What this Passive-Reset Proves.

"

Khan111 wrote:

It appears the op is in fact angry at the current system.

Rightly so. From what I have gleaned off the thread, its not respecs he wants to fix any possible mistakes, but be able to SEE the changes a passive provides before applying the point to see if its even worth it. The only place one can currently see that is on third party programs.

That, is a valid complaint. Currently its a archaic clunky way of handling it from over ten years ago and has no real reason of currently being in the game. Is it in fact to much to ask to be able to see a toons stats wile having the passive tree up?

Would it be truly bad to have a built in game wiki to help the new players understand the game? Hell it doesn't even have to have everything right off the bat, but could unlock sections as the player finds and starts using these mechanics.

Edit: I to would be pissed off if I re rolled a toon and found out that the new build I am going to use I am unable to due to not meeting stat requirements, and not having a single idea on where those requirements start as I have ZERO ways of viewing them inside of the game with the tree. That alone provides a needless delete of the toon and a re roll that truly can be avoid.

Edit 2: This system, when some thought is put into it, is meant to chase off the new players, yet they release content for said new players to retain them. Wile they still will not address the issues that are chasing the vast majority of players that they could have had away in the first place.

I do not know of any game that gives you all of the information about it in the game. Where you even get all of the tools necessary to make an optimal build for whatever purpose. You would still need to go to other sites in order to do that. There are hundreds of games like that today so this is not unusual you have to get use to the fact that if you want to make an optimal build you need to put in more effort to do so. Even the information in D2 did not give you the perfect optimized build. Because their damage formula was on their official site and not in the game.

"

Khan111 wrote:

It appears the op is in fact angry at the current system.

Rightly so. From what I have gleaned off the thread, its not respecs he wants to fix any possible mistakes, but be able to SEE the changes a passive provides before applying the point to see if its even worth it. The only place one can currently see that is on third party programs.

That, is a valid complaint. Currently its a archaic clunky way of handling it from over ten years ago and has no real reason of currently being in the game. Is it in fact to much to ask to be able to see a toons stats wile having the passive tree up?

Would it be truly bad to have a built in game wiki to help the new players understand the game? Hell it doesn't even have to have everything right off the bat, but could unlock sections as the player finds and starts using these mechanics.

Edit: I to would be pissed off if I re rolled a toon and found out that the new build I am going to use I am unable to due to not meeting stat requirements, and not having a single idea on where those requirements start as I have ZERO ways of viewing them inside of the game with the tree. That alone provides a needless delete of the toon and a re roll that truly can be avoid.

Edit 2: This system, when some thought is put into it, is meant to chase off the new players, yet they release content for said new players to retain them. Wile they still will not address the issues that are chasing the vast majority of players that they could have had away in the first place.

ahhhhhhhhh such relief........... after reading so much baseless crap from people here, i see you did take your time trying to understand what i am trying to get through here. Thank you.

People here seem to think that doing something outside the game is perfectly fine, but doing it inside the game is wrong?

How do people here rationalize it?

When we all got the reset, all the Gear was unusable, so the starts wouldn't apply until i LOCKED enough points to get all non-red. Is this what they expect me to do with the 1 respec they gave us? The only changes yo u can see are " Str,int,dex changes and +hp +mana +ES. The most unimportant changes, that they could bother to implement lol,but nothing with detail. Why didn't they just bother making it some other way which actually made any sense..


People here also have the illusion that re rolling teaches you lessons, when the lesson is learnt when i die to the skeletons 15 times with my guy and then instead of trying till i succeed, they just expect me to give all of that work up, re roll the same class again, Do the EASY PART AGAIN to reach the same level with the same gear (if not better) and on the same class..... i can already replay the game 21 times if i just play each class to level 60 anyways. I do not think they need to shove more replay up our butts.


and true, this skill tree is one reason for the "handicapping" of this game, in the sense of player population. they say " Only the best Players will get to the top,etc", when as a matter of fact,

All i have to do is :

Go to http://www.randyrun.com/Path-of-Exile/Orbs-Currency/30-x-Orb-of-Regret::139954.html

Select the amount of orbs i need to buy, buy them, apply them, go online, google "most op post Vaal patch build"

Go to http://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/816178

Copy build.

