I know more people that left because PoE is easy.

"
Worldbreaker wrote:

1. Legacy items:
2. Simplified Skill Tree:
3. Map drops:
4. Boss loot buffs:
5. Eternal Orbs:
6. Trade indexers:
7. Base item craft buff:
8. 6 link buffs:
9. Upcoming unique "buff":


I think it's a very good question to ask what it is meant by the terms "difficult" or "easy" in this context. I noticed none of these 9 points are related to the life and death of a character- combat difficulty. So what kind of difficulty is it that we're talking about here? I will attempt to classify:

1. Difficulty of acquiring legacy items? Trade prices? Not sure how to classify this one.
2. Difficulty of calculating an optimal path
3. Difficulty of maintaining supplies
4. Difficulty of finding items
5. Difficulty of boosting items
6. Difficulty of trading items
7. Difficulty of finding items
8. Difficulty of boosting items
9. Difficulty of finding items

6 of 9 are complaints are about the item grind, namely that it is "too easy." I question whether a grind is accurately described by the word "difficulty." I say a better descriptor would be the label "time-consuming." It's more of a question of how much time the game demands of the player before reaching various goals, and there's nothing hardcore about increasing that number of hours, nor casual about decreasing the quota. No skills are demonstrated either way, and skill is what differentiates hardcore from casual, not time investment.
That's nice. For every person you claim quit because it was "Too EZ," I can provide 5 who quit because too much RNG is too much RNG, myself included.
Anarchy/Onslaught T shirt
Domination/Nemesis T shirt
Tempest/War Bands T shirt
"
reboticon wrote:
That's nice. For every person you claim quit because it was "Too EZ," I can provide 5 who quit because too much RNG is too much RNG, myself included.


That's nice, when things are too easy people tend to just move on to more challenging things, where when things are challenging, people are more likely to complain that it is too hard.

Also on the same note, I said in the OP that you didn't read, they made the game easier and just dumped bad RNG on top of it to compensate that "hardcore" feel, where everyone knows it's bullshit.

Considering your achievements last two seasons, I don't think you should be complaining about anything, unless of course you paid for them.

"
PolarisOrbit wrote:
"
Worldbreaker wrote:

1. Legacy items:
2. Simplified Skill Tree:
3. Map drops:
4. Boss loot buffs:
5. Eternal Orbs:
6. Trade indexers:
7. Base item craft buff:
8. 6 link buffs:
9. Upcoming unique "buff":


I think it's a very good question to ask what it is meant by the terms "difficult" or "easy" in this context. I noticed none of these 9 points are related to the life and death of a character- combat difficulty. So what kind of difficulty is it that we're talking about here? I will attempt to classify:

1. Difficulty of acquiring legacy items? Trade prices? Not sure how to classify this one.
2. Difficulty of calculating an optimal path
3. Difficulty of maintaining supplies
4. Difficulty of finding items
5. Difficulty of boosting items
6. Difficulty of trading items
7. Difficulty of finding items
8. Difficulty of boosting items
9. Difficulty of finding items

6 of 9 are complaints are about the item grind, namely that it is "too easy." I question whether a grind is accurately described by the word "difficulty." I say a better descriptor would be the label "time-consuming." It's more of a question of how much time the game demands of the player before reaching various goals, and there's nothing hardcore about increasing that number of hours, nor casual about decreasing the quota. No skills are demonstrated either way, and skill is what differentiates hardcore from casual, not time investment.


Ok, when you find something other than what I mentioned in PoE that is challenging from the game itself let me know. If they increase the amount of loot they hand out, it makes the game easier, whatever that loot is.
Last edited by Worldbreaker on May 20, 2014, 10:29:43 AM
Yes, sadly this game squandered all of its best ideas.

The web - now a overly complex skill tree which only *really* serves to screw over new players. Old players understand that the webs purpose is to put a lot of camouflage over a pretty linear system. The fact that GGG admitted to screwing the web system because people found it to complicated.. that still pisses me off.

Crafting - had so much potential. Originally created to avoid gold due to gold becoming nothing but a needless sink, and has now itself become largely a needless sink. When new players are told not to particpate in the 'crafting' system but instead save all of their orbs (currency/gold) to just buy items... sad. Just sad. GGG is apparently convinced that the only way to keep players is to make upgrading a abhorrently painful process, and I do not understand where that sentiment comes from.

Uniques - used as a lure to bring in cash for GGG, they were then forced to deal with the Pandora's box they opened by allowing people to create their own items in a game that was far from finished (even at 'release') and then had to deal with the repercussions by creating two tiers of players.


"the premier Action RPG for hardcore gamers."
-GGG

Happy hunting/fishing
"
Worldbreaker wrote:


Also on the same note, I said in the OP that you didn't read, they made the game easier and just dumped bad RNG on top of it to compensate that "hardcore" feel, where everyone knows it's bullshit.

.




QFT QFT QFT QFT
"the premier Action RPG for hardcore gamers."
-GGG

Happy hunting/fishing
The challenge of PoE is navigating around the noob traps like casting speed on the passive tree. Once you understand what's pointless and what's not, the game is mostly just a time sink of gear-checks. More skill based boss encounters would be cool, but there's only so much 'challenge' that can be squeezed from the point and click format. Especially a point and click game that may or may not respond to your commands in a timely fashion, and isn't showing you the actual game, but instead a close approximation of it.
No. Calm down. Learn to enjoy losing.
Wittgenstein - nice to have you back and posting, hadn't seen you around in a while (could just be me!).

