Path of Desync?

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RikuGx wrote:

So the moral of the story is: dont have FUN in this game as you want but rather try to find a way to survive without gimping your charakter most of the time. Awesome^^

I'm actually having fun, I was new to the game when I strted it and I do admit that the build I'm playing right now is safe (as it's something I picked for learning the game), but the group dps slack is really taking the piss at times. But I'm still having fun as I've had the luxury of experiencing and learning the game from a more.. safe perspective.

I really haven't played a single online game where I wouldn't have to stack defensive stats one way or another.
I mean if in a game the purpose is trying to stay alive, and dying is harmful (drop to standard in HC, XP loss in SC), that does mean that there are things trying to kill you in the game, and that whatever that stuff is, you should build your character to best avoid it?
In a game, there's winning and losing. You lose the game playing PoE when you die. You win the game when you live.
If you don't have to do anything in particular in order to ensure that you live, you don't have to do anything to win the game, which is like playing Civilization 5 on Settler difficulty and thinking building all the wonders and being a century ahead of the AI is winning the game. This game isn't like playing Civilization 5 on Settler. Doesn't mean I like playing Civ 5 on Deity, because the increase of difficultylevel is too artificial for my taste.

Complaining about factoring in desync when playing the game is like crying in WoW PvP that you died in a global (cooldown) because you or the person healing you was on global cooldown after casting an instant and couldn't get healed which means the game sucks beacuse global cooldown exists, when the harsh truth is that having sub 400k hp when the last seasons standard is around 500k, means you are undergeared as hell and will lose half your hp to a geared opponent in 1 hit.. (yes, badgeared players die when I as a healer am on global cooldown at times because the damage is so brutal, and I can die myself becuase of being stuck on GCD because I predicted my sequense of executing casts wrong).
The reason I'm drawing parallells is that to some extent, global cooldown in WoW is a feature to prevent certain kind of abuse and hacking in regard to performing actions ingame, it limits the amount of actions you can perform in short succession.
Desync is a feature that exists beacuse the game is coded to handle client-server information in a manner to prevent some kind of abuse and hacking in regard to performing actions within the game.

The difference between these two things however is, that the global cooldown will never go away and will continue to unecessarily slow down the pace of the game just by existing.
Netcode can be revised and optimized further and in time make desync less of an issue. But until that happens, you'll have to factor in desync in your gameplay, gear and perhaps somewhat in your build.

The build I play is not very prone to desync (I mostly have bad desync sometimes, but not always, when playing in US/AUS gateway instances occasionally having abnormally high latency and packet loss due to server issues), but it doesn't mean I haven't while soloing found myself in rooms I didn't really know how I ended up in with my health dropping at a pace faster then I really felt comfortable and happy with.
And I've been hit by invisible things, who hasn't? Desynced into a pack of blue rhoas and a stormherald. Not sure how I lived in that situation to be fair.
Had a white pack take a substantial amount of my health in an instant due to packetloss in a ridiculosly low level safe mod map. It happens.
Both me, and friends, have lived trough some situations because that extra 200-1000 HP was the difference between having 200-1000 HP and having 0 HP. I have to run a defensive aura instead of an offensive one because my gear isn't good enough to allow me to swap one of my auras out, but it's still good enough that I can handle most of the content solo with the damage I have.
My earlier char died and ended up in Standard becase I didn't have enough HP to react to the damage I was taking because I was still more of a noob that I am now and I didn't think I'd die that fast. The earlier one that died was a bad judgement call on my behalf and no gear or build would have made any difference.
I made the next one better. If your character would be in my league and I would have some upgrades for you I would gladly help spruce up your gear for better survivability in some arrangement that would satisfy us both.

In the end we as gamers are always at the mercy of the game that we play. If the game feels fun enough to play despite the shortcomings, the best way is learning how to overcome the shortcomings effecting our gameplay experience.

Hi there.

I am the Guild-Leader of the Guild RikuGX is in, and even my english is pretty bad, I think it could help understand the whole problem, if someone describes it out of the sight of a companion. This is, because as a teammate, playing with other friends, you do not see things happen like they do on their machine, you see what the server sees und then displays to you.

When playing with RikuGX or other friends wiht desynch problems, I often see them standing still and do nothing, while my minions (thats my build - minions and spells) are fighting on. If the problem occures and they don´t stand still, they are moving (or whirling) through the mobs, put i can´t see any damage taken by them or any mob they should hit. After a bunch of seconds - the duration differs from time to time - they are instantly dead or almost dead. This happens in both cases, if they stand still, or if they move. And almost everytime, they die in another location than i saw them the last second before that.

As a side effect, i see mobs teleporting around, sometimes bringing me into trouble, too.

