In-Game Trade System: Cancelled?

"

RockGod wrote:

"

ScrotieMcB wrote:

Saying the majority of players would want, or not want, a particular trade method is a lot like saying the majority of people in the United States are Democrats. The truth is that it's a very controversial topic; moderates and fencesitters constitute a population large enough to prevent either side of the debate from acquiring a majority.

What's more important here than asking people what they want is carefully considering the effect changes will have on play prior to making changes.

Chris has said all along he has built the game that he wants to play, and there has been no trade system for three years because he doesn't want one.

If he wanted one he would have built it.


It's going to take a revenue drop or reduction in the number of players or something drastic.


Just look how stubborn they were over party looting, it took 1000's of requests and years of whining to get PA.


Doesn't matter if you and I think it's a good thing, it's up to the designers.

Cringe worthy post, consider FFA loot was one of the fundamental design choices desired by GGG which they actually had to back-off from, not because they wanted to.

If you don't think designing this game is done by a tension field between players and designers, you haven't been paying attention.

Peace,

-Boem-

I wouldn't say loot tension was something that GGG had to back off from, because it was never really achieved. The type of ninja looting going on wasn't tension, it was just opportunism.

It was more like a dream that GGG was pressured into giving up; they never gave themselves a chance to make it work. And this is coming from someone who believed in the same dream quite fiercely, by the way.

I enjoyed POE at launch and for 2 years afterward. Played from launch and for a year afterward completely in HCs only. Standard didn't interest me until I had memorialized 19 different characters. I had some wonderful experiences on roads that were often rewarding in 1 of kind experiences and in gear, but...

I noted here on the forums the complete disarray that any discussion of 'trade' arises.

The herd talks, the herd hears, the herd asks. I lost interest once PoE went from a Grinding Gear Game at lvls 87-92 (on multiple characters) to a Grinding Garbage Game. It didn't matter how much magic find and quantity find I acquired, maps I ran, or guilds/groups I rolled with, the walls of garbage I began to grind out just started adding mountains of virtual waste the internet's infrastructure and I began to get warnings that I was overloading my mental capacity to grind anymore.

Like others, I kept waiting for 'put out' on a trade system.

Regardless of what the herd of present and past players were/are echoed, there is no viable trade system for PoE.

Like others, I turned to utilize the 'out of game' trade systems, but they are clunky, time consuming, NOT FUN and extremely ANNOYING to utilize. Years ago, I farmed virtual games to pay my bills and support myself, but that ended long ago. I've coded, scripted, modded, etc... Most PoE players do NOT need to post a resume of any sort. If you play PoE to any substantial point (especially in the HC options), you likely know what you're experiencing when you realize how disappointing the clone/repeat process becomes when you finish session after session, for months, without a single upgrade for ANY of your characters, your friends/family's toons, your guild-mates, etc...

Another 'challenge', Another achievement, etc... Oh, what Boss is prettier or more challenging than the next? What new recycled fiction (Lore) can I skip reading again? Put the subjects in the maze and let big data track their actions. Put in some rewards, some cheese, etc... How long can the human carry on with the same recycled fictions? Until the game is not Fun anymore, the point when it becomes a Grinding Garbage Game.

I miss my characters, I miss hosting pick up groups (I LOVED HOSTING AND RUNNING PICK UP GROUPS!), I miss the Grinding GEAR Game I used to experience. I read the updates, watch the patches and expansions and I KNOW GGGs builders are not sofa king we todd it that they can't implement SOMETHING Brilliant!!! that allows us to peruse other players's MASSES of virtual garbage, but someone(s) is holding them back. If rust and dust could happen in a virtual environment, our stash boxes would be packed with it.

Until I can actually surf a trade system, instead of a time waste hole system, I've no interest here anymore and the longer this remains, the more my PoE interest evaporates from within me (been months since I logged in at all). My friends don't talk about PoE anymore and my wife, my son, and my brothers won't even discuss the 'what if' of this subject anymore.

I really don't care about the # of 'new' clone/repeat processes that come out in the expansions. It's all just pretty reworkings of numbers. What point are these 'Non-New' rehashes when we can't even actually engage ANY functional form of BASIC trading in game between players? That is rhetorical, the question that severs ties to enjoyment, the question that wakes up a grinder when 'Fun' is no longer present and rinse/revive/repeat is no longer Rewarding.

Email me when your game designing 'NOOBS IN CHARGE' implement a TRADE system and I will spread the word among my Grinding Garbage Game exiled friends and family that 'Gear' is back in the options of the PoE realm of experiences. Or you can keep following the predictable paths that big data drags you down, completely oblivious to where success and value are One.

"

Masiquer wrote:

What point are these 'Non-New' rehashes when we can't even actually engage ANY functional form of BASIC trading in game between players? That is rhetorical, the question that severs ties to enjoyment, the question that wakes up a grinder when 'Fun' is no longer present and rinse/revive/repeat is no longer Rewarding.

the trading screen already provides this "basic trading" you speak of.

and i'm afraid, if ggg implements a different trading mechanism, buying and selling probably won' be more comfortable than it is now.

ggg loves to put the player before choices, the current choice when one want's items is: do i set up a shop and sell my junk to others to aquire the currency to buy my item of choice or do i mindlessly grind until i find it myself or the currency ingame?

when selling items, the question is: is the extra income from setting up my shop worth the hassle coming from permanent trading requests which interrupt my gameplay and the constant need to update my shop items?

when, in opposite to both questions, one can just share high value items in your guild and have the same effect: giving items you don't need and getting items you need without the exchange of currency?

if there is an effective trading system, all choices are gone. where's the fun in that?

