carrot on the stick.

In mmos, you may not even touch the end game group content till max level. It's essentially the first grind of many, and gearing up becomes the next long term goal. The last MMO I played even made a change to sync players to area level in order to recycle old content.

In an arpg, repetition begins at level 1. Burn-out is expected and inevitable. Unlike most game genres which offer more opportunities for unique encounters, gameplay is essentially summarized as clearing waves of nameless enemies with an occasional bossfight all in the pursuit of in-game wealth.

Why is it so discouraging to hit those last few levels?

Incentive.

Goals keep players playing. I myself was burnt out before the league even started. Eventually I settled on hitting 12 challenges for the skin. But eventually other goals took hold and now I'm almost at 24, but I also recognize 40 is just shy of impossible for me because I would rather find an excuse to post on the forum instead of just play the game.

Hitting 100 is one of the last carrots on a stick. It's meant to entice you all the while hoping you find more attainable goals in its pursuit.

40 challenges is much of the same - the vast majority of the player base will never come close to it, but it serves to motivate players to keep going when they normally would not.

One should also keep in mind that boredom also encourages the creation of fresh characters which in turn creates demand for items that would otherwise be useless to high level characters.

100 in SC is hardly prestigious, and even in HC where it really has meaning, it's importance is only measured by the achiever's discretion. A streamer might find it offers incentive for viewers to turn in, or maybe they've never done it and want to do it just once for the sake of having done it.