Not worth to pick up ANY items

"

de99ial wrote:

Well then names should be changed. For like

1. Garbage (whote)
2. Trash (blue)
3. Better trash (yellow)

etc.

If they "rare" they should be rare. As with uniq - quniq means it is quniq, not "my stash is full of uniq thing so i started vendor it because other dont really like it" or - like i did when SSF was not an optio - just go to first town and give it away for free to some low level players ;)

Also some "gift shirine" i suggested in other topic (i did the thread).

Well, that's how item tiers were called in Diablo2, many games used the same names and colours. I agree, "unique" actually doesnt fit uniques at all, because they arent "one of the kind", you can have 5x or 50x of the same "unique" in stash.

PoE just has too many bad gameplay decitions.
For example, GGG doesnt want to make inventory bigger, to make players "fell the weight of items". Ok, i got the idea, but then, players should be able to distinquish trash items from treasure, which is impossible if items drop unidentified and even blue items can be worth a big sum (for example, a good weapon base with T1 physical prefix is worth ~5k alteration orbs).
I'll put item sockets as an example of GOOD loot system. Items without 6 sockets, or without 5-link (at start of league or in SSF) are trash. And 6-L items are quite valuable, even if they're white and got the shittiest base. But you can clearly see what sockets do items have, and filter out trash with loot filter (if you want to). So, when a decent item drops (6-socket for example), you can see that and pick it up, without wasting your time on picking up 10000 trash items.
So i ask you, GGG, why should we waste our time picking up 10000 trash items, just because they drop unidentified and loot filter cant hide trash from our sight????

"

kompaniet wrote:

i didn't pick up any rare items in diablo 2 either (except circlets) and that was like 17 years ago so this shouldn't come as a surprise.

we have solo self found mode now so there are lots of players who loot the rares there.

D2 was different from PoE... most BiS items in D2 are either uniques or runewords (essetially, crafted uniques). That's why picking up rares (except jewelry an few other items) was almost useless. Not so in PoE, where many BiS items are well-rolled rares, like 350-PDPS crit wands or 600-ES shields. Uniques cant match those items, not even close.

"

MortalKombat3 wrote:

So i ask you, GGG, why should we waste our time picking up 10000 trash items, just because they drop unidentified and loot filter cant hide trash from our sight????

Because of the decisions that you are making, obviously.

There could be a good item in there, you can give it a look or you can skip it and potentially miss an opportunity.
Choices are good and should always matter, otherwise there is no point and everything is mindless.

"

Fruz wrote:

"

MortalKombat3 wrote:

So i ask you, GGG, why should we waste our time picking up 10000 trash items, just because they drop unidentified and loot filter cant hide trash from our sight????

Because of the decisions that you are making, obviously.

There could be a good item in there, you can give it a look or you can skip it and potentially miss an opportunity.
Choices are good and should always matter, otherwise there is no point and everything is mindless.

And choice is made "dont pick it up", so you dont pick up loot in loot-centric game! Great job, GGG!

You call that "decisions", and i call that "design flaws".

No, you made the choice.

You need to know when it's worth looking for upgrades and when it's worth not to, you need to know which bases would be interesting to select, you need to know how available on the market or not and therefore how expensive it would be if you want to buy it instead, etc ....


It's way more complicated and interesting than "I don't want to bother thinking and making choices so I just ignore everything, please GGG help me because that sucks !"
Calling it "design flaw" on top of that is silly, and a bit arrogant too.

"

Fruz wrote:

No, you made the choice.

You need to know when it's worth looking for upgrades and when it's worth not to, you need to know which bases would be interesting to select, you need to know how available on the market or not and therefore how expensive it would be if you want to buy it instead, etc ....


It's way more complicated and interesting than "I don't want to bother thinking and making choices so I just ignore everything, please GGG help me because that sucks !"
Calling it "design flaw" on top of that is silly, and a bit arrogant too.

Wow, it's a good excuse for developers...

Life/armour/eva are shit compared to ES?
Melee is shit compared to ranged?
Instant leech is best sustain the the game?
Farming chain Strand 24/7 yields best loot and exp despite 0 challenge?

"You made your choice!"

Why bother with game balance at all, huh? Let's throw random shit at players, and they'll make "choice" about what is good and what is "noob trap"...

Thay philosophy makes me sick!

one thing that often comes to my mind regarding lootig or not looting is,that we should be "able" to adjust our lootfilter ingame and on the fly.

like. hmm i need a new Bodyarmor let me see rare Bodyarmor baseitems X,Y and Z.


I know you can already do that with your lootfliter,but its kinda anoying to change it too often.

"

MortalKombat3 wrote:

Farming chain Strand 24/7 yields best loot and exp despite 0 challenge?

Best xp maybe, but certainly not best loot.

I think some part of the problem with all this loot situation is deadly combo of 2 GGG disign choices:

1) small chance to find something good for time wasted
2) too harsh and unrewarding crafting for common players

So people just do most practical thing - not wasting resources for some "may be 1 to 100 chance" and strictly farm currency for trading.

Like you can statisticly buy better gear for 15 c then you can make with 15 c.

You can statisticly buy FAR better gear with 1 ex, that you can craft with 1 ex (mostly just completly waste it in pain!)

Indeed, there are exeptions, but they ony confirm rule.

"

le_souriceau wrote:

1) small chance to find something good for time wasted
2) too harsh and unrewarding crafting for common players

So people just do most practical thing - not wasting resources for some "may be 1 to 100 chance" and strictly farm currency for trading.

