naming and shaming scammers, im very upset.

first of all, im happy many people agree with me! ♥ my voice alone doesnt mean shit, but when a lot of people start to complain, maybe they will actually do something about this! so yay to that!

"

vio wrote:

no. you can name and shame on reddit or build external tools to build ignore lists (i'm sure people did that already).

you're free to do all that. my only concern is that this is discriminating players who maybe did nothing wrong. and that they have no chance to avoid being wrongly hindered playing the game to it's full extent by contacting the creators of this game.

and i know many cases of hardliners who always tell "if you're sticking to the rules nothing bad will happen to you" until they experience otherwise.

must clarify a few things here! first of all, the majority of people just wants to play the game, they dont even use this forum, let alone reddit. the only site for the game most people absolutely need is poe trade, reddit isnt really up there, external tools even less

you shouldnt worry that much about innocents getting on ignorelist. first of all, if happens veeeeery rarely (to me only one false accusation during the whole existence of 820). there are a few touchy people that you can get ignored by in 820, and that happens usually for spam. also a lot of people dislike if someone tries to trade in global 820 and will ignore for that.

in any case, if someone has you ignored in a rota and you cant join his hideout, he is usually asked to temporarily unignore you so you can do his mission, if he refuses, usually he is blamed and not you

after some support guy stated that ggg actively bans "scammers" i tried for weeks getting some definition for "scamming". to no avail.

lol, good luck.

No offense, but this thread reks of elitism.

I know what happens when certain communities start taking control of certain aspects of the game. Just look at the example of Dota (warcraft 3 version). There, it was only managed by the users. I still remember the ridiculous purpose of a "banlist" program which every self-entitled dota player had, just to know who to ban (automatically kicked on join) from their games. It reached a point where ppl were being banned for reasons that are absolutely non-sense.


I see a similar thing happening here, with that 820 channel. I can see how bad it can get, so I got to agree with GGG on this one. They need to take control of their own game, before things get way out of hand.

"

Xarick wrote:

No offense, but this thread reks of elitism.

I know what happens when certain communities start taking control of certain aspects of the game. Just look at the example of Dota (warcraft 3 version). There, it was only managed by the users. I still remember the ridiculous purpose of a "banlist" program which every self-entitled dota player had, just to know who to ban (automatically kicked on join) from their games. It reached a point where ppl were being banned for reasons that are absolutely non-sense.


I see a similar thing happening here, with that 820 channel. I can see how bad it can get, so I got to agree with GGG on this one. They need to take control of their own game, before things get way out of hand.

i appreciate disagreement that has an argument, and not just mindless "hey ggg is right whatever lol". but although i didnt play dota, i think we here have a much milder example than that! first of all, basically ggg simply cannot control this. they cant control even the actual scams, let alone this...while the community CAN! and another thing, 820 community doesnt create a ban list that permanently fucks someone up, people from 820 can INFORM you, based on which only you decide whether to ignore someone or not! and even if you do, its not permanent, if for some weird reason it turns to have been a mistake, you simply unignore :p

You don't have enough information to condemn a person over a single broken rotation. Whereas GGG is in perfect position to make note of the complaint and then act if a pattern is detected. They can even tell if the player in question continued with normal activities after they broke. We have no way of knowing and can't rightly wreck a persons reputation simply because they didn't respond yet their account appeared to be logged in. The vast majority of 820 users and big-hearted and generous and give people the benefit of the doubt unless we see it happen multiple times. Why not start a new channel for the intolerant, angry minority who call out and shame players and mods alike, add no support and nothing positive to the game and freak out over a single missed master at 821 or something?

"

NoahCannon wrote:

The vast majority of 820 users and big-hearted and generous and give people the benefit of the doubt unless we see it happen multiple times.

So then what's the problem with letting players call out people who leave rotations? If most people don't ignore unless they see it happen multiple times, there isn't anything to be concerned about.

The problem is we were asked not to by our hosts! We are guests here. How hard is that to understand? Why not quote and answer my last post's first sentence? Shaming is overkill for a single act such as OP described. Maybe something like "PlayerA questionable in our group"? or "PlayerA in suspicious broke rota"? or even "PlayerA possible leecher". See if those will fly as a compromise. Action based on a single event with limited info followed by "Scammer!/ Leech!" shaming is BS.

"

NoahCannon wrote:

The problem is we were asked not to by our hosts! We are guests here. How hard is that to understand? Why not quote my last post's first sentence? Shaming is overkill for a single act as OP described. Maybe something like "PlayerA questionable in our group"? or "PlayerA in suspicious broke rota"? or even "PlayerA possible leecher". See if those will fly as a compromise. One act, limited info player Scammer!/ Leech! shaming is BS.

this is a good suggestion and i will try it! due to ggg's bullshit policy, theres been more than usual rota leeches so when it happens to me i will give some statement like what you said, and if i again get pmed for that, im gonna be very upset.

very. upset.

"

NoahCannon wrote:

You don't have enough information to condemn a person over a single broken rotation.

Maybe i dont, but i still dont want this person in my rotation right after some1 wrote in 820 thats leaver/scammer/leecher. Its my right, right? :) Then i need to know. I want to know. Its that simple.

"

NoahCannon wrote:

Whereas GGG is in perfect position to make note of the complaint and then act if a pattern is detected. They can even tell if the player in question continued with normal activities after they broke.

Hell yeah, brillant idea. Cant wait to view ggg response to my humble request to check every leaver, confirm and deny something. Unless they have 20+ ppl monitoring 820, they cant. Its not doable.
So we must have right to inform 820 about leavers. Seriously, i saw more than enough examples of rotas saying, that issue is resolved, guy is back, whatever.

"

We have no way of knowing and can't rightly wreck a persons reputation simply because they didn't respond yet their account appeared to be logged in.

Suprise, suprise - i dont care. Obv i dont know if hes scammer, or if hes connection went down, or whatever really - i just dont want that person in my rota, 'cos whatever reason it was, my party is risking losing master xp.
I did not invite ppl with stupid/offensive names, even in my or known native language, 'cos i just dont like that behaviour. And if i dont want some1 in my rota - what would ggg do?

Thats why we all need to know if some1 left rota - its not important if we label them scammers, leechers, morons or greatest persons of our times, it will exclude them from many rotas, so ggg have to ban mentioning 'bout leavers, cos its shaming itself. And guess what - true scammers will thrive, so ggg then have to control entire 820, otherwise risking that whole 820 community will be exposed, exploted, and mad.

Or they can just leave 820 as it is right now, 'cos its players idea, working great, with some scammers deserving exposing, and many great ppl.