In-Game Trade System: Cancelled?

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chanlinexile wrote:

I think its disgusting that GGG want the playerbase to use a 3rd party website todo trading in THEIR game :(

Ragnarok Online sorta uses Ragial which is also a third-party website...

No matter what the Black Market will always find a loophole through these kinds of things. How else do you see these RMT Websites always mushrooming up out whenever a popular MMORPG pops up out of the internet.

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Asmosis wrote:

There is a very BIG difference between "hey, this is what I want for my item" (poe.trade buyout) which is still very much up for negotiation and "hey this is what I want for my item, click buy now!" which fully removes that middle step.

poe.trade doesn't have an actual buyout in the context of an AH system, since you can't complete it without speaking face to face essentially with the other party. You have 20ex as your buyout on poe.trade? cool I'm offering 17. let the negotiation begin.

I hear you on that. I'm looking for an honest discussion based on the actual reality of trading, though. Not on what we, and GGG, wish trading was like. What is trading in Path of Exile actually like?

Out of my possibly 30 to 40 usual sales per day in PoE, maybe 5 or 6 will have any kind of negotiations. Out of those, at least half will be people just actually trying to rip me off with extreme lowballs that I either simply ignore or quickly turn down, with no further contact. On very rare occasions do I get polite, reasonable offers that make sense where I can then make a counter offer to try to satisfy both parties.

The true reality of trading in Path of Exile currently is receiving the pre-made, robotic-as-hell reply from people clicking the "Whisper" button on poe.trade and copy-pasting to save time. The true reality of trading is these people not even bothering to say "thanks" after I've invited them to a party and we've performed the three or four clicks required for the trade. The true reality of trading in its current state is people are ALREADY not engaging between each other, they are ALREADY pushing that "Click Buy Now" button, although it requires more than one click to work. I want this discussion to be based on reality, not on what we may both wish reality was.

I understand the wish for a system that "forces" player interaction. That system, however, is ALREADY obsolete, made so by tools created by players to circumvent the added complexity. This is reality, and from GGG's response, they are not trying to diminish the effectiveness of these tools, but work to make them even more streamlined. Buyouts are already here, buyouts are prevalent in PoE trading currently, and buyouts are not going to go away anytime soon.

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Xavqwyrus wrote:

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peachii wrote:

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For all GGG gets as much as they can done, they are still a very small company and all systems rely on the funding of the customers. Do you think that an overhaul of this magnitude would be cheap? Do you think the overall player base is willing to wait a year or more for any other content to be able to code and pay for the trade changes?

i've waited longer than a year and paid ggg a few times. i would much rather have some kind of functional trade than any of the patches since forsaken masters.
i'm no longer willing to wait and continue supporting this game when all the patches they release and content that degrades my enjoyment of the game instead of adding real functionality that's really needed so ppl can actually play instead of spending the whole day bashing their head against the wall that is trade.

^Lmao

I would like to be able to trade for an item when the seller is offline. Sometimes you need some better gear to progress, look some items up and the seller of the item you want is offline, AFK, not responding, mapping... whatever.

Why do I have to settle for the 3rd or 4th best item for my purpose when he is clearly willing to sell?
Why does the seller have to stop playing to sell something?

I get it, GGG wants us to interact, make friends, play together and all that. But trading is a huge pain sometimes and in a game where your progress depends on gear on such a large extend you would think trading would be THE top priority.


It would probably be much easier to find people to play with if there were not 50 "WTS ex:300c" parties cluttering up the noticeboard. And maybe a system that detects your quest progress and puts parties with similar progress at the top of the list.

And nobody should need to wait or leave a map to trade ever!

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Col_Jessep wrote:

Why does the seller have to stop playing to sell something?

same reason as why he has to go to town to sell items.

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Col_Jessep wrote:

in a game where your progress depends on gear on such a large extend you would think trading would be THE top priority.

the game needs to put up an incentive for the buyer to try harder to find the item he needs himself and put the seller before the decision whether it's worth the single chaos to offer that goldrim in his shop or quickly sell to the ingame trader for alch shards.

the game wants you to grind hard and long for gear, an effective trading system would counter that. reaching a goal means removing it.

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vio wrote:

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Col_Jessep wrote:

in a game where your progress depends on gear on such a large extend you would think trading would be THE top priority.

the game needs to put up an incentive for the buyer to try harder to find the item he needs himself and put the seller before the decision whether it's worth the single chaos to offer that goldrim in his shop or quickly sell to the ingame trader for alch shards.

