Invasion players - no need to bash Standard Players

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Daarknight wrote:

I have a career. I have a beautiful home and a great family. Nothing was given to me and I think I am doing pretty well in the game of life.

Why do you feel you need to justify yourself on a gaming forum inhabited by people who are, on average, probably about half your age? Your enjoyment of the game shouldn't be so dependent on what other people -- especially random people whose lives never touch with yours -- think of you. Free yourself from tedious stuff like that.

On a side note, you don't want to get lumped into a category, but you dump all Invasion players together. That's the same thing you resent when it's done to you.

To me, it sounds more like you, yourself, have a lower opinion of Standard and would, if you could (time-wise), prefer to play in the league that yields more "respect". But if that's so, then it's merely a result of your own perception. Do you perceive Standard achievements as less prestigious?

If you do, change your perspective.
If you don't, stop caring about other people's perspectives.

(This is awfully preachy.)

I think a lot of it has to do with GGG promoting hardcore play and how they treat their streamers..

If this game was hardcore, when you died, they would be it.

I really can't stand people who say, "why do you care what people say?" As if they don't fucking care when someone insults them, especially if it's unjustified and seems to be endorsed by the company. Yeah Chris says he doesn't like the term but what have they done about it? Calling standard league scrubcore and calling the players who play there bad is as antagonizing as calling someone a list of offensive terms that get edited out of posts on a daily basis.

And yeah, having a wife, kids, 60 hour a week job among other responsibilities can prevent someone from playing hardcore if they want to progress at a pace that works for their limited play time. What it boils down to is having fun and when you have limited time, endlessly grinding low level areas isn't fun when you can take a little risk and progress at content level.

Why get worked up over it.. I play both HC / standard leagues and still call the league scrubcore. It's just a joke, just like calling hardcore the alt-f4 league.

I found the entire thread quite ironic.

OP is angry about some hardcore players feeling a sense of elitism, yet probably a solid 50% of his post is about why he is so elite. You have a great job, work a lot of hours, still kick ass in PoE, blablablabla...and you feel proud of that. And you should! But then you claim to not understand why people who spend all their times playing PoE would feel proud of their accomplishments.

Look, realistically we all know deep down that PoE doesn't matter for shit in the real world. You know it, I know it, the hardcore players saying "scrub this" and "scrub that" every 10 seconds also know it. However, it happens to be the game we are all playing right now.

In my experience, the point of the game is to TAKE YOU OUT OF THE REAL WORLD!

People like to immerse themselves in the game and get good at it for any number of psychological reasons, but one of the more prominent ones is the constant feeling of progression - climbing the ranks, rising up the ladder, whatever terminology you want to use.

What this means is that it doesn't matter if you are a millionaire playboy athlete or an awkward pimply-faced nerd, you are placed on the same footing as everyone else when in the game world. In the game world, no one cares about (or believes) any accomplishments you may have made in the real world. They only care about your progress in the game. And why shouldn't they? You have both decided to play the same game.

Logically, all these people know that you may very well be a playboy-athlete-millionaire with a huge schlong; but in game you are just a low level noob on the easiest game setting. Should they shower you with respect because of what you may be in real life, or is it perhaps understandable that there may be some gentle ribbing there?

I think some empathy would go a long way in this situation. If OP, as he says, has actually been in the mindset where he wants to play 8hrs+ a day on a game like this, I can only imagine that deep down he does understand the mindset but has moved past it and refuses to empathize with that younger self.

"Scrubcore" is just a phrase, don't read into it so much. The sense of "elitism," if that's really what you want to call it, is a completely necessary part of the game.

Does beating the game on standard take the same amount of effort as beating it on invasion? Do you feel as accomplished doing it? From a purely objective perspective, do you think that it is as worthy of in-game respect?

I think the last term I just touched on is an important one to tie my whole post together. In-game respect. In-game respect and out of game respect are two VERY different things. In the game, your life accomplishments, your family, your job, are all irrelevant. I don't know you or anything about your life, so why should I try to take those things into account?

I guess in some idealized world it would be "nice" if everyone gave everyone else playing the game the benefit of the doubt and assumed that even if your character is level 10 on standard that you are their equal or better in every way and deserving of their respect.

Realistically? Fat chance bud. You're playing with teenagers who, as you know, are literally devoting their life to this game. When someone spends so much time on something, they have to take it very seriously. When someone takes it so seriously, they take their progress seriously so they can feel PROUD of it! This feeling of PRIDE in their accomplishments is really what ultimately drives the look-down-the-nose at standard players. We all know being prideful to extreme is not a great virtue, but there it is and there you have it.

If you think long and hard, I think you can probably draw some really profound parallels between your real life accomplishments and pride in them, your feelings towards people who don't have those accomplishments; and the relation of this to the game world. Really OP, you have just moved on to a different game. A game in which the people calling you a scrub in poe are actually the scrubs. Do you really want to tell me you don't look down your nose at all at people, for example, who are still living with their parents and spending 8hrs a day playing this game? Of course you do.

Edit: One final thing I would like to add is that I think it's important to note that the "worst offenders" of this type of behavior, the truly vicious disparaging attacks on people just for being new or playing on standard, are coming from people with pretty serious psychological issues. Remember the awkward pimply-faced nerd I mentioned earlier? If you mentally put yourself in his shoes for a while, I think it becomes easier to understand. These kids probably have a very unrewarding or stressful life at home and really need the game world to develop ANY sense of self esteem at all, as crazy as that sounds. When you don't have a father figure and a good support system, it's easy to feel really shitty about yourself in real life, and the game can take you away from all that and make you into one of the more respected, more "elite," more whatever people. Of course then you will cling to that and probably in an unhealthy way. Anyway, I'm just saying to lighten up a bit and have some compassion. No one who works and has a family is looking down their nose at you for playing standard.