Curious, would you play in an optional SFL (with limited time trading to party members present when drop occurs, a la D3 RoS) and less cumbersome access to Regrets? The theory being:

- play->find gear->adapt spec->play, rather than:

- design optimal spec->trade/RMT->play->bored

p.
Last edited by mrpetrov on May 20, 2014, 10:43:02 AM
"
Worldbreaker wrote:

"
kruemel2222 wrote:
TBH, I can't agree with anything the OP has written. Maybe I am doing something wrong, but, for example, in 2 years of playing I haven't found a single 6l and every attempt to craft one resulted in an empty stash and a 3l. The same applies to pretty much every other point.

You make it sound like you get everything handed on the silver platter once you have reached the end-game but in my experience it is exactly the other way around. Extremely grindy and unrewarding.


The game was like this back in CB, and you supported, it was still similar in OB and you donated, between mid OB and now the game has been made easier and easier. You came here for a hardcore ARPG, GGG didn't tell you "we are making this shit easier later, just bear with us" back then, yet you stayed. Why all of a sudden do you claim it to be grindy and unrewarding with it was WORSE back then?

I agree to a point, it is grindy, thats the root of an ARPG. Grind out craft mats, grind out gear, kill stuff, grind mats, grind gear, kill stuff faster.

Mapping is unrewarding in terms of the actual loot that drops, when put into comparison with boss farming. Honestly if you don't care about XP, there is no reason for you to ever map when you can just have Dominus serve you loot buffets all day without investing currency to run him.


Well, there is more than the end-game. Actually, as far as progression is concerned, there is a nice and interesting phase between cruel and mid mapping when you still find upgrades and your build starts to work because you finally have enough passives and supports.
That's something I have always liked about the game.

However, at some point progression stops. At least it has always stopped for me. I faceroll the same low level maps all day long because I can't find higher level ones. Every attempt to get more than 4 links ends up as a disaster. When I find a unique it is trash. When I check an indexer I see that I can buy items that are better than anything I have found so far for a couple of chaos orbs. I have yet to find an eternal orb. And so on.

You see, that is a lot of stuff that is too easy according to you and I wouldn't mind if some of it would become even easier.
"
mrpetrov wrote:
Wittgenstein - nice to have you back and posting, hadn't seen you around in a while (could just be me!).

Curious, would you play in an optional SFL (with limited time trading to party members present when drop occurs, a la D3 RoS) and less cumbersome access to Regrets? The theory being:

- play->find gear->adapt spec->play, rather than:

- design optimal spec->trade/RMT->play->bored

p.



Yes, yes I would. I always lurk the forums during my morning coffee break :)

Personally I never played D2 in a multiplayer way except for limited runs with RL friends. D2 was popular during the dial-up days if you remember that time and my house only had 1 line.
"the premier Action RPG for hardcore gamers."
-GGG

Happy hunting/fishing
"
kruemel2222 wrote:
"
Worldbreaker wrote:

"
kruemel2222 wrote:
TBH, I can't agree with anything the OP has written. Maybe I am doing something wrong, but, for example, in 2 years of playing I haven't found a single 6l and every attempt to craft one resulted in an empty stash and a 3l. The same applies to pretty much every other point.

You make it sound like you get everything handed on the silver platter once you have reached the end-game but in my experience it is exactly the other way around. Extremely grindy and unrewarding.


The game was like this back in CB, and you supported, it was still similar in OB and you donated, between mid OB and now the game has been made easier and easier. You came here for a hardcore ARPG, GGG didn't tell you "we are making this shit easier later, just bear with us" back then, yet you stayed. Why all of a sudden do you claim it to be grindy and unrewarding with it was WORSE back then?

I agree to a point, it is grindy, thats the root of an ARPG. Grind out craft mats, grind out gear, kill stuff, grind mats, grind gear, kill stuff faster.

Mapping is unrewarding in terms of the actual loot that drops, when put into comparison with boss farming. Honestly if you don't care about XP, there is no reason for you to ever map when you can just have Dominus serve you loot buffets all day without investing currency to run him.


Well, there is more than the end-game. Actually, as far as progression is concerned, there is a nice and interesting phase between cruel and mid mapping when you still find upgrades and your build starts to work because you finally have enough passives and supports.
That's something I have always liked about the game.

However, at some point progression stops. At least it has always stopped for me. I faceroll the same low level maps all day long because I can't find higher level ones. Every attempt to get more than 4 links ends up as a disaster. When I find a unique it is trash. When I check an indexer I see that I can buy items that are better than anything I have found so far for a couple of chaos orbs. I have yet to find an eternal orb. And so on.

You see, that is a lot of stuff that is too easy according to you and I wouldn't mind if some of it would become even easier.


You say you faceroll maps, only blocked by finding more, which have been increased (try rolling just packsize blue maps).

Don't try linking gear you are wearing if you are dependant on the current link setup, work on seperate ones in your stash.

"Trash" uniques are trash because they drop far too often. The amount of uniques that drop should be reduced at higher levels, higher in the beginning of the game then tapering down along with the odds of those lower ones dropping in end game.

If you can buy items to progress, go for it. Trade is a game mechanic, they balance your drops around it, why gimp yourself? On the flip side, if you want to play self found, don't compare your gear to the massive amounts other players have found as a collective vs you as a single player.

To your credit, solo play does need to be more rewarding. If the doubling unique drop rate started at solo play and tapered off the more people in a group, it would have been more than welcome in my book. I am more worried about culler groups littering the market with these items like the "trash" uniques, and depreciating the value of items solo players find, also making the gap much wider between god tier uniques and the rest.

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