Those are not "design choices", the design choice is "does our game have trading in it or not?". The rest is just basic logic.

1. Good stuff = rare stuff.
Otherwise it wouldn't be good, because everybody would have it.

2. The better your own stuff is, the harder it gets to find upgrades.
When you already have 98% power level, 98% of items are worthless, no matter how useful they are. When you have a 350 DpS sword, any Sword below 350 is a trash item to you.

3. Trading is always superior than doing it yourself. That's why trade exists IRL.
You alone simply cannot compete with thousands of other players who spend thousands of hours finding items they don't need and put up for sale. No matter the change, trading will be cheaper than crafting yourself.

4. If drop rates were increased, nothing would change, except for what is considered "good".
When you can find a mirror per hour, people would start vendoring mirrored items because you can't change socket colours, waste of time to put them up for sale.

There's about two ways to change the current state:

a) Force everybody to play SSF. No trade at all. This has certain advantages, but it also has downsides. D3 did this. Some people enjoy, other think it's horrible.

b) Kill your game. Make an offline version. Within a couple weeks, the first cheat software appears, and no item has any value anymore. You get duped BiS items, whole stashes get uploaded, etc. This happened to Titan Quest.

"

Peterlerock wrote:

1. Good stuff = rare stuff.
Otherwise it wouldn't be good, because everybody would have it.

2. The better your own stuff is, the harder it gets to find upgrades.
When you already have 98% power level, 98% of items are worthless, no matter how useful they are. When you have a 350 DpS sword, any Sword below 350 is a trash item to you.

3. Trading is always superior than doing it yourself. That's why trade exists IRL.
You alone simply cannot compete with thousands of other players who spend thousands of hours finding items they don't need and put up for sale. No matter the change, trading will be cheaper than crafting yourself.

4. If drop rates were increased, nothing would change, except for what is considered "good".
When you can find a mirror per hour, people would start vendoring mirrored items because you can't change socket colours, waste of time to put them up for sale.

There's about two ways to change the current state:

a) Force everybody to play SSF. No trade at all. This has certain advantages, but it also has downsides. D3 did this. Some people enjoy, other think it's horrible.

b) Kill your game. Make an offline version. Within a couple weeks, the first cheat software appears, and no item has any value anymore. You get duped BiS items, whole stashes get uploaded, etc. This happened to Titan Quest.

It seems you dont understand what this thread is about

1. Good stuff isnt always rare. For example, some 1c uniques in PoE are BiS items for some builds. As long as you got it, you wont upgrade it for your build, at all. But if we're talking from trading perspective - then, indeed, expensive stuff always must be infrequent, otherwise it will be cheap even if it's BiS item.

2. That's true, but in trading game, even items you dont need might be very useful for you - you can sell them to others, who will make use of them. And i can live with that past certain point, upgrades are very expensive and infrequent. This thread isnt about that.

3. Trading is superior because of two reasons - first, you will find many items for other builds. Useless for you, they can be sold so you can buy item for your build (found by someone else, for whom it's useless too). And second - players, who have better items, may sell you items they dont need already (because they have better ones). You also can sell your "old" item to others, if there are enough players with items worse than yours.
And when you need an item that doesnt exist for sale, crafting is the ONLY option.
Do you really believe that all those 700-900 ES chests are found by killing monsters? If you do, we have nothing to talk about here. 95-99% of those chests are CRAFTED, because demand is high and top-player want to get 1k ES chest, and ready to burn tons of currency for it. They cant just buy it from market, because those arent for sale, often. So, rish player burn their currency to get a poerful 1k ES piece, and in process, they might craft 700, 800, 900 ES pieces, that will be sold on market.
But again, this thread isnt about that

4. Again you dont understand what this thread is about.
It isnt about buffing droprates. It's about flawed loot system.
Some currency items have so low value, that it isnt worth picking them up (scrolls of wisdom, etc). In most ARPGs, such items (gold piles, for example) are picked up automatically, so player doesnt have to waste his time. For some wierd reason, PoE doesnt implemented auto-pickup for those (Bots dont care about autolooting anyway, lol!).
In PoE, rare items might be ones of the most powerful items for certain slots, but odds for that are very. very, VERY SMALL, especially for non-meta item bases. Rare items drop unidentified, inventory size is small, number of portals in map is limited and you cant even identify all items in your inventory with 1 click (and even if you could, you need some time to check their stats).
Chances to get expensive item from most item bases are so small, that picking up those items isnt worth your time to do so. Even if it may yield a 10-exalted worth item, chances are so small, that you will earn far more exalteds by simply passing and picking up only the most powerful meta bases (=ES gear) and currency.
That's what i find disturbing in PoE - a potentially great loot should be left on the ground (or vendored via vendor recipe) because it's inefficient to actually pick it up/identify.
In most other ARPGs, you pick up all potentially good loot, then you check it before vendor, and save it if it can be useful, & sell trash (or break it for crafting components).



Actually, SSF and offline games are essentially the same. When you play solo, without any interaction with others (and SSF/offline means you are NOT interacting with others in any way), you have a full right to decide, whether to use "cheats" to all loot you want, or to play the game the way it's intended. After all, you play game to entertain yourself, and if you find more entertainment in cheating (rather than playing game the way it was intended) - feel free to do so, nobody is going to convict you for that.
But in game where players interact with each others, cheating is unacceptable, because cheaters will ruin the game for players that chosen to play game "as intented", without cheats.