Excited about subclasses, but Juggernaut is laughable

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HellGauss wrote:

If I understood the game mechanics, the unstoppable keystone does not grand advantages with T-Chains. It should provides freeze 'immunity' and advantages on tar and chilled.

It does, T-chains specifically provides a slow% penalty to a character.

Peace,

-Boem-

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lolozori wrote:

Personally I just find there should have endu charge time increased in the nods.

Those boosts seems pretty weak compared to others because most of the other classes have almost permanent bonuses.

Put a 150% endurance charges duration increase and we could get something interesting

Still it save only vs physical damage, do nothing vs elemental and chaos damage (degen too).

Jugger looks weakest if we take a look and compare with any other class, like templar who have 5 LESS damage taken and others.
GGG try to discriminate marauder class or something.

unyielding and unrelenting are the 2 that look really underwhelming to me. Undeniable could maybe do with being a little more, like 16% attack speed. The 5% reduced ele damage is particularly lol? Too conditional for a bonus that seems extremely trivial, I think you could remove the endu charge condition and I would still not take it as a passive 100% uptime buff.

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pijanapanda wrote:

Its like +1 endu charge. Conqueror effect applies for whole party? How you know that?
Do you REALLY need 75 spell block? In this game spells are not so often and most deadly of them are unblockable. So i don't really think this 15% make so big difference.
1000 accuracy is huge, basically its all what you need.
Double armour from chest. With 2k armour chest bonus will be huge. In build with no shield this passive give you basically +40-50% total armour.
Also think about +30 sec IC and how flexible Juger tree is (its 4 x 2 passives and only 1x4 passives so you can take what you want).

It's +1 charge for elemental damage reduction too, which evens other Juggernaut's passive.

You may be right, it may work for yourself only.

1000 accuracy is still just 3 mods. Good accuracy mods give 300-400 accuracy. Yes, you dont need more, but the point is, you can get it EASILY anyways.

2k extra armour is nice, but armour itself isnt as useful as you try to put it. If it worked for evasion or ES on chest too, that'd be completely another story.

Overall, all those Jug passives are nice, but compared to other classes, they are too weak and insignificant. It's just like picking 12% armour nodes instead of 5% HP nodes for your build....

Are people forgetting that labyrinth will have tons of slowing mechanics? Those darts in the video slowed Jonathan down to a crawl.

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Boem wrote:

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HellGauss wrote:

If I understood the game mechanics, the unstoppable keystone does not grand advantages with T-Chains. It should provides freeze 'immunity' and advantages on tar and chilled.

It does, T-chains specifically provides a slow% penalty to a character.

Peace,

-Boem-

It does not

http://pathofexile.gamepedia.com/Temporal_Chains

The reduction of speed is the *result* of another effect, i.e. the time pass slovely, but the relative speed is unchanged. The wiki says that 'They will move, attack and cast at a reduced speed', instead of 'They have reduced mov/attack/cast speed', which would be the correct technical statement.

Even the time of T-Chains itself is doubled as a *result* of the time-speed change.

armor is still shit in this game, since when did it become an important and worthwhile investment? do 10k+ armor builds with shitty clear speed help prevent all those one shots in 79+ maps?

all the juggy nodes are jokes, not worth more than 1 or 2 regular passive pts at best, the only attractive and unique thing is unstoppable, but still that is even a stretch because there are freeze and chill immune items and flasks.

hell even some filler nodes on shadow, duelist and ranger are better and more useful than juggy keystones.

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HellGauss wrote:

It does not

http://pathofexile.gamepedia.com/Temporal_Chains

The reduction of speed is the *result* of another effect, i.e. the time pass slovely, but the relative speed is unchanged. The wiki says that 'They will move, attack and cast at a reduced speed', instead of 'They have reduced mov/attack/cast speed', which would be the correct technical statement.

Even the time of T-Chains itself is doubled as a *result* of the time-speed change.

That's pretty sweet and i was unaware of this.

Cheers man.

Peace,

-Boem-

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armor is still shit in this game, since when did it become an important and worthwhile investment? do 10k+ armor builds with shitty clear speed help prevent all those one shots in 79+ maps?

What kind of bad build do you have? 10k armor using an armor character in the end game?!
Is that like an evasion character with some armor on it or something?

I've never heard of an armor build with just 10k armor in 79+ maps. That is not called an armor build.

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Starxsword wrote:

I've never heard of an armor build with just 10k armor in 79+ maps. That is not called an armor build.

Evasion char with 10k evasion is completely viable and provides very noticeable protection.
On othe hand, char with 10k armor isnt even considered an armour build in endgame. You need 20, 30, 50k armour to feel difference.
And evasion char can instead grab some HP, DPS, MS and other things most builds need...
That's why armour sucks - you need to stack it too much, or dont stack at all. And even when you stack it so much, it protects only from physical non-DoT damage (unlike ES, which protects against ALL damage assuming you have pure ES build - CI or Shavronne).

Even if there will be a lot more slowing in Labyrinth, i doubt current Juggernaut will be worth it. It isnt "immune to slow", it's "can be slower below base MS", and most characters use lots of MS boosters (30% boots, 40+20-30% flask and few passives, at least). Some just move with skills like Leap Slam.

I hope they'll buff Jugger so it'll be worth taking over other subclasses, sometimes.