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YoursTruly, I'll try and make it clear to you since obviously you're in some sort of emotional upheaval that doesn't allow you to see clearly.
Sorry, you are the one who is unable to see clearly and is constantly dodging the questions that I have asked. Worse, you only made selective replies to my questions/arguments..
Just take good look at all my replies in this thread (page 3 onward) as well as the thread mentioned below (page 6 onward) and compare to your replies. You only made selective replies to my arguments/questions which highly suggested that you have something to hide or you do not know how to reply.
https://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/1911005/page/6
Mikrotherion wrote "This time it's you having trouble understanding. It's not the first time, either."
And the reason why you bother to finally explain why " I have trouble understanding" was because i wrote this sentence,
"Some people provides explanation to support his claims whereas some people likes to make empty claims without any real explanation just LOL-ed at you."
Thus, you felt the need or pressure to provide some explanation to support your empty claims ( a claim which you always made most of the time).
The sentences which i underlined above from your starting sentences are pathetic excuses you gave in an attempt to put you in a better light as well as to discredit what I have said. Fact is, you make lots of empty claims with little explanation or totally no explanation just like in this case, you quote my messages then went on accusing me that "This time it's you having trouble understanding." but without giving any explanation. Just LOL-ed at you.
Fact is, you made arguments/comments based on a topic/word/phrase which you knew nothing about and make a laughing stock out of yourself when your comments/arguments is challenged and subsequently exposed. Then you tried to sugar-coat your it by saying that you tried to make a joke or tell a joke or whatsoever by using one of my quotes and failed. How laughable is that lol? You totally changed the entire meaning of my words to your advantage and concealing the matter too.
Not just about the correct usage of that phrase/topic/word, there's simply too many mistakes that you made such as your inability to name the right page number (it was page 3 instead of page 4). It may seemed trivial but think again... Why did you made such a mistake that could be so easily avoided? Was it because you are too quick to jump into conclusion because hate gets the better out of your judgement that you forgot how to think properly or was it because You were so eager to argue with me that you could make such a small mistake. Well it no big deal as it just a wrong page number but think again... Every small mistakes adds up to a BIG mistake.
Your and adghar's exchange. And yes, I concede that was on page 3 and I was obviously wrong saying it was on page 4.
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Wow.. How relevant your comments is against the topic of discussion !!
Yes, you are right, it is very relevant, an opinion about The Lord's Labyrinth in a thread asking for opinions about The Lord's Labyrinth
Which I quoted and added:
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Well, the thread title actually is "Post your reason why you hate doing labs". If you don't hate doing the lab (which is absolutely fine, I don't hate the lab most of the time, either), you can of course come here and state that you have no reasons (as you did), but you should not be surprised that people might find that irrelevant.
Unraveling bit by bit, so as to avoid misunderstandings and whatnots:
Just LOL-ed at you again. You came to all the threads that I have made (especially the new ones) and make arguments every single time as well as carried attacks on my argument. This time round, you came to a thread which i made specially created for lab haters to post their hate for a good cause, which is, to list out the flaws of the lab gaming experience. I considered Adhgar's post irrelevant to the topic because he says he likes lab in a topic which is specifically labelled to post hate about labs...
And you made a post saying that it is "ok" to post that you like the labs which totally implies that I am wrong and I saw it as a direct attack on my arguments. I have already explained why I consider your message as an attack many times even before i made this reply and before you made this reply (refer to page 7) but things just don't get into your head. What matters is not how you justify that you "did not attacked" me , rather, what matters is how the other person felt after seeing the posts that you have made so just shut it.
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Well, the thread title actually is "Post your reason why you hate doing labs".
This is directed at adghar, whom I quoted, which you can see because the outer frame of the quote is around adghar's post, not around yours. You're, so to speak, collateral damage (since you felt attacked even though you were not). So what I did here was correcting adghar that this thread is NOT about opinions on the Labyrinth, but reasons why people hate it.
Just LOL-ed at your rubbish again. Just answer me 1 simple question. WHO ARE YOU TO SAY THAT " I WAS NOT ATTACKED"? Is your opinion important or is it the opinion of the other person who received the message more important? You can read my mind?
I have already explained multiple times why I felt your post as an attack, just like from past forum post histories that you would intentionally come to all the threads that I have made to start an argument/accusation.
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If you don't hate doing the lab (which is absolutely fine, I don't hate the lab most of the time, either)...
