Feedback and Suggestions (Path of Exile 1) - Ways to balance low-life shavronnes builds and daggerers/wanders - Forum

Spoiler " Chundadragon wrote: " Startkabels wrote: No no, we've talked about: -Shavs -Coe -Atziri's Aquity -Low life -Crit -Daggers -ST -Auras And keep the insults coming if you want to be on probation. No that's what you've talked about. I've just told you how wrong you are. In any case, I've no interest in arguing with someone [Removed by Support] Look at the low-life builds, analyze their structure, maybe even.. I dunno... play one?? Come back then. Let's move this thread to reddit, [Removed by Support] honestly, no quality control here. That is what the community talked about and it's accurate. You're saying that you see the damage output of low life crit builds as a problem, but I think it's the context it's in all together that results in the damage output no? So I was curious about your suggestion but it was pretty hard to find one. Eventually I stumbled upon one of your post some days ago: " ST needs no major overhaul. Numbers are round about fine, maybe 20% up, 20% down - same thing. Wanders are around same clearspeed, same as Windrippers. However, whilst I disagree that low-life needs an overhaul - it doesn't, the concept is fine, expensive gear should return results - I consider the numbers utterly retarded. Just tweak the numbers, for e.g. atm - lowlife mirrored does about 200k GMP spectral - everyone would be perfectly happy if that was 80k. Non-mirrored setups still get their fun at around 40k. 40k is still uber-capable, it's still capable of creaming 78 maps - the numbers that low-life achieves now is just unnecessary. That's almost a 60% nerf. So you want to tune the damage output this build gets from low life a bit: That's great and I'm not even against that. So I don't see why you have a problem with me being against ST's design really, it is ontopic because this topic is about balancing a build. A build that uses ST too. Last edited by Startkabels#3733 on Jul 28, 2014, 11:12:24 AM	Posted by Startkabels#3733 on Jul 28, 2014, 11:07:18 AM Quote this Post
" Wubbietail wrote: It's pretty simple. Removing ST does not make lowlife + CoE builds any weaker. It's just a damage mechanism. Many would argue that wanders are outright better due to chain/easier charges/higher ranged single damage. All attack builds are unbalanced with it. ST being balanced or not is not important in that case. Better to focus on elements all these attack builds share which is CoE, bloodrage, pain attunement. Well I think it does make it weaker, but again I don' want ST changed because it makes this build too strong. I want it changed for the sake of class balance. Last edited by Startkabels#3733 on Jul 28, 2014, 11:10:21 AM	Posted by Startkabels#3733 on Jul 28, 2014, 11:08:38 AM Quote this Post
" Well I think it does make it weaker, but again I don' want ST changes because it makes this build too strong. I want it changes for the sake of class balance. I want ST changed too. Many people are arguing with you in this topic since the focus is not on ST though. It's on LL CoE which applies to all attack builds and gives x5 the DPS of other builds with mirrored gear. There is other topics discussing ST.	Posted by Wubbietail#2372 on Jul 28, 2014, 11:13:13 AM Quote this Post
" Wubbietail wrote: " Well I think it does make it weaker, but again I don' want ST changes because it makes this build too strong. I want it changes for the sake of class balance. I want ST changed too. Many people are arguing with you in this topic since the focus is not on ST though. It's on LL CoE which applies to all attack builds and gives x5 the DPS of other builds with mirrored gear. There is other topics discussing ST. its not gonna end bro.	Posted by Tom1989#3616 on Jul 28, 2014, 11:16:20 AM Quote this Post
Can you please explain exactly how ST mitigates reflect? I've played ST builds since it was released, and have seen no mitigation inherent in the skill's mechanics. Guild Leader The Amazon Basin <BASIN> Play Nice and Show Some Class www.theamazonbasin.com	Posted by mark1030#3643 on Jul 28, 2014, 11:18:45 AM Quote this Post
" Wubbietail wrote: " Well I think it does make it weaker, but again I don' want ST changes because it makes this build too strong. I want it changes for the sake of class balance. I want ST changed too. Many people are arguing with you in this topic since the focus is not on ST though. It's on LL CoE which applies to all attack builds and gives x5 the DPS of other builds with mirrored gear. There is other topics discussing ST. I'm deliberately posting here because I think the people who are concerned about the balance of a very expensive end game build being too powerful are mostly concerned about damage output and should care about what that means for balance also considering other classes such as melee builds, which are very under powered and limited in their options compared to this build and also get a slap in the face with ST's current design. And I'm not talking about end game builds, I'm talking about melee in general, right from the start of the game. This aspect is mostly completely ignored in my perception as is the factor effort and investment to make the build we're talking about. Last edited by Startkabels#3733 on Jul 28, 2014, 11:21:56 AM	Posted by Startkabels#3733 on Jul 28, 2014, 11:19:14 AM Quote this Post
" Startkabels wrote: I've never used Shavs, CoE, BR, CoC, CI, Atziri's Acuity. None of that No surprise this guy doesn't understand the situation that well. Last edited by Veruski#5480 on Jul 28, 2014, 11:24:09 AM	Posted by Veruski#5480 on Jul 28, 2014, 11:20:59 AM Quote this Post
Oh I understand perfectly, the situation is that we have a very expensive and powerful end game build and this topic is about balancing that build. And as you know balance involves more than just damage output, it also involves balance between classes for example :) Last edited by Startkabels#3733 on Jul 28, 2014, 11:28:26 AM	Posted by Startkabels#3733 on Jul 28, 2014, 11:23:43 AM Quote this Post
" as is the factor effort and investment to make the build we're talking about. Effort does not matter. The build's expense is a direct result of its power. " I'm deliberately posting here because I think the people who are concerned about the balance of a very expensive end game build being too powerful are mostly concerned about damage output and should care about what that means for balance also considering other classes such as melee builds, which are very under powered and limited in their options compared to this build and also get a slap in the face with ST's current design. And I'm not talking about end game builds, I'm talking about melee in general, right from the start of the game. Really confused what you're getting at. To me it looks like you're just derailing the topic for the last 10 pages on a crusade against spectral throw. People suggested things that only affect LL builds. Unless you're worried about LL melee builds?.. Melee being improved and spectral being more restricted are changes I welcome but LL builds have many different damage mechanisms and the general opinion is that it's overpowered with all attacks(not just ST). Damage mechanisms should not be the target in that situation, the actual build bonuses that enables it should be. Last edited by Wubbietail#2372 on Jul 28, 2014, 11:31:10 AM	Posted by Wubbietail#2372 on Jul 28, 2014, 11:28:06 AM Quote this Post
What? No the build's expense is a result of the rarity of items it uses. And expense is not the same as effort btw. You're not understanding me because I have a different idea of balance as most people active in this thread. I'm concerned about class balance in general while most are concerned about this specific build being OP. This is also the reason Veruski thinks he can disqualify my opinion by pointing out that I said I don't use this build at all. Last edited by Startkabels#3733 on Jul 28, 2014, 11:32:27 AM	Posted by Startkabels#3733 on Jul 28, 2014, 11:31:07 AM Quote this Post