(and the passive tree does not "PREVENT" me from ever doing this, all i need to do is make a new character haha, but then again People here still somehow think that is does actually stop people from copying other builds) but then again, that wouldn't be the dumbest thing people here have thought of, haha :B

... but here i am. trying to make it a solution for others who don't even know these tools exist and keep getting exploited by other people because this game is "Too hardcore to give Decent Descriptions in game".


Its funny when i typed "most op build", google autofilled it as "Most op build in path of exile" lol, proving that how many people actually google that crap haha.


They can either Allow us to see _Every visible change in the character that takes place while allocating points in game_(they can use all the extra space on the sides to add the "C" page to it but they don't seem to be thinking enough)..

or

Just allow us a one reset per week option where we can try making changes to the builds every once a week, Or maybe GGG is just gonna keep it like this, Because it makes people go BUY the RESET with REAL MONEY. But the REAL FUNNY part about it is that people here seem to be perfectly fine with the online "every item in game available for purchase" idea, but oppose a reset.


hehe Funny people, don't you say so? :P

"

But then again, you can't base what you think is good on the standards of another game, If the only good reason you have is a reset will make the game easier, then you haven't even tried to see how it is actually a harder mode than Diable or the current PoE. Instead of being allowed to skip hard to play characters by making new ones, you keep coming back to try on the same character every time, the need to research builds becomes unimportant, (people who wanna copy will still copy as they do now).

Why don't you just acknowledge the fact that What the Current game does right now, is give you one try to not fuck up, which is connected to the need to grind again for days. Look, It's ok if Some people just like to spend several hours spending leveling or farming for regret orbs.

But there comes a point where you think " I know this game is a waste of time like every other game, from an existential point of view, but i think this extra grinding crap and

Probably 1 in 1,000,000 Chance of a Mirror of Kalandra dropping. But Tell me whether this game was made with more focus on Difficulty or grinding time? I think it might be latter, with the way everything looks to be designed in this game.I guess nobody bothers looking for the mirrors haha and just buys them, guess that's planned too.

Please, i will slap anyone who dares say that The current mode actually gives "challenge". Please, someone PROVE IT IN ONE SENTENCE, A SENTENCE THAT CONTAINS NOTHING ELSE BUT THE REASON FOR THIS BEING A BETTER OPTION THAN MY PURPOSED IDEA.


haha its funny when you say the tree doesn't show yo uthe perfect optimal build. But all the sites and the tools do, which all you have to do is alt-tab in and apply. SO PLEASE, ACCEPT the fact that the game fails at not handing people stuff, Its just more "INDIRECT", through other tools. " hey hey, look all these items are too low on drop rates, why not just go buy them, YEAH On a SECOND NOTE, I WANNA ASK you ; Why are you so against this But still say nothing about the win shops that the GAME ALLOWS TO RUN!

Show me where D2 was not the same. Show me where you were allowed to have a character that you could take through and never have the play the content again. That's right where you would never have to go from normal to hell for any reason. The closest you have to that is the respec option that was added in later in the game. And even then you had to burn all three respecs from Akara along with farming to get the essences in order to get more respecs. Plain and simple answer here is you hate re-rolling and we get that already.

Challenge is according to each individual player's point of view. One might equate challenge to a game that is loaded with twitch mechanics that take perfect timing and placement. Others would equate challenge in the area of building the perfect character according to one's personal play style. Still others would equate it to the monsters that you fight in the game. Still others would say it would be a little of all of the above and then some. What I am saying here is that there is no wrong answer when you consider that all players are not the same.

On the subject of tools and planners. i have had a few planners for a game that has been shut down since November 2012 City of Heroes. Would it give you a perfect optimized build for the class and power sets you choose? Of course not, because even though I never did find out how to fully optimize every power I knew that some powers would take different types of enhancements to fully max them out. Some would take invention sets, Hammidon, and some SO's to fully max them out. Which no doubt in time changed as they added in new enhancements from time to time.