I am, again, directly addressing adghar. Telling him that it is fine not to hate the Labyrinth. After all we're all entitled to our own opinions.
Yes I agree that everyone is entitled to their own opinions and are entitled to voice out but think again... This thread is specifically created and labelled HATE for labs not LIKES for labs. You are voicing out your opinion that is irrelevant to the topic of discussion. Voicing out irrelevant stuff only gives the other people the impression that you do not understand what the topic is about or you lack the intelligence to make relevant and/or intelligent comments.
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... you can of course come here and state that you have no reasons (as you did)
Again talking to adghar. I cannot forbid him to come here and post irrelevant stuff, as you would know, of course, since these are not my forums and I am not a moderator.
This is a common knowledge, so keep those useless comments to yourself ty.
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but you should not be surprised that people might find that irrelevant.
I'm still talking to adghar here, telling him, although possibly a bit more politely than you would have done, that he (that is not you, YoursTruly) was indeed out of line.
Nowhere did I talk to you or even imply that what you said was wrong... quite the opposite. Yet you failed to understand this and construed it as an attack against you.
I could of course have said "YoursTruly86 is right". But as you will probably know, that would have been logically fallacious; it would either be a Just Because Fallacy (YoursTruly86 is right, because I said so) or Appeal to Authority (YoursTruly86 said it is so, so it must be so). And we surely don't want any more of those fallacies, now, do we?
Sorry, you are the one who failed to understand it. Please see above why I saw your message as an attack and stop "sugar-coating" your real intentions with lies and/or excuses. Anyone can see that through "past forum post history" replies exchanges between you and I.
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Next I want to point out is that it is not me who have trouble understanding it, rather it is YOU have the trouble understanding it as proven and as seen in this thread below as well as in this thread.
https://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/1911005/page/6>>>> page 6 onward..just an example
This is another logical fallacy, called Whataboutism and is closely related to the Tu Quoque Fallacy. The fact that I made a mistake in an entirely different conversation does not mean that you (=YoursTruly86) cannot make a mistake as well, in this case completely misunderstanding what I said.
LOL. Somebody is trying to educate me on a topic that he himself is not even sure of as seen in
https://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/1911005/page/6 >>>>> "logical fallacy"
Just LOL. Did you forget about life lesson number 1 that I have said ?
If you have trouble understanding it, then quit making any bold comments or arguments associating with it or pretending to know it. Might saves you a lot of times in particularly, embarrassment.
Well the "mistake" that you accused that I have made was a "mistake" of misunderstanding someone's message. Whether if it is a mistake or not ultimately, is a matter of opinion between the person who says it (you in this case) and the person who receives it (me in this case as well as the audiences). SO WHO ARE YOU TO SAY THAT I HAVE MADE A MISTAKE? JUST WHO ARE YOU? YOU IMPLYING YOURSELF AS THE ULTIMATE AUTHORITY ON THIS MATTER WHEREBY EVERYTHING YOU SAID WAS RIGHT?
In the light of which your saying
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But, you are too quick to jump into conclusion because hate gets the better out of your judgement that you forgot how to think properly.
is rather ironic. I dunno, though, whether "hate" is the correct word here. I for one don't hate you.
How ironic is that? At least I have explanations to back up what I have said, unlike some people who consistently make empty claims. LMAO you don't hate me but your actions say otherwise throughout the past historical post/replies exchanges that we made. Why do you have to consistently come to every single thread that I have newly created and come to start an argument with me? Leave me alone and nothing would have happened? Just too many hypocrites who lacks integrity to man up nowadays LOLOLOL.
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Seriously, do I have to screenshot the message that you wrote to prove that you created an argument or make a comment involving a specific phrase/word and make a fool out of yourself because first and foremost, you did not understand the meaning of the word/phrase and resulted in you making a joke out of yourself before you start to admit it?
What are you on about? I conceded in that thread that I was wrong.
Really?
Fact is, you made arguments/comments based on a topic/word/phrase which you knew nothing about and make a laughing stock out of yourself when your comments/arguments is challenged and subsequently exposed. Then you tried to sugar-coat your it by saying that you tried to make a joke or tell a joke or whatsoever by using one of my quotes and failed. How laughable is that lol? You totally changed the entire meaning of my words to your advantage and concealing the matter too..
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What I am trying to say is that you did not have the intention to make a joke or tell a joke in the first place by quoting my post and failed.
