Endgame Gear Impossible to Get or Just an Illusion?

I said "another discussion", Faendris.

as for BoS gear, like I said it shouldn't be a "tier" in my opinion.
it should be something people like yourself strive for. and when I say "strive for" I mean the one-of-a-kind item itself, not the bag of Exalts attached to its name.

you uber-trade or RNG roll with a ton of trade-accumulated high orbs to be forever known as "Faendris, the guy who has Loath Bane". that's how BoS should work.

currently, BoS in Path Of Exile means "Faendris, the guy who will gladly sell you a 9000th copy of Loath Bane for 999 Pure Exalts. don't have 999 Exalts? well then, go to this site right here and enter your credit card number - and you will".
that's not BoS.
that's BS.

Best On Server items shouldn't be "accessible". that's the whole point.
their "accessibility" right now, is a massive fucking RMT catalyst of epic crap proportions.

"

johnKeys wrote:

I said "another discussion", Faendris.

as for BoS gear, like I said it shouldn't be a "tier" in my opinion.
it should be something people like yourself strive for. and when I say "strive for" I mean the one-of-a-kind item itself, not the bag of Exalts attached to its name.

you uber-trade or RNG roll with a ton of trade-accumulated high orbs to be forever known as "Faendris, the guy who has Loath Bane". that's how BoS should work.

currently, BoS in Path Of Exile means "Faendris, the guy who will gladly sell you a 9000th copy of Loath Bane for 999 Pure Exalts. don't have 999 Exalts? well then, go to this site right here and enter your credit card number - and you will".
that's not BoS.
that's BS.

Best On Server items shouldn't be "accessible". that's the whole point.
their "accessibility" right now, is a massive fucking RMT catalyst of epic crap proportions.

Oh, this is not a discussion. I merely pointed out that your argument only holds if you do not trade in a game where trade is an important part. I felt this was necessary, since this whole thread is about the obtainability of end game gear.

As for BoS items: those are in a great shape in PoE! They are really famous and often come with a background story about how they were crafted or for how much they changed hands. In PoE they are truly legendary. I have not seen this in any other game. Maybe you mistake the BoS item itself with its copies? Anyone using mirrored items (except for those without sockets) knows how painful each major patch is. Mirroring gets you a BoS for a limited duration. This seems fine to me.

There has never been as much good and cheap gear around as in warbands/tempest.

Between rarity for everyone mapping, increased unique droprate, a mid-level map with a tripple boss able to drop loot with t2 res (42-45 mind you), massive torment ghost abuse, loot piniatas (warbands) and 6L's everywhere (tempest) and the general meta shift to easy to gear builds, gear which would go for several exalts went for a few chaos very quickly.

That's the d3 syndrom and it's really scary.

I know a lot of people who quit because they were overfed by lootplosions and the lacking progression of your char.
Only a few people aim for (close to) perfect items, if the stuff they got cheap can handle the highest content already.

Seriously, what is endgame gear anyway. Drops from a level 71 map? Please.

i understand you, but here is a diffrent approach on the problem:
1. first of all - killspeed (KS)
higher killspeed = more loot

because the faster you kill the more you can kill in the same time as some1 else with a lower KS (MF+KS=loot)
what defines the killspeed? skills and their mechanics combined with gear
lets just focus on the skills first:
just check the forums and you realize there are some skills that are basicly used 80% of the players (please note that high end gear enabling other skills to be able to reach the same ks or even higher KS):
Flameblast / Incinerate / Arc / Cyclone / Flametotem / Reave
What do all have in common?
Flameblast = AOE = each stage adds +AOE +DMG
Incinerate = Piercing Projectile + each stage adds +DMG => Kind of AOE stream
Arc = Auto Targeting / Chaining which provides AOE coverage
Cyclone = small AOE + movement
Reave = AOE = each stage adds +AOE
Flametotem = Piercing Projectile => Kind of AOE stream + only placing after that free dmg for a duration

OFC there are CoC and Discharge builds but lets stay on the general builds.
As we can see there is a pattern.
The possibility to deal as much as possible dmg to as much as possible targets.

Some other skills are basiclly not used or just in subpar builds regarding the KS.

Therefore the main focus should be on balancing the skills!

2. Drop / Droprates
If you look at the possible affix/suffix table its not hard to understand that rly useful rolls are almost impossible to get. Furthermore some of those rolls are basicly just a waste of space for most of the builds.
here are just some examples that i havent seen much of a use:
Damage Return
Mana Gained on Enemy Death
Reduced Attribute Requirements
Resistance on weapons

The affix/suffix system just throws randomly chosen rolls on an item. Pure luck.
Ok we got master but therefore we need pure luckbased RNGjesus based rolls.

Imo code "logical" rolls on items.
If something rolls something other can´t roll.

3. Economy / Trading = Item progression
If GGG want a playerbased economy it´s ok it´s their game but please for the sake of everyones time - a chat is basicly the year 2000... Everyone knows that "time" is a limited recource and why not cut that investing time part to a min.? Even if I don´t like an Auctionhouse when it was released by Blizz in D3, infact i just disliked the RL money part, it was easy to trade for everyone with almost the same time investment.

The more time ppl actually playing the game the more fun are ppl having.
Even if a player can´t find an upgrade himself, at least there is an "easy" wayy to find upgrade. Ok now ppl are saying just alt-tab out use poe.trade find your item with a b/o then write the player if he got time and then with a lot of luck you are done within 1min... worst case is that you have to write 5 ppl 2 of them are answering 1 doesnt even have the item anymore and the lastone is just "finishing the map".
In this time you could have run a map by yourself. The search would be 1:1 the same effort just ingame. And instead of writing and visiting h/o we could just "pay" the b/o price and have it saving our and others time.

