Until melee is fixed, a lot of people will not comeback.
" Ok then don't discuss it lol. I mean you are so right you don't need to say anything else, even if someone can bring up a valid counter point. So you want melee to be able to offscreen mobs just like ranged but only use melee skills, doesn't that seem kinda counter productive. Some skills if you get enough aoe really do hit for the whole visible screen. https://youtu.be/T9kygXtkh10?t=285
FeelsBadMan Remove MF from POE, make juiced map the new MF. | |
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Again...melee's problem isn't damage. It's not clearspeed. It's survivability. And bloody heck, I want to see more flat phys reduction nodes buried deep in the armor tree where most ranged builds wouldn't be able to get to it.
There's ONE that i've found at 4% between duelist and maurader. Can we have some more of those? That'd be great, thanks. "If you’re incompetent, you can’t know you’re incompetent. […] the skills you need to produce a right answer are exactly the skills you need to recognize what a right answer is." ~David Dunning
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" I understand your desire to buff these builds but armor aren't the only melee in the game. The fundamental change point is valid, this game will always favor range until melee is given something that is a big change - something that ranged doesn't get. my evasion is so high i only insta rip sometimes ----- Bug Fixes: People were using cyclone for actual melee builds, so we nerfed it and made blade vortex. Also, we went ahead and made cyclone great for CoC casters while we were at it. Last edited by Legatus1982 on Jan 7, 2015, 10:20:19 PM
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Still meleeing! Getting rekt and loving the pain!
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" No, but 90% of melee armor builds are the ones that get shat on, so they need the biggest buffing, and it makes a logical place to start. You know - the ones that run unwavering stance to stop all the desync associated with every charging and leapslamming enemy in the game? YOU WANNA FIX THAT YET, BTW GGG? "If you’re incompetent, you can’t know you’re incompetent. […] the skills you need to produce a right answer are exactly the skills you need to recognize what a right answer is." ~David Dunning Last edited by TikoXi on Jan 8, 2015, 8:28:41 AM
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well, here we are again.
Can you guys just not hate me for 1 post, actually just listen to what Im saying as if a friend or family member was talking to you? I feel like these are entrenched positions and you dont want to be wrong, as in, you are not even willing to humor the idea that you dont know all there is to the game, refuse to accept that maybe you actually are way out of touch with your builds. Put your egos down and just really let in what I am saying here. If you really give a shit about this subject then I feel like you owe it to yourself to actually open up and not just let in the info you want to hear because it confirms what you want to believe. " This sums it up right here, melee should be tankier, followed by 10k armour + 5k life at lvl98 deep in endgame maps is far from horrible... Its pretty horrible man, and if you don't know that then that is why you think melee needs to be tankier, not because its true, but because you dont know horrible defense when u see it. No disrespect mate, I love you guys, but a lot of you in here are in the same boat. I look at that build + gear and I think "that looks defensively suspect". If you didnt think the same when you looked at it thats an alarm bell right there telling you that actually, you don't know it all when it comes to defenses in this game and if you care to know more, you need to open up and be willing to learn. " see, block wont save you from a 1 shot. What will stop you getting 1 shot is life pool, armour, endurance charges, you have borderline life amounts and you dont spec into decent armour and endurance charges. Block is % chance to avoid damage, you will get hit, when that happens you need defenses which you don't have. Heres what I see, you completely ditched Evasion by going IR, so theres half your base defense potential gone. No cloth and chain, no soul of steel, no marauder start armour, just unyielding, so you ditched evasion then didnt spec into much armour, didnt spec into endurance charges and didnt spec/gear up enough life. So theres 4 of the main defenses options that melee have, that are weighted to the bottom of the tree away from casters, 2 of them you didnt invest in properly and 2 of them you didnt invest in at all. Anyone who didn't see that and see it was a problem right away looking at that build and gear, I think you need to listen and learn from the forums rather than talk about the state of play regarding defenses because your knowledge is at best outdated. I know it makes