And I said I was trying to make a joke (NOT tell a joke, although I know one or two rather good ones). You will have to accept that. This is not even a Just Because Fallacy (before you mention that one again) because I am in fact the ultimate authority on that matter, since I wrote that post and I know what my intention was.
Fact is, you made arguments/comments based on a topic/word/phrase which you knew nothing about and make a laughing stock out of yourself when your comments/arguments is challenged and subsequently exposed. Then you tried to sugar-coat your it by saying that you tried to make a joke or tell a joke or whatsoever by using one of my quotes and failed. How laughable is that lol? You totally changed the entire meaning of my words to your advantage and concealing the matter too
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What I am saying is that you made yourself look like a joke by using word/phrase that you are unsure of which resulted in you yourself making irrelevant arguments. Is it too hard to understand and/or admit it?
What? You want me to admit it again? Fine, I tried to make a joke with your post and turns out the joke's on me.
Mikrotherion wrote
Now, is it coincidence? Not at all. I quoted one of your posts and tried (and failed) to make a joke of it.
OHHHHHHHHH. Now you're singing a different tune, and this time, a honest tune FINALLY. The phrase, "and turns out the joke's on me" makes a whole world of difference between the initial reply that you gave. There is a whole world of difference between "quoted one of your posts and tried (and failed) to make a joke of it " and "I tried to make a joke with your post and turns out the joke's on me" ..
However, you should add the phrase " due to my ignorance" behind the underlined sentences above. That would be a more truthful representation.
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Please stop trying to rephrase the words to your advantage.There is a great difference between telling a joke/making a joke whatsoever and making a joke out of yourself due to ignorance.
You don't say!
What do you meant by saying "You don't say!" ? Are you implying that I cannot say something in the forums and i requires your permission if I wanted to write something down?
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>My replies highlighted in bold.
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Posted byYoursTruly86on Jun 18, 2017, 12:44:15 AM
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I will tell you a little secret. Everybody love doing the lab.
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Posted byRakiiion Jun 18, 2017, 5:06:18 AM
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And yet everyone who hates the lab is in a way just complaining that it is too hard. It is not. It guards absurdly powerful ascendancy points which you actually do not even need 100% until you hit lvl 60. If you hate it that much skip it and do it ONCE with high lvl (high hp). I dc a lot in lab and it is frustrating yet i hope they keep the lab as is !
Wondering lately whats up with ppl who want to remove every little obstacle in the game. Remove death penalty ? Sure so the 360 no scope damage only one shot clearspeed builds are even more of a no brainer ? Get all 8 ascendancy points handed to you while you lvl ? Just weird.
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Posted bytheoneandonly33on Jun 18, 2017, 5:21:21 AM
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I will tell you a little secret. Everybody love doing the lab.
Let me tell you a little secret too.
Voicing out irrelevant stuff only gives the other people the impression that you do not understand what the topic is about or you lack the intelligence to make relevant and/or intelligent comments.
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Posted byYoursTruly86on Jun 18, 2017, 5:32:37 AM
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And yet everyone who hates the lab is in a way just complaining that it is too hard. It is not.
So even someone like Mathil, who spams Shaper and Uber Atziri all day long on hipster melee life builds, is complaining that lab is "too hard" when he says lab is cancer?
I don't know why some people struggle to understand that some people just don't like lab. Has nothing to do with difficulty. It's just shit.
I get the feeling these special snowflake lab lovers somehow derive self-worth from their whole "LOL lab is easy!" routine. Either that or they're just contrarians.
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Posted bypoepoe091on Jun 18, 2017, 5:34:07 AM
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And because mathil doesn't like it it should be removed ? That is no argument at all. Not everyone has to love every aspect of the game. Not everyone has to reach level 100 and xp penalty does not have to be removed. If you hate it just do it once and be done with it. You do not have to farm it or spend any more time on it. Move on to things you like.
Also im sure mathil does not actively advocate for the lab to be removed. He does it and moves on. On one thing i can agree on is maybe scale the difficulty a LITTLE better but cruel / merciless / uber are completely fine imo. In this thread though most of the arguments are just that it is too hard for them to do so yeah i stand by my point that for absolutely most lab haters the problem is to not die doing it which they can easily achieve by just doing it a little later with better hp/gear.
Last edited by theoneandonly33 on Jun 18, 2017, 5:50:46 AM
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Posted bytheoneandonly33on Jun 18, 2017, 5:42:56 AM
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Lab is clearly a good currency grind, and especially so if rng blesses you with a decent helm enchant, but....