I see your point but that means you will run into trouble if you are unlucky. I mostly play self-found (bought like 3 items total for my lvl 82 Scion so far) but in Tempest I simply gave up on my character. In Warbands I can just zerg a gear check boss (and believe me, I did!) and continue leveling.

The way I see it: maps are where the fun is. I often farm some high level area when I'm tired but when I want to have fun I slot an unidentified map and try to find the modifiers.

Anyway, the story is great and I enjoy Act IV but I don't want to be forced to farm Fellshrine or Docks for 10 levels because I have horrible RNG luck at the time.

As a software developer myself (though, not a game dev... I would like to be one, but...) I can totally see why GGG has the answer that they did. Basically, as someone else mentioned, if someone is willing to do the development for you, why should you do it yourself?
I would also like to point to another highly successful game: World of Warcraft. That game had a built-in auction house system that, well, left much to be desired. However, because of APIs (notice, this is something that GGG talked about) released, various community members released add-ons that GREATLY increased the functionality of the auction house, and made it so much easier to buy, and in particular, sell items. This is the direction that GGG seems to be moving with this, and it is the direction that I would want them to be moving in. That, or as someone else mentioned, just buy poe.trade, and integrate it into the game themselves. But, why do that work themselves, when people in the community are willing to do it? Also, releasing public APIs and add-on support for this game would be awesome. I'd love to have my WoW style DPS meter(s)! Or, just visual add-ons to allow us to better see buffs/debuffs. All of those nice add-on features that WoW and other MMOs have. So, rather then being disappointed in GGG's answer, I actually really appreciated it. No reading between the lines: they said what they are going to do. In the short term, keep using poe.trade, and that will get tools for better integration soon. In the long term, they might be looking at their own solution... That was pretty clear from my reading of the answer. Also, just wanted to write this to point out that software development is not magic.....

Pretty much what he^^ said.

Think of it along the lines of the loot filter: instead of cluttering up the games' UI with tens of additional options to tick/untick GGG just gave the code to the people and those who are good with such things and had the willpower to mess with it, made a bunch of really good lootfilters for everyone of us.

I'm perfectly fine with using poe.trade, but to be fair - in regard to the recent poe.trade being unavailable for a short time panic - i'd also like to see GGG basicly buying poe-trades' website system and integrate it in their own website; they'd also have more information on hand in this case but also had to extend someones' job in order to monitor it.

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Etheoff wrote:

As a software developer myself (though, not a game dev... I would like to be one, but...) I can totally see why GGG has the answer that they did. Basically, as someone else mentioned, if someone is willing to do the development for you, why should you do it yourself?
I would also like to point to another highly successful game: World of Warcraft. That game had a built-in auction house system that, well, left much to be desired. However, because of APIs (notice, this is something that GGG talked about) released, various community members released add-ons that GREATLY increased the functionality of the auction house, and made it so much easier to buy, and in particular, sell items. This is the direction that GGG seems to be moving with this, and it is the direction that I would want them to be moving in. That, or as someone else mentioned, just buy poe.trade, and integrate it into the game themselves. But, why do that work themselves, when people in the community are willing to do it? Also, releasing public APIs and add-on support for this game would be awesome. I'd love to have my WoW style DPS meter(s)! Or, just visual add-ons to allow us to better see buffs/debuffs. All of those nice add-on features that WoW and other MMOs have. So, rather then being disappointed in GGG's answer, I actually really appreciated it. No reading between the lines: they said what they are going to do. In the short term, keep using poe.trade, and that will get tools for better integration soon. In the long term, they might be looking at their own solution... That was pretty clear from my reading of the answer. Also, just wanted to write this to point out that software development is not magic.....

except WOW also had offline trading which POE trade does not and most likely will never have (since Chris lives in DreamLand and thinks that would totally ruin the economy)

If they were to add a way to trade in game I don't see any other way than an auction house. An auction house but it would be more like a market with buyouts only. Basically, same function as POE.Trade but none of the other bull shit that goes along with it. If you put an item up for X then you actually have to sell it.

There would still be ways for clever players to manipulate the market, it would just require an investment. Right now, people can fuck with the markets without risking anything and that is a big problem for a game in which the economy is one of the most important aspects of the game.