All i want is cross instance trading.
It annoying when you in a party and have to leave to trade.

Uhhmmm... the FUN left a long time ago when the upgrades stopped dropping for my characters across the board.

When you have to grind 2 months per upgrade, at about 30+ hours per week, then you are only grinding out garbage that doesn't translate to currency. Boring... Boring... Boring...

The experience was rewarding, until the upgrades no longer were an option without USING offline trading. Regardless, there IS trading, OFFLINE and ONLINE, but the systems are NOT FUN and they are only 'rewarding' for those reaping offline benefits, the unseen of thus is real world currency flow.

Not every player is a Big Data style player. The actual is that the majority of monitored and catored players are the players providing the constant stream of data while gamers seeking an experience that is Fun are ignored (because they can't be tracked).

Big Data players want Leaderboards and competition and talk about the game as if the actions and methods of other players affect their personal game. Not so with myself and countless oceans of players just waiting around for a game that offers BOTH options, not just the 1 option that Big Data tracking lays down highways for, the same highways that all present and most past gamers have tread enough to realize what is important in a game and that is the continuation of an enjoyable experience beyond point X, which in PoE apparently comes quite early.

For me, running public games and enjoying countless hours of variance in builds and play styles was paramount for me. It wasn't the PvP and it surely isn't the recycled fiction and methodologies. There is Trade options and they are BORING, TIME consuming and troublesome, not rewarding in the least. Most of the trade chat is just droves of over priced columns of spam that detract from the game.

Im not here to discuss or argue, just point out why I miss PoE and why I stopped logging in and purchasing micro transaction goodies. Why anyone would come here and defend a broken future to the future of their PoE is beyond my desire to waste time arguing. Like I said, WHEN Fun trading (or getting upgrades myself beyond lvl 92) becomes an option, I'll be back to enjoy the game for a time. Also, I do not, nor have I ever, used a clone/paste build, which the Big Data tracks and pars loot drops for. Perhaps that is the downfall of a plethora of players, because they don't copy paste a 'class' build utilized by the small herd of PoE players.

Another game may come along someday that provides for more than just the data tracked clone style players they are designed to cater for, but myself and other wayward PoE exiles would like to see that option ADDED to PoE, but like most games we play these days, there is little to no Passion in the game design (especially after launch) and almost all data farmed 'prediction' building growing larger and larger data trees. "Well, we can do it this way and 'maybe' see a spike in our Data trees." "Look Dad, money does grow on trees! Data trees!" ... but those trees wither and lose their appeal quickly.

I remember when a FUN trade system was pitched as incoming to PoE players.
I remember when a 'server' customizable system was pitched as incoming to players. (this epic bluff from the game managers was wonderfully sly and we all know this won't happen at this point)

I've watched games just like this grow and wither and collapse year after year and I still ask myself why herd mentality continues to defend a failing future to their games' characters. Well, go back and check your leaderboards I guess, because there isn't any leaders there, just the illusion of them.

Years ago, before Big Data tracked your every click, games held Fun, because it was the only way to KEEP players around and keep a turn over rate from shutting the doors. Would you keep going to an amusement park if none of the rides were Fun?

There must be a game designer out there somewhere who can actually implement a trade system or balance to this game that keeps a player engaged in Fun, but it appears that they're only good at recycling Lore, data, and scripted boss fights.

And... just as I was about to post this, someone I used to play this with regularly asked me why I waste my time posting here. "Likely because I like to read other players telling me to piss off and stop asking for a reason to return. The basic math doesn't add up for them, they think that by increasing the turn over rate, they are contributing to the future of where they time sync."

Anything that was remotely ok about the system in the past (occasionally able to find good bargains and whatnot) is now completely decimated by automated scripts. Anything that is posted for a remotely good price is instantly found by people who run the bots and bought, and relisted at a higher price.

Fixing compatability with third party applications is making the trade system overall worse, not better, apart from people with the technical savvy and time to setup and run bots.

The next league will be the worst league thus far for trading for regular rank and file players since before the advent of poe.xyz.

"

Perq wrote:

"

RockGod wrote:

GGG hasn't implemented a better trade system because they don't want one.

It's as simple as that.



Current system is what they want, it's hardcore and manly and cut throat, anything better would be appeasing the sheep.

Aaandddd that is bunch of lies.

3 years with no changes begs to differ with your profound statement.

It's simple logic.

GGG has not improved trading, even after stating that they were very close to implementing a new system over a year ago.

Ascendancy, new MTXs and skill gems, as well as the new deSync system was their priority ...


BECAUSE THAT IS WHAT THEY SHIPPED!


They've stated numerous times they have issues with making trading too easy. And a new trade system would be one of the easier things to implement compared to something hard, like the deSync changes.

"

Pathological wrote:

Anything that was remotely ok about the system in the past (occasionally able to find good bargains and whatnot) is now completely decimated by automated scripts. Anything that is posted for a remotely good price is instantly found by people who run the bots and bought, and relisted at a higher price.

Fixing compatability with third party applications is making the trade system overall worse, not better, apart from people with the technical savvy and time to setup and run bots.

The next league will be the worst league thus far for trading for regular rank and file players since before the advent of poe.xyz.

I have to agree completely. I am so looking forward to Ascendancy, but I know that the season will begin and end with "trade flip w/ script or broke as shit". You can grind 24/7 until your head explodes, and without trade flipping, you will be poor. I honestly feel that a lot of the game's potential is wasted with trade flipping outweighing grinding by such an astronomical margin that "wtf why am I still grinding?" hits me about 2 months into every season.

The beast. It moved.

I'm sorta, kinda hyped :)