Now, what´s that all about? I have some statements, which I would like to do out of another perspective: the one, that GGG should have. Why do I do that? Because I am a customer supporter und project manager with 15 years expirience in questions of customer relationship - and the following is about what my company would react, if such a problem would occure. We would analyse the problem in some steps:

First: reason and responsibility for the problem
As the game only begins to desynch while one or more players in a team use different skills or a combination of those, it is almost proven, that the problems cause is technical. Technical reasons like network-connection or client-overload would show ohter behaviour, so that I would state the responsibility lies at PoE, means GGG. Making the player responsible for the issue or the solution is not logical and would lead to a bad relationsship. Qed.

Second: rating of the problem
As the game offers a variaty of playstiles which are espacially organized in different starting chars, there is a good reason for PoE to feature different builds. The number of that builds should be as large as possible, because of the open skill-tree and other design elements, wich indicate such a game-behavior to every potential player - paying or not.
For this reason there is a comprehensible demand for a player who disides to play PoE, because of the ability of playing different styles. So it is a great problem, if this doesn´t work. I would state, this problem is critical!
It is a bad idea to tell the player now, that he just got the bad build. Qed.

Third: solution for the problem
As there is no solution for the problem available at this time, GGG should decide between one of two options:
1. If the current misbehaviour is resolvable, GGG should pronounce a release date or time period to solve the problem.
2. If the current misbehaviour is NOT resolvable, GGG can decide out of another of two options:
a) The game main playtypes, chars and skills will be changed, so that the chance to be a victim of this problem is reduced to a minimum. That would maximise the number of playable builds.
b) The game remains as it is. This is the badiest solution, because it is in fact no solution. After all this would give GGG the possibility to maximise their income while reducing efforts in development - but this is nothing i would imply.
If the state of "no solution" is kept up to long, more and more players will get disaffected. This surely won´t lead in a fast return of investment for GGG, if they release any further game elements.

Fourth:
A workaround, and that is the main statement to this problem, is logically implausible, because the problem is a technical issue. It is NOT, and thats a fact, it is not a reasonable workaround to alterate the euip or playstile for a specific build UNTIL PoE declares the specific build to be the cause of the problem and simultaniously declares that build (and others) to be wrong! If you tell your customer, that his misbehaviour in any way is causing the issues he has, you also tell him, that your Software is not able to deal with his style of gaming or handling. Do you really think that GGG wants anybody to tell THAT to anybody?

So do make PoE a favor and stop telling somebody with any technical problem, that he is meant to solve it - that´s not the reason why he is asking, not the answer he is awaiting and not the solution he deserves.
And that´s because GGG does not deserve this, too, so long as they have the chance to do something about the problem themselves. If any of our supportes or project managers would keep saying something like that to our customers, he would be fired! (And that already happend!)

To make things clear: I also wanna thank anybody in this thread who really wanted to help and not in that way to tell RikuGX about HIS failures but about possible alterations which could not only work, which also would leave him able to persecute his desired build further. Thank you.
And to all others: Stop repeating again and again with that unhelpfull stuff about being more pro, having more pro stuff or such. PoE supports different builds and he wants to play HIS - not YOURS.

Have a nice day!

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Munkeeh wrote:

too long but did read

So you just wrote in long term what people already said up till now

ill take it short for you

• Desync isnt a bug its a feature
• your gear is shit
• if you dont study to get around desync get the fuck off
• gimp your charakter as much as possible so you survive the "feature" of desync

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LCaroh wrote:

[...]

https://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/710359/page/1

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RikuGx wrote:

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Wruntjunior wrote:

TL;DR: No one likes desync or thinks desync isn't an issue - but it's not always the cause of everyone's problems, either (especially cases like this).

You havent even seen me play at all so how can yu assume that its all about the equip? passives and all that stuff are worth nothing at all huh?

http://www.pathofexile.com/passive-skill-tree/AAAAAgAAAAYDAAbuDq0SIBR1FSAV9hjbG8ghYCP2Jd8ppSpNLOkwfDQ1NJM6szrtPydAoEMxQ5xKfUrITipRR1b6Wz1br16LYnljF2NwZ6BsFm5pbqp0QXTxd9d-mn8rguSDvYPbhNmHdoqvjX2QEZdwnrmqf6q4rOq18rZBvqe-vMAPwQfBi85xz_jQ7tJN0_zUUtUc137dDd3n5cXmiO4O7-Pv8Pej_Ev8xQ==
look if you want and someone mentioned my weapons would suck, well pay me beter^^

The main issue you have is using multistrike on cyclone. That is always a net dps loss, regardless of anything you may think, for cyclone.
Edit: To clarify, the immediate desync lowers your dps by lowering the amount of hits you can effectively make.

The other important issue is you need to learn exactly when desync is happening on something like whirling blades - and learning not to spam the ability, but to wait a second (possibly try to move normally) when it happens. That said, last night I actually died to whirling blades-based desync, but that's the first it's happened in a long time, and it happened because I panicked and pressed whirling blades again right after rubber-banding (which causes a further desync).

