I know more people that left because PoE is easy.
" Right, it's the special Olympics, while Dota 2 is the official Olympics, and HoN is a high school regional. |
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" Except LoL is such a complex game that no single player can master every relevant aspect of it. There is simply not enough time. This is why the top teams have dedicated analysts (not players in the team) whose job is to watch through and analyze top game after top game and then feed conclusions to the players, while the players themselves focus on learning the match-ups and mechanics and applying knowledge in scrim. (edited to add-in scrim part :), point is a top player doesn't have time to watch through every relevant top game) This message was delivered by GGG defence force. Last edited by mazul on May 22, 2014, 10:59:28 PM
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" Lol was always viewed as more casual because it plays at 3/4 the speed HoN did. If that changed, so be it. It doesn't change the fact S2 buried their own game by trying to be hardcore, eventually meeting in the middle and losing its player base. Maybe that won't happen here, I dunno, it was an example. The big reason I made this is because one of my last closed beta buddies "Zire" came back just to leave because of upcoming changes that I put in my signature, and he wasn't the only one to have left over ease of play changes. |
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It's easier to make the game hard for yourself then it is to do the opposite.
Just ----- saying. That is to say, if you get good RNG and are blessed by RNGesus, renounce him and be done with it. I thought this game was pretty easy from the moment i started, not in aquiring wealth or anything, but just, the monsters, mechanics etc. I started my first char in hardcore and he did not die, knowing not of this game. So what do i do? I limit myself and enforce own rule-sets on my characters to increase difficulty. Not hard to implement, you just need some character to stick with them i suppose. Just to say, it is easier for you to make the game harder on yourself then it is for somebody that has a hard time to make it easier on him. Peace. Freedom is not worth having if it does not include the freedom to make mistakes
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" Well, I can't compare to HoN, but if we compare base delay between attacks in LoL and Dota2: 1.6 vs 1.7 seconds. I.e. LoL in general has a higher attack speed. (This is relevant, because you must of course move between each autoattack to reposition, this means that in LoL you have to on average reposition more than you do in Dota2) Teleportation to desired allied structure is easier in Dota 2 than LoL. In LoL, you can tele to a friendly structure if you chose "teleport" as summoner spell in pre-game selection, but with a 300 s cooldown. In Dota2, you can buy portal scroll which has similar effect but only 65 s cooldown. What this means is that bad rotations are punished far heavier in LoL than in Dota, and that DotA can feel more "fast-paced" due to the ability to teleport to allied structure being so much easier. Edit: Have no idea if the movement speed of the champions/heroes in each game are similar. What I do notice is that the time it takes for the allied creeps to leave their spawning point and reach the enemy creeps, to be similar in time if we compare both games. This message was delivered by GGG defence force. Last edited by mazul on May 23, 2014, 12:20:43 AM
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" Heroes of Newerth failed miserably because they allowed the opinions of high level players to hold too much sway over how balancing should be. Testie, Jah, EternalEnvy, Tralf, Trixie, etc. all had way too much say in how the game should be balanced (especially early with Chu, Testie, Tabako, Warden, etc.) and resulted in the fucked up game that it was. Then you had incompetent balance members like JohnnyUtah (formerly Remstar in Dota 1), and then Dancing or w/e the fuck his name was who got stomped by my CAL-I team routinely in DotA 1. The game failed because the balance was completely awful and one sided/slanted towards a bunch of elitists that are pretty much nobodies in DotA 2 now (with exception of Hanni and his team / EternalEnvy). IceFrog succeeds because he doesn't take professional player opinion as the be all end all of opinions. He has his own set of super testers that he has groomed throughout the years who help him balance things out, and the process to become one is not easy. Changes such as the Torturer changes that reduced his animations, the ridiculous buffs to CM/Glacius, along with a few other changes (such as jacking around with Valkryie/Mirana which made her 100x better than her DotA 1/DotA 2 counterpart), etc. were all due to 'professional/high level' player feedback. HoN is a perfect example of why you shouldn't listen to your elitist ass community, because it kills your game off. And before you go saying I'm some casual scrub, I used to routinely put Chu and Testie in their