No build planner for that game gave that information to you. You would still have to look it up on another site copying and pasting it to your planner. Or worse you would have to break out the spreadsheets to math it out on your own.

Even City of Heroes never gave you exact damage numbers. Powers were listed from minor damage to high damage.

"

DoomCarpace wrote:

"

Khan111 wrote:

It appears the op is in fact angry at the current system.

Rightly so. From what I have gleaned off the thread, its not respecs he wants to fix any possible mistakes, but be able to SEE the changes a passive provides before applying the point to see if its even worth it. The only place one can currently see that is on third party programs.

That, is a valid complaint. Currently its a archaic clunky way of handling it from over ten years ago and has no real reason of currently being in the game. Is it in fact to much to ask to be able to see a toons stats wile having the passive tree up?

Would it be truly bad to have a built in game wiki to help the new players understand the game? Hell it doesn't even have to have everything right off the bat, but could unlock sections as the player finds and starts using these mechanics.

Edit: I to would be pissed off if I re rolled a toon and found out that the new build I am going to use I am unable to due to not meeting stat requirements, and not having a single idea on where those requirements start as I have ZERO ways of viewing them inside of the game with the tree. That alone provides a needless delete of the toon and a re roll that truly can be avoid.

Edit 2: This system, when some thought is put into it, is meant to chase off the new players, yet they release content for said new players to retain them. Wile they still will not address the issues that are chasing the vast majority of players that they could have had away in the first place.

I do not know of any game that gives you all of the information about it in the game. Where you even get all of the tools necessary to make an optimal build for whatever purpose. You would still need to go to other sites in order to do that. There are hundreds of games like that today so this is not unusual you have to get use to the fact that if you want to make an optimal build you need to put in more effort to do so. Even the information in D2 did not give you the perfect optimized build. Because their damage formula was on their official site and not in the game.

yeah once again, don't compare games, staph.

You seem to have some warped idea that if you do anything

No game will tell you 'EVERYTHING', but it """"MUST"""" Tell you enough as to not make using third party tools A COMPLETE INEVITABLE NECESSITY ! Let's Forget about "all information", and focus on what it "DOES SHOW" right now while planning a passive tree(you know this is not gonna end nicely for you):



It shows the FLAT NUMERICAL changes like +10 int +10hp in your base stats, int,str,dex,mana,hp But needing you to LOCK any points you spend IF YOU WANNA SEE ANYTHING ELSE.



Now lets talk about what it doesn't show : EVERYTHING ELSE. For a company who boasts about their almighty Passive tree, They sure as hell Don't know how to make it informative enough.


another Reality check : You go to the third party softwares BECAUSE THE DEVELOPERS HAVE FAILED AT PROVIDING YOU WITH A GOOD ENOUGH PASSIVE TREE HAHA, YOU DEFEND IT, AT THE SAME TIME IGNORING IT AND USING SOMETHING BETTER TO HELP YOURSELF. DEAL WITH IT. (Doing which you admit that the game has a crap tree, which is the sore reason why you alt-tab to another one.)


And don't bother using Diablo2, a game that released 14 years ago haha. GGG Copied their Map design that was over 15 years old and Haven't made a single visible change to it. The inventory is the same, no innovation put into it. I can probably come up with a better inventory option in 20 minutes than they have EVER managed to in the past 2, hahaha. Item rarities don't differ, Acts are laid out in the same way, Interface is pretty much the same, so are the Crappy drop rates and Terrible Roll odds, which are obviously made that way to keep you in the game. HAve fun.


But i do acknowledge this game as a Hidden Pay to Win now, thanks to you. You made me do research on the game, and the communities connected to the games, making me realise that it is such a huge chain of people so used to and dependent on online stores and online guides, that they can't even handle the possibility of becoming completely independent form all the other shit, but i GUESS GGG DOESNT WANT THAT, HAHAH.