Gear is a secondary issue - you just need to farm some easier areas (fellshrine or city of sarn are easy at 64) and get some better gear (through currency and drops). Really good weapons will cost you a handful of chaos each (I think very low 200 pdps swords, which will do amazing things for your dps, are rather cheap - comparatively, your current swords are in the low 100s). Other than that, Thief's Torment is playing against you by blocking another ring slot, your helmet only really brings you lightning resistance, and your belt could be improved if you manage to get 2% leech somewhere else. You also need to up the life amounts on your gear as best you can, and though your passive tree looks like it should work, you should take advantage of the life wheel you're next to to the left of Scion. Your armor could also be upgraded to one that gives life and resists, which could be a pretty significant boost.

A suggestion for changing the links on your Cyclone - try Cyclone/Melee Physical Damage/Life Gain on Hit/Faster Attacks if you're sure you want to stick with Cyclone - you'll do a lot better than having multistrike.

As a final note, you should read the writeup Chris did a while back on desync (link). GGG is working towards minimizing desync, but knowing what to look out for can make playing with it much easier, even with movement skills.

Well so the post of GGG in short
"We dont bother getting rid of it and just let you solve it. Dont like it? Leave"

What kind of boggles my mind is how they describe desync as some insurmountable problem that costs tons of money. I have played more MMOs than I can count, and even the crappiest of them never had the problems this game did. It was always lag, never this desync issue (and yes, lag and desync are different). How is that only path of exile, out of literally every MMO out there, experiences it to this degree?

Then you have the weird elitist culture that relishes the fact this game has it, so they can fap to the fact they have the patience to deal with something they shouldnt have to. I mean gosh, you guys are so skilled at logging out and avoiding movement skills! Were not worthy!

Yes this game is free to play so it doesnt allow for a lot of complaining, but I would easily pay $10 a month to address this. It's really kind of jaw dropping how many sheep on here just say its impossible and for people to move along. Why is it impossible? Cost? Explain how kickstarter MMO's do it with a low budget? I really cant even think of an MMO where desync is this bad.

To the poster who compared desync to the global cooldowns in wow, you really make me lose faith in humanity. That is such a ridiculous comparison.

GGG truly has an amazing game on their hands and I feel like the number one reason why it will never be huge is because of desync. The fapper elitists I referred to earlier love this fact, but it's a shame so many people are are goign to miss out. I can't get my friends to touch this game after they watched me shout *$@%@$1!!! desync!* at my screen every few minutes a couple days ago.

Just my 2 cents.

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LCaroh wrote:

First: reason and responsibility for the problem
As the game only begins to desynch while one or more players in a team use different skills or a combination of those, it is almost proven, that the problems cause is technical. Technical reasons like network-connection or client-overload would show ohter behaviour, so that I would state the responsibility lies at PoE, means GGG. Making the player responsible for the issue or the solution is not logical and would lead to a bad relationsship. Qed.

It desyncs even when you're solo, because mobs also move and use different skills (or combination of those). Some skills/game styles just desync more than anothers, but nobody is safe from it.

GGG stated it wold take too much efforts to fix desync...

Well, i think they should start making PoE2 IMMEDIATELY. And the main feature of PoE2 will be NO DESYNC (as it should be made from scratch, using completely new engine and coding).

Sometimes, it's easier and more rewarding to make a new game, rather than fixing an old broken one. GGG should really consider that.

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repairman1988 wrote:

What kind of boggles my mind is how they describe desync as some insurmountable problem that costs tons of money. I have played more MMOs than I can count, and even the crappiest of them never had the problems this game did. It was always lag, never this desync issue (and yes, lag and desync are different). How is that only path of exile, out of literally every MMO out there, experiences it to this degree?

Then you have the weird elitist culture that relishes the fact this game has it, so they can fap to the fact they have the patience to deal with something they shouldnt have to. I mean gosh, you guys are so skilled at logging out and avoiding movement skills! Were not worthy!

Yes this game is free to play so it doesnt allow for a lot of complaining, but I would easily pay $10 a month to address this. It's really kind of jaw dropping how many sheep on here just say its impossible and for people to move along. Why is it impossible? Cost? Explain how kickstarter MMO's do it with a low budget? I really cant even think of an MMO where desync is this bad.

To the poster who compared desync to the global cooldowns in wow, you really make me lose faith in humanity. That is such a ridiculous comparison.

GGG truly has an amazing game on their hands and I feel like the number one reason why it will never be huge is because of desync. The fapper elitists I referred to earlier love this fact, but it's a shame so many people are are goign to miss out. I can't get my friends to touch this game after they watched me shout *$@%@$1!!! desync!* at my screen every few minutes a couple days ago.

Just my 2 cents.

100% agreed.

By 2020, when PoE will reach it's full potential, desync will be mostly fixed. Just hold on a little and /oos a lot.