The fps drop from floor effects takes my poor computer from a survivable 15 fps to <5 fps so that only the most hardy HC-type build can reliably complete, and
I crash most often here, strangely most often in the treasure room, so rushing to the altar is key early on. This means that beginning players also might not have time to actually read class data before a crash. (This could be fixed my making the portal after a successful lab persist for re-entrance.)
And it's kinda boring, since layouts are not randomized. All the 20x shaped strands we run are a little different, but this is just the same lab over and over until reset.
And, with a non-lab build, it can take 15+ minutes first time, making fps and crash problems even more likely.
And why not just call it a lvl X+Y zone, where Y>>0, since izzy is clearly much tougher than the stated level X.
But GGG has invested a lot of time and money in lab, so gotta accept it and do it at least 3x for each character. Or you could buy a run.
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Posted byKallasAKon Jun 18, 2017, 5:48:10 AM
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Mathil is just an example of someone who isn't a noob--like what you were accusing everyone else of being who dislikes lab.
And yeah, he's not advocating for lab to be removed, but neither are we, for fuck's sake.
No one wants lab removed, we just don't want to do it four fucking times on every fucking character we create. Is that really so difficult to understand?
And yes, I agree, uber lab is fine because it has rewards and a point to it. It's the other three labs that are nothing but annoyance.
And it's not like GGG have never streamlined their game before. Once upon a time, gems were reward only. Then we could buy them from a vandor. Now Siosa sells every single gem. In other words, GGG took a shitty system and made it better--we just want them to do the same to lab. Streamline it. Don't force players to "do it and move on," give them option of when they want to do it and why.
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Posted bypoepoe091on Jun 18, 2017, 5:57:39 AM
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It's 20minutes*3 of boredom when leveling a new character.
Uber's pretty fun though, since difficulty + reward actually feel correctly balanced. I still only ever do it once, since I prefer the moment to moment gameplay when mapping.
Trials are truly awful though, they feel like a forced side area that give no rewards.
Last edited by Hybrid897 on Jun 18, 2017, 6:04:28 AM
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Posted byHybrid897on Jun 18, 2017, 6:04:05 AM
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And yet everyone who hates the lab is in a way just complaining that it is too hard. It is not.
So even someone like Mathil, who spams Shaper and Uber Atziri all day long on hipster melee life builds, is complaining that lab is "too hard" when he says lab is cancer?
I don't know why some people struggle to understand that some people just don't like lab. Has nothing to do with difficulty. It's just shit.
I get the feeling these special snowflake lab lovers somehow derive self-worth from their whole "LOL lab is easy!" routine. Either that or they're just contrarians.
We can all agree that Mathil is a seasoned POE player and a popular streamer and/or you-tube video uploader relating to POE.
I believed in what he said when he said lab is cancer. Not just agreeing with him just because he's popular, I have my own personal opinion on why lab is cancer as stated in my initial post. Just take the 0.26% helmet enchantment mod for example... It's a freaking unrealistic chance to get the desired enchantment, and damn its not even 1% chance. Do the math, it's almost impossible to get it by yourself.
I know stubborn people will give the "why not just buy it" argument , but they forgot that the supply of helmet enchantments for a specific helmet is NEARLY NON EXISTENT for niche builds or non meta builds. Just go to POE trade and filter online or offline sellers and search for a hrimnor resolve helmet with the +40% flameblast damage enchantment. Total supply is ZERO. I have tried asking for it in trade chat but nobody has it or bothers to reply because we all know that the helmet is a non meta build and most probably few people would even bother to sacrifice their precious lab enchantment on that "shitty" non meta helmet. This is just one example.
Normally, there will be some vocal players saying that lab "does not sucked" and "is good" but I can safely tell you this that those people are just casuals or blind fanbois who knows shit about this game. When asked about why Lab is good, they usually became mute all of a sudden.
Note: if they wish to debate on why lab is good versus why lab is cancer, I would gladly welcome it but please not in this thread because its irrelevant to the topic of discussion.
Voicing out irrelevant stuff only gives the other people the impression that you do not understand what the topic is about or you lack the intelligence to make relevant and/or intelligent comments.
They are not seasoned players who can give you a much better and accurate assessment about the lab. When a seasoned player such as Mathil says lab is cancer compared to a MR NOBODY who says lab is good, who would you believe? The answer is obvious.
I agrees with poepoe091 btw.
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Posted byYoursTruly86on Jun 18, 2017, 6:13:05 AM
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