Someone wants a better, more detailed passive tree and people chew on the OP? We have sunk into a new low people! GGG isn't perfect you know. Will that stop me from playing the game? HECK NO! Feedback exists for a reason.

OP wants info to be seen in-game. IMO that info should have been there in the first place. A lot needs to go into this game's UI, especially with the passive tree. You can't see the effects of your choices before making them final. That is bad. That is the reason why people have to go through third party sites if they want to see the nuances of their build choice. This site's tree is good enough for rough drafts and plans, nothing more. And no, this is not asking to be spoonfed info, it's asking to have info shown where the info should have been in the first place. Sometimes it feels like the game is deliberately obfuscating stuff from you.

"

larkstongue wrote:

You're way too damn focused on an issue that isn't going to be resolved by whatever ideas you may have. Paid resets are entirely unnecessary for this style of game. The "challenge" you're referring to is completely subjective and besides, if you've fucked up the toon so completely that the quest-given refunds and a few regret orbs wouldn't resolve the build, you're really not playing the same character upon reroll.

HAHAHAHAHAH "unnecessary", that is what you just said, HAHAHAHAHAH! You don't think they are WRONG, just UNNECESSARY , HAHAHA!

OH man haha, Now you suddenly accept the online stores as something that "Can't be resolved".

"Unnecessary" haha but not "Bad"? Hahahahahahs Your mind is so funny in the ways it makes exceptions and accepts certain aspects and denies the others of the same value. HAHA you funny man.

Yeah but i an never gonna have to re roll, Because this game FAILS AT DOING THAT. Because Either i'll just stop playing till another reset is made available, or jut spend 30 $ and get a full reset on the same character, and maybe throw in 10-15$ more to pick up a few uniques, OH BUT THIS MUST BE FAIR AND OK, SINCE IT IS ALLOWED RIGHT NOW , RIGHT? HAHA Try thinking for yourself.

if the challenge is So subjective, then why have you been whining to me about it this whole time?

Your Dear passive tree Doesn't do SHIT to Stop Copiers, Pay 2 win, Recipe abuse, 3rd party software abuse on people who are not told about said tools.

Get your fucking sense of morality and rational thinking right, you keep making these exceptions to your case, i hope this isn't the way you are in real life too.


Discussing this matter any further with you will only degrade my brain cells.

"

allionus wrote:

Oh yes,

I believe i have found out a proper summarisation of this game.

-People think grinding normal-merciless is "challenging".


-People think that using tools and guides to build the perfect tree is OK, as long as you do it OUTSIDE THE GAME (and then come and apply it in game)



-People seem to not mention the SHOPS, EVER. Well i guess that doesn't make the game Pay to Win, a SHOP, where you can Buy ANYTHING IN THE GAME (even resets). THis is a current offer from the site :



20 x Chaos Orb
2,02 USD

Exalted Orb
2,22 USD

Vaal Orb
3,03 USD

Oh wow, 20 Chaos orbs for jusr 2 Dollars. haha THIS ISNT PAY TO WIN, FAGIT, THIS IS GAME MECHANIK U NOE NOTHIG FAGIT, IZ IN GAEM ALL TIEM, IS NATUREL, IS GODE, WOWE, SUCH BALANCE,
NO Paye to wowe
Just Honest
No Biased
Much acknowledgement.
such lel.


-People think that introducing a weekly reset would make the game easier, without even having decent proof or any counter-argument.

-People seem to think that this game is competing with DIalbo 3 haha.

- And the above idea leads people to Defend this game without reason and like mad fanboys from anything and everything thinking that any idea introduced will fuck this game, and just take everything the devs throw at them and swallow it like it's a snickers bar,


-The devs have failed to implement a Market Zone, where they can sell items, instead of Spamming LOCAL PARTIES TO SELL ITEMS, and People spending all day on Trade Chat spamming the same shit, instead the people who wanna sell and buy can just Tp to a zone and set up their shops and players can visit accordingly, BUT NO, THE GAME IS SOOOOOOO PERFECT 10/10 would fanboy innit?







You people need to take a good fucking look at this game and then come talk to me about how i am wrong.