place in the closed beta. They were nobodies in DotA, and were only big in HoN because the pond was too small. Once real players started showing up like Levent and Hanni, they quickly became nobodies. HoN is a perfect example of what GGG should not do, and that's not to listen to the elitist community that has multiple 6Ls/Ultra Rare Uniques that say the game is fine, don't worry about it. Invasion is fine, blah blah blah. The problem is that GGG themselves come from an elitist background, so it's hard for them to not listen to opinions that actually are quite similar to theirs. Issue is that you just kill off your game this way. Both DoTA 2 and League of Legends are incredibly popular because they do to a certain extent cater to their casual players (LoL more than DotA 2, but plenty of changes have been in made in DotA specifically because a certain hero dominated pubs way too much). Last edited by allbusiness on May 23, 2014, 12:29:40 AM
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" The game was more popular back when you say it was shit. You can bring up the early days to compare and that's where the game was at its prime. You cannot say that heroes weren't nerfed because of noobs, look at Monkey King, Predator, Lego, Flux and RA. They were easy to focus down in teams, yet the casual/solo queue players got them pushed to garbage tier. So then, smurfing wasn't fun, noobs didn't feel powerful and the competitive scene was limited to choosing which hero's of the 20 viable they were going to ban. They also never listened to Testie, JohnnyUtah was terrible I agree, but SBT's were the source for balance, and you only needed to be over 1750 to have a say. Once the fun hero's were nerfed because "scrubs" couldn't counter and solo queue couldn't get organized. Them turning it F2P, Making legacy accounts pay for early access and nerfing fun hero's. It had nothing to do with the competitive scene, queuing at 1880 was a joke. They promised something and didn't deliver. Everything you said was when it was at its peak. I love how you called me elitist when all I want personally is balance. What reason is there to create my own challenge if there is absolutely no increased reward in comparison to the risk I am creating myself? Want me to challenge myself, give me a reason to. Off-topic: I kinda miss watching moonmeander. :( feels like nostalgia. Last edited by Worldbreaker on May 23, 2014, 2:50:17 AM
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" The reward is a PoE that is not "easy" by your standards, given your post, one would think that is enough "reward" for you? One would think that creating your own challenges and beating those would give a sense of accomplishment and joy. Agreed, you wont get a coockie for it. Neither do i. I still enjoy enforcing rule-sets on my characters, like famine, self-found etc... Like i said, your issue is easy to overcome, create your own difficulty. The other side of the coin is not as easy. Edit : also one would think that a hardcore player (like you depict yourself in this thread) would need no rewards for a hardcore experience. Kind of weird you ask a coockie for enforcing rules on yourself to make the game harder. '-.- Freedom is not worth having if it does not include the freedom to make mistakes Last edited by Boem on May 23, 2014, 2:59:33 AM
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" Personal satisfaction, the same reason some like to play large, open maps in online shooters with a shotgun, it requires a different approach, it's more fun AND you feel like a total badass when you nab a positive score :) You know, honestly, if I ever actively pursued uber gear and munchkin builds I'd probably get bored and leave a long, long time ago too. Hardcore-ness of GGG team aside and their design intentions, I agree the game has no staying power in the crowd you're talking about. Johnnies are surely getting their money's worth as it's possible to make an underdog setup reasonably good. Spikes are probably at home in races, that's all well and good too. But the game just isn't working for Timmies, once you get those big numbers and big booms you want to see the game has nothing more to offer, playing it just isn't any fun. I'd honestly recommend Timmies to play as long as it holds and then move on to something else, it isn't getting any more interesting from there and it most likely won't ever improve. Wish the armchair developers would go back to developing armchairs.
◄[www.moddb.com/mods/balancedux]► ◄[www.moddb.com/mods/one-vision1]► | |
" I have stayed through all those changes Boem, I create my own difficulty every four months starting over and the only difficulty put in front of us "maps" that we can make as difficult as we want, is the least rewarding. Gear progression is my drive to play the game, at the end of leagues I give my stuff away in standard and start over. I do think that the guy a page or two back hit the problem on the head. Maybe I know too much, play to well and get "lucky" enough. Maybe it's time for a break myself. |
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