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Rai wrote:

If this game was hardcore, when you died, they would be it.

I really can't stand people who say, "why do you care what people say?" As if they don't fucking care when someone insults them, especially if it's unjustified and seems to be endorsed by the company. Yeah Chris says he doesn't like the term but what have they done about it? Calling standard league scrubcore and calling the players who play there bad is as antagonizing as calling someone a list of offensive terms that get edited out of posts on a daily basis.

And yeah, having a wife, kids, 60 hour a week job among other responsibilities can prevent someone from playing hardcore if they want to progress at a pace that works for their limited play time. What it boils down to is having fun and when you have limited time, endlessly grinding low level areas isn't fun when you can take a little risk and progress at content level.

Again, why do you care?

Play the game and do your thing, if peer pressure is your issue, play invasion to "show them".

What exactly do you want the developers to do against this? Delete the hardcore leagues? Pay your rent so you can play hardcore? (not that that is any argument)

"But those people insult me, do something about it game developers!" is something you say in first grade to your teacher, i'd expect your problem solving skills to advance over that at some point, in your life.

Softcore is so boring. No idea how you guys can join a party and watch everyone die constantly and zerg the content. Honestly posting on the forums is more entertaining than SC.

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Cataca wrote:

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Rai wrote:

If this game was hardcore, when you died, they would be it.

I really can't stand people who say, "why do you care what people say?" As if they don't fucking care when someone insults them, especially if it's unjustified and seems to be endorsed by the company. Yeah Chris says he doesn't like the term but what have they done about it? Calling standard league scrubcore and calling the players who play there bad is as antagonizing as calling someone a list of offensive terms that get edited out of posts on a daily basis.

And yeah, having a wife, kids, 60 hour a week job among other responsibilities can prevent someone from playing hardcore if they want to progress at a pace that works for their limited play time. What it boils down to is having fun and when you have limited time, endlessly grinding low level areas isn't fun when you can take a little risk and progress at content level.

Again, why do you care?

Play the game and do your thing, if peer pressure is your issue, play invasion to "show them".

What exactly do you want the developers to do against this? Delete the hardcore leagues? Pay your rent so you can play hardcore? (not that that is any argument)

"But those people insult me, do something about it game developers!" is something you say in first grade to your teacher, i'd expect your problem solving skills to advance over that at some point, in your life.

Lol I'm not going to indulge your stupidity, I will only go as far as to say, if the moderators, through the CEO of the company can delete posts that name and shame/ that are antagonistic, they can moderate the idiocy that is plaguing their game. And for the record, I never said I cared, I play what I want because it's my time but I'm not ignorant enough to not see how it can impact other people.

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Rai wrote:

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Cataca wrote:

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Rai wrote:

If this game was hardcore, when you died, they would be it.

I really can't stand people who say, "why do you care what people say?" As if they don't fucking care when someone insults them, especially if it's unjustified and seems to be endorsed by the company. Yeah Chris says he doesn't like the term but what have they done about it? Calling standard league scrubcore and calling the players who play there bad is as antagonizing as calling someone a list of offensive terms that get edited out of posts on a daily basis.

And yeah, having a wife, kids, 60 hour a week job among other responsibilities can prevent someone from playing hardcore if they want to progress at a pace that works for their limited play time. What it boils down to is having fun and when you have limited time, endlessly grinding low level areas isn't fun when you can take a little risk and progress at content level.

Again, why do you care?

Play the game and do your thing, if peer pressure is your issue, play invasion to "show them".

What exactly do you want the developers to do against this? Delete the hardcore leagues? Pay your rent so you can play hardcore? (not that that is any argument)

"But those people insult me, do something about it game developers!" is something you say in first grade to your teacher, i'd expect your problem solving skills to advance over that at some point, in your life.

Lol I'm not going to indulge your stupidity, I will only go as far as to say, if the moderators, through the CEO of the company can delete posts that name and shame/ that are antagonistic, they can moderate the idiocy that is plaguing their game. And for the record, I never said I cared, I play what I want because it's my time but I'm not ignorant enough to not see how it can impact other people.

Specifically, what do you want? Should in-game chat moderators give people a warning/timeout/mute/ban for saying scrubcore? Just curious.

If that is the case, do you also want them to then mute everyone who says noob? Because I can tell you from experience, the underlying behavior that is causing this as I explained in my last post, is not going away. If you strictly moderate all usage of the word scrub and scrubcore, fine. There will just be a new word or phrase that starts being used with essentially the exact same meaning. Maybe it's noob, maybe it's something else, ultimately it is a never ending battle that you can't win.

its a game. you play it for fun. if you like casual games, you avoid ones like poe; if you like harder games - you play those. you like playing in softcore? go roll there. you like hc? do the same in there. thats it, there is nothing more to it.

all these hc ppl who view themselves above the sc people fall into same category as those who are hunting achievements in wow or xbox live - they need to feel some sort of realisation because chances are high they miss that irl. just to note ive been playing onslought and after i hit lvl 45 (i think)...i grew bored. all that "omg always be on a lookout" thing idk it was becoming more and more boring. when i went sc it was more clear what to do and no second thoughts. i even attempted orchard with one hand with my lvl 65 pure melee (!!!!!!) char while talking on a phone (and actualy succeeded)