It's like PoE is Christianity, Diablo 3 is Islam and i am critical thinking, but every time i try to help christianity fix itself by introducing clearly better ideas, they keep screaming to me : "WE DON'T WANNA BECOME LIKE ISLAM(diablo 3,) WE ARE HAPPY THE WAY WE ARE"!!! SHOO !! STOP BREAKING THE ILLUSION OF OUR PERFECT WORLD....


i think i have come to realise that some people protect this game like religion, like fools.


HEy Chop Chop Fagits, I ain't got all day, i am done talking properly now.

Assturds buying items online, buying resets online, buying maps online, buying builds online, Armour/weapons, Stealing builds online... OH WAIT, i meant "Research", haha THEN THEY COME TO ME AND TELL ME HOW THE PASSIVE TREE CHANGE IS GONNA FUCK UP THIS GAME HAHAHAAHAA. NEWS FLASH, IT'S NOT DOING TOO GREAT RIGHT NOW EITHER

Anyone who thinks i am wrong, Make a NON-QUOTE post, and Only write material that proves ME WRONG ABOUT EVERYTHING I WROTE HERE. Not wrong to fanboys, but to people who actually think while making decisions.

First of all, all games that I know of have some form of a d2jsp third party websites that if you use them you will get your account banned. So why should this game be any different. You did not give us any new info on that point just rehashing what we already know.

I guess you do not understand that some builds are gonna be optimized for certain things. Some builds are gonna be better optimized for leveling. Others for end game mapping. Still others for Piety runs. Some will be better for beating Atziri. And having a weekly reset will allow players to shift their build around according to how they feel for that given week. Which means that there will be no meaningful choice that you had to make that cannot be undone without spending hours farming for orbs or cough cough re-rolling.

Next I never said that this game competes with D3. All I said that D3 is easier and does not have the depth in building a character like this game does. In fact according to those that hate D3 (not me) will tell you that this game blows D3 out of the water.

Oh and every player to come up with an idea will be the greatest idea ever and should be instantly implemented. Well news flash everyone has a boner of a idea from time to time. But the problem with you is that you are not man enough to admit when you have a bad idea for this game.

A real man would admit it and move on with his life. I have done that in other games that I have made a suggestion and someone gave good proof as to why it was a bad suggestion.

Also when you try to say hey you need to be just like me you will get a lot of people angry at you regardless of the type of person that you are. Just like religion you should let your actions be what causes people to want to be like you instead of saying hey I am right be just like me. Sorry but all of the insults in the world or anything else you try will not work as good as actions that show your way is better.

I believe that if we were face to face or you were in a room with all of the ones that have replied to you you would not use as much bad language as you have done throughout this entire thread. So your insulting ways have not changed. Sure you do try to keep a civil tongue. But make some replies that will show us that you can go for an entire posts without acting like a spoiled child. No better than that acting like a spoiled child that talks like Richard Prior used to talk when telling jokes.

"

vulcanfury12 wrote:

Someone wants a better, more detailed passive tree and people chew on the OP? We have sunk into a new low people! GGG isn't perfect you know. Will that stop me from playing the game? HECK NO! Feedback exists for a reason.

OP wants info to be seen in-game. IMO that info should have been there in the first place. A lot needs to go into this game's UI, especially with the passive tree. You can't see the effects of your choices before making them final. That is bad. That is the reason why people have to go through third party sites if they want to see the nuances of their build choice. This site's tree is good enough for rough drafts and plans, nothing more. And no, this is not asking to be spoonfed info, it's asking to have info shown where the info should have been in the first place. Sometimes it feels like the game is deliberately obfuscating stuff from you.

Exactly haha :D. Most people here are just too used to taking every mistake or shortcoming of this game as a "challenge", lel. I think they are all just paranoid about "PoE becoming like Diablo 3", and use other random and baseless excuses to oppose this idea, but they again forget that POE exists because diablo exists. That will never change no matter what everyone here tries to tell themselves :P.