me satan for saying it, I get that, but honestly its the truth. Theres no video, I dunno if you got legit 1 shot or bursted down very fast, I dunno the mods, I dunno if you were playing well or badly, I cant speak about the incident in question. I can say that in 1000s of hours playing endgame melee on builds I personally think are somewhat tanky Ive never been 1 shot, ever. Ranged counters I find all day, flicker spiders, flicker dischargers, prox shields, jumping frogs/leapers/goats, hasted mobs, all manner of crap forces ranged chars into melee range map after map after map. 100s upon 100s of hours gone by Im still waiting for a well built melee char to be 1 shot by anything. I've seen people get 1 shot, melee and ranged, Ive been 1 shot on a ranged char recently, and every time its either "you idiot you got vaal slammed" or "yeah I expected that because youre playing a build that on paper looks defensively suspect". How can they balance melee and make it more tanky? Give melee areas way more defenses? they already did that and you are not speccing into them. Leg posted his cloak melee build in the other thread, I look at that build and think "looks suspect, I guess it would probably take 70%+ more damage than what I know to be solid melee builds". Yet people are posting how they should find a way to make melee take 30% less damage than ranged like diablo 3... they already did, its already there and you are not speccing it.... seriously guys, seriously, you need to rethink defenses. Im seeing a lack of defensive layers and yet somehow you are level 98, which says you are not dying very much at all. This is not a game where you never die, you are supposed to die now and then, things are supposed to be able to kill you. Even with Iron Reflexes and only 10k armour with no extra endurance etc you are obviously surviving a lot, think what would happen if you invested properly into defense? You would end up with a character like the ones GGG are testing and saying yes, this works absolutely fine. Very few ranged chars have the same defensive options as melee chars, if all your ranged chars have all the defenses your melee chars have then guess what? you know where Im going with this right? Those are not good melee chars, thats the problem, not melee in poe, your specific, sub par melee build, that is the source of the problem you are experiencing. Aegis can be godmode but you need either more mitigation, more life + es or preferably both imo. I have 10k armour builds but they have the 4% phys reduction from soul of steel along with 5 or 6 endurance charges with trees and gear that would yield 6.5k+ life at lvl98, so the damage reduction and capacity to take damage is higher. Thing is Im doing that without Iron Reflexes, these are hybrid builds with strong levels of evasion, ondars etc too, if I was going full pizza armour Id want 20k+ with max endurance charges. I have a life based aegis character, with no extra endurance charges, 10k armour with iron reflexes and 4.7k life at lvl90, but that character also has 3,500 energy shield with ghost reaver, the reason it doesnt have endurance charges and 20k armour is because its ranged cast on crit and its not in the area of the tree where I can spec more armour, life and endurance charges, its impossible for me to get them. Youre right on top of them and you dont take them, my melee builds take them, and you don't see me making threads like this. |
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Spoiler
" While I understand what you are saying , Some points are debatable. First of all those 10k armor I did not mention what Bor 15% chance to get charges or my enduring cry setup is giving me. While not surprised by a monster once I hit the buttons, I have 10k armor, 60+% damage reductions from Bor endurance charges (At some point I even made a build with 90% phy dam reductions, still got killed by elemental monsters) and then Enduring charges are up for Ic if needed. I also have Rumi I pop most of the time and Using cyclone, while cycloning I am not able to be stunned. Of course it is nothing exceptional, of course I could have take all the armor nods, all the endurance charges nods, take 0 melee nods and walk with 7k+ life doing 5k dps at best in 78 maps. You also forget, this character is 450+ days old: With 3 full respect and hours of gameplay don t you think I could have tried the full defenses options before? I would just need 10 regrets to do that, done it before, died also from burst of elemental attacks anyway. My main problem is not about that, my main problem is a ranged will never have to invest in armor or defensive stats after he pass level 70. All he have to do is take dps nods and clear the screen before enemies are on him. My Build is just the perfect example of how bad melee is in this game. It is an average melee build, with average life and average dps. I have legacy items but using average gameplay (facebreaker) Yet, a