Ofc there could be still "only offering" with no b/o but lets be honest almost every1 is using b/o.

Add some kind of Auction House with the following options:
Buyout (basicly poe.trade in much faster)
Bids (with time limit)
Haggle (just the "displaying" of an item so ppl can use the player interaction and discouss a price like in the old days

"

Faendris wrote:

As for BoS items: those are in a great shape in PoE! They are really famous and often come with a background story about how they were crafted or for how much they changed hands. In PoE they are truly legendary. I have not seen this in any other game. Maybe you mistake the BoS item itself with its copies? Anyone using mirrored items (except for those without sockets) knows how painful each major patch is. Mirroring gets you a BoS for a limited duration. This seems fine to me.

to clarify: "BoS tier" means the select-few BoS items themselves + all of their mirrored copies.

and I really don't see that as being in great shape. I see it as being the opposite of what I think BoS is, and - as stated earlier - a top RMT fuel in the game.

which is why I think it should not be "a tier" at all.

you get all the things you love about BoS - the background stories, owner names etc' - but Mirroring them just ruins it because in essence, you're not the only one with this legendary item.
also, I don't know how the "top 1%" trade works but I feel that if your #1 dagger suddenly became #2 because of a patch or someone crafting something better - you'll actually have to sell that dagger to fund trying to craft the next #1 BoS with your name on it.
this, is how BoS items worked in those 1/2 MMOs I played.
this, is how top-tier orbs get sinked instead of getting into the filthy hands of RMT.
and this, is how the "super-rich" would actually balance each other and the entire Economy as a whole, instead of becoming morbidly obese with Exalts and having literally the "wealth" of an entire league distilled down to a single person.

"Mirror Service" has to go.

diablo2 had much worse drop rates and no mirrors (how many perfect item have dropped so far? zero? that's right if this was diablo2 there wouldn't even be one full tier 1 mod item compared to the thousands that poe has) and it was pretty much the most popular game of it's kind

i don't know what you understand by "end game" but you can farm 30 exalts, full mirrored items not so much

you don't need mirrored items to do 80-81 maps or uber atziri

STOP WHINIIIINNG

It use to only cost about 200ex-ish including mirror AND fee to get the mirrored gear of your choice for that OP set up you are building. That's 1/10 of the cost of making it (for weapons) which is EXTREMELY CHEAP, even a massive giveaway if you ask me.

That's why I've always been a fan of mirrors and eternals because if you play and trade hard enough, you will get what you want in a considerable amount of investment in the permanent leagues. But sadly, the devs really have done it, arguably the most retarded move I've seen them do since I've started playing PoE - removing Eternals. Now the dream of aquiring End-game gear has turned from possible, to 350ex a piece. Such a shame.

You can do most of the endgame without great gear. Great gear just improves your clear speed and makes increases your survivability. This goes for most builds except those that 100% requires a specific endgame unique.

For example I once cleared a level 74 map with an elemental spectral throw build. Once it was cleared I realized I never even put on my aura's and was only doing 20% of my normal damage (I was hungover. Stop judging me! :D )

But if you chose one of those "omgzzzzz my build does 500k deeeepzz" guides then that's your mistake :) If you game knowledge is limited avoid guides from standard league (nothing against standard league but often those guides require a lot of currency to work properly)

Finally we cannot inspect your characters so we cannot give you any feedback on your build.

"

OJ8_Graz wrote:

It use to only cost about 200ex-ish including mirror AND fee to get the mirrored gear of your choice for that OP set up you are building. That's 1/10 of the cost of making it (for weapons) which is EXTREMELY CHEAP, even a massive giveaway if you ask me.

seriously?

this is like the old Marie Antoinette "Qu'ils mangent de la brioche". it's insulting.
the vast majority of Path Of Exile players will never see so much currency in their Stash combined, much less all at once.
and no I'm not talking about self-found or half-self-found like me.
I'm talking about people who do trade, but don't "play the trade game" a.k.a "uber-trade".

you want to be "1%"? well then sink your thousands of Exalts on something useful, like crafting a Best On Server (or 2nd best. 3rd best...) item for yourself. one that will be truly unique and all yours. truly one of a kind.
and if you want an even better one, or another piece of BoS gear - you'll actually have to sell it to another 1% trader who's looking for it, instead of just growing disgustingly Exalt-fat with hoarding and dominating the economy of an entire league, by duping (there I've said it) your supposedly-one-of-a-kind into a whole tier of better-than-BiS items, with zero effort.

a player should feel god in this game, if he/she has one BoS item to his/her name.
"THE" BoS item, not "A" BoS item. not go for a whole damned set of mirrored dupes while 90% of the other players likely won't even see how a "mere" Best In Slot like Shavronne's Wrappings looks like.
would be a hell more fair, in my opinion.
and maybe even the economy and the game itself, would be easier to balance this way.

Like mentioned in this thread, you can do relative high-end content with mediocre gear if you know what your doing.

You will be restricted in build options in doing so, but that's the price you have to pay i imagine?

For me personally i don't mind the end-game gear being extremely harsh to get in PoE, what does bother me sometimes is the length of time between upgrades even if only to improve a life roll from 80 to 86 etc, something tangible yet negligible.

On the other hand, if i fully enjoy a build/design/play-style all of the above becomes void and i just go ham on the mobs enjoying myself irrelevant of gear and progression.

Peace,

-Boem-