The thing is, people here say " you don't need all that info in the game, you can just get it from Forums and other sites. But I didn't join a hardcore arpg to Tab out and spend my time searching the inter webs on how to kill a boss or what a certain item really does haha or how to build. It should be possible in the game (and optional outside it IF THE PLAYER WANTS TO, dont make them NEED it).

So indirectly people here Acknowledge that the game has all the shortcomings, and then instead of posting about it, they go to outer sources to Overcome those shortcomings making things easier than the Game anyway intended it to be originally hhuehue. (not everyone has access to the tools too)

They haven't even allowed an option to see floating dmg text, is that because diablo didn't have it, so even poe shouldn't, hehe?

No item level shown (half the players don't know what item level is)..

Same old un improved map like Diablo

Same inventory style like diabojoe

Same Hud/interface/ like diablow

Same ACT-STYLE Progession like Diamoro :V and then people keep complaining how this game will become like diablo ;v

:: How most people react Wherever info is missing : ""ITS CHALLENGING, ALL HAIL GGG, THE ALL MIGHTY GIVING US SOME GREAT CHALLENGE BONER(goes opens google search tab) find info, comes back, says to everyone else : HEY THIS GAME IS PERFUKT, IF U DON LIEK IT, LEAV NAO, YOU MEANIE!"",.



There is a difference between
1: A person searching for stuff about the game simply because they wanna know more stuff about it
2: People going to search for stuff that they CAN NOT IN ANY WAY SEE IT IN THE GAME and need to find it or else they can be fucked by the same game.


one is a choice, the other one is necessity, which one is which ? :O



"it's asking to have info shown where the info should have been in the first place." <- THIS! :D

If there was no mystery or challenge to the game, there would be no need for a community. No forums or heated debates because everything would be summed up on a billboard in the middle of town... I personally enjoy the fact that Poe requires us to test out ideas ourselves, with consequences.

"

allionus wrote:

"

larkstongue wrote:

You're way too damn focused on an issue that isn't going to be resolved by whatever ideas you may have. Paid resets are entirely unnecessary for this style of game. The "challenge" you're referring to is completely subjective and besides, if you've fucked up the toon so completely that the quest-given refunds and a few regret orbs wouldn't resolve the build, you're really not playing the same character upon reroll.

you are actually too focused on not letting the passive tree change to See the bgger problems this game has, and so many of them. I whish you good luck, i don't think im gonna stick around a game who's majority of the community pretends like this game is not pay 2 win, and can suck each other off so everyone can pretend like the game's perfect.
Like when everyone in the world becomes a rapist, then raping won't also be condemned or called wrong, because every one is in on it lol.

And such is your nature with animals, people of other creeds, people who believe in something different than you. well at least for the ones who don't bother to think.



when you think of one thing as TRUE, your belief CHANGES NOTHING about it. the only thing that changes is your perception of it! And if you believe hard enough and close your eyes tight enough, IT BECOMES IRREFUTABLE, But again i guess you are too busy believing, and not busy thinking.

You keep spouting paid to win like this game has a RMAH (real money auction house) built right into the game. Sorry but D3 was the only game that done that and in about 11 days it and the gold auction house will be shut down because it short circuited the process of being able to find your own upgrades after a certain point on the gear curve was reached.

By your own words then the mere existence of any third party sites would make that game a paid to win game as well. So you are not providing any new info that is not already known.

Now who ever said that this game or any game made by man is perfect and can please everyone. I am sure that you have heard of the line; “You can please some of the people some of the time all of the people some of the time some of the people all of the time but you can never please all of the people all of the time.” This is a quote that Abraham Lincoln made. This just goes to show you it is impossible to please everyone.

Also if their game was perfect then it would not need any patches at all because nothing would be broken or OP'd at all.

A person without any faith in anything at all does not lead a happy life. I agree with what an boss from a company that I used to work for years ago said. Everyone has to believe in something. Heck even if you believe that one day science will solve all of our problems that is a belief. If you believe that one day man will find the perfect government then that to is a belief. If you believe that one day medical science will find the cure to all ails then that too is a belief. So belief is not tied solely to religion.