sub-par ranged build using just ms+dps with 10+ level under is just cruising because this game do absolutely NOTHING to give ranged any kind of adversity. There is no mobs made to piss-off ranged, the monsters skills are almost never made to target ranged. All is done to give melee a hard time, nothing is done to give ranged a hard time. That being said, I don't ask for ranged to be nerfed, I just ask melee to get better defenses. How is it that a caster can use MOM +AA + intelligence based auras+ ES + still take evasion nods while a strength based character is just able to use Armor or evasion or he need to heavily specialize into intelligence skill point for other defenses? (not saying a melee could not take those options, but if he did, he would seriously minors his offensive options compared to the caster) There is a sever lack of defensives option for traditional melee builds compared to casters, there is a sever lack of offensives option for traditional melee builds compared to ranged. This facebreaker build is laughable, but it is also the best I can do after 400+ days playing it considering how hard it is in this game to get items past some point for melee build. How easy it is for ranged to find a crit bow working effectively with tornado shot? How hard it is for a 2h melee to find a weapon able to go into maps and stay competitive? Why should I as a melee need to invest 100% of my stats in defense when a caster who never miss will just need 1 node on the skill tree (MOM) and 1 defensive gem (AA) to tank better Phy damages than a melee character (I am doing a little caricature here but I hope you see my point, They still need less investment for better results)? Why this same caster have his main defense able to take Big elemental hits (ES) while melee main defense (armor) can t take any and also can t even properly take phy hits? YES, having play HC league at an average level (70+) I know what this game need to really survive (Life+defenses+ 0 dps+ skipping content) but how is it fair compared to the other play styles in the game who can do better in all the aspects (DPS, defense, fun) without having to do 10% of what melee need to invest? The problem when asking "what is your build?"... you will always find something you could do better, You will always be able to say " put more life, take more defenses" "you play like shit" "learn to skip content" but it is blinding you toward the real problem of this game : lack of BALANCE. Don t get me wrong, if the game was as hard for casters and ranged than for melee I would love it. I would love to see AOE skills to disappear or get less powerfull and make the game survival aspect harder. But I expect a fair balance. IF the game give easy mode to ranged, I want the same for melee. I want all classes to have equal chances to survive or die in this game. I want a better BALANCED game. Also sorry for my English if something sound off, this is not my native language. Forum pvp Last edited by lolozori on Jan 9, 2015, 3:43:43 AM
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Melee is useless on this game !
I always go back to ranged chars after trying with melee and getting sick of it on two days. |
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+1 to this thread
armor needs more phys protection first of all.. it's ridiculous a cloak of flame gives more armor than 20,000 armor which is not easy to get. Second armor needs some nodes on tree, three of them, that say: "Every 10,000 armor gives +1 max resists for dual wield and 2H, 0.5 with sheild" This would give up to +9 max resits for those ppl who could get 30,000 armor with a 2Hder Not only makes armor viable, makes 2 hder too. Now only real way to play melee is CI reeve/flicker in the late game with crazy assed ES gear for like 15,000 ES and no armor. Thats not really melee thats just nuking and DPS/EHP sponging. Git R Dun! Last edited by Aim_Deep on Jan 9, 2015, 3:53:59 AM
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Since we are all throwing in requests I thought I would add mine in as well:
1. I want to see some specific evasion boost for melee players - I want extra survivability for the risk I am taking. Armor users have molten shell, easy endurance charges on tree, IR stacking of grace + determination / jade + granite. What does evasion have, and specifically for melee? 2. I would like to see dodge revamped to the old style where it DID NOT reduce block OR I would like to see Phase Acro as a separate node. Ranger with 40% dodge 46% spell dodge has the same if not MORE DEFENSE than character holding a shield and getting some block nodes. 3. I would like to see a cast on evade gem/mechanic. 4. I would like to see Blind returned to its original 75%. If not I want ways to buff the effectiveness of Blind. 5. I would like to see Immortal Call nerfed. Evasion melee UP! Last edited by Ceryneian on Jan 9, 2015, 8:59:56 AM
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