The REAL truth exposed!! (Brought to you by a player in top 10)

And it's stuff like this that has me not playing PoE. I miss the CBT days...

JohnKeys wrote:

"

...

with all due respect Chris, banning is only a very, very small fraction of the solution. in an earlier post, I compared it to swinging away at a swarm of flies, trying to catch some. you will - but the swarm won't go away.

what you really need to do, is cut the lifeline of RMT.

one way to do it, is to eliminate the use of maps as the only way to play past a certain level. this is done by adding content, which I believe you will at release or very soon after.

but in the meantime, you need to provide people with things to do - and the best way to do this, is increase both overall map drop-rate AND high currency drop-rate by several hundred percent in late-game areas.

this is a Beta, and the more people testing-out end-game content - the better. it will also put your current content to a "stress test" of sorts, putting it up against players with good self-found gear and solid character builds.
but most importantly, it will give more people more ways to enjoy the game in it's current unfinished state, thereby dealing a crippling blow to RMT by eliminating demand.

I know the economy needs to be balanced, but it's better to "break it" this way and actually let people enjoy the current content, than keep it strict so people will either leave when they run out of stuff to do, or worse - go to the Real Money sites for their maps and currency like the OP explained, thereby both breaking the economy AND fueling RMT.

and when the Beta is over, I personally have nothing against a character wipe like the one you did after Closed Beta.
just please let me and my friends enjoy the game until then, without making it a meaningless grind that literally forces you into RMT with every step you take.

...

You, Sir, are right - period.
I don't get why GGG does not go that way - a simple and effective way to solve a few problems until release. And then, bam, charwipe, why not.

I've always wondered why, given that Chris and the GGG team confirmed that maps were "just a stopgap" for the endgame, what exactly is the harm in significantly improving map drop rates? "Oh no, more people in endgame, that's bad!"?

"

Aysnvaust wrote:

what you really need to do, is cut the lifeline of RMT.

sounds good so far...

"

Aysnvaust wrote:

one way to do it, is to eliminate the use of maps as the only way to play past a certain level. this is done by adding content, which I believe you will at release or very soon after.

this is a total non-sequitir and has nothing to do with cutting the lifeline of rmt

going after the lifeline of rmt means finding rmt purchasers -- not sellers -- and banning the hell out of them. and i thoroughly encourage that, because the purchasers are overall less tech-savvy than the rmt sellers -- the sellers are normally botters with very solid knowledge of exploits and how to avoid detection, while the purchasers are essentially normal folks with bad ethics, and thus much easier to catch

it does not mean becoming a rmt sympathizer

"

PlaceholderText wrote:

"

Aysnvaust wrote:

what you really need to do, is cut the lifeline of RMT.

sounds good so far...

"

Aysnvaust wrote:

one way to do it, is to eliminate the use of maps as the only way to play past a certain level. this is done by adding content, which I believe you will at release or very soon after.

this is a total non-sequitir and has nothing to do with cutting the lifeline of rmt

going after the lifeline of rmt means finding rmt purchasers -- not sellers -- and banning the hell out of them. and i thoroughly encourage that, because the purchasers are overall less tech-savvy than the rmt sellers -- the sellers are normally botters with very solid knowledge of exploits and how to avoid detection, while the purchasers are essentially normal folks with bad ethics, and thus much easier to catch

it does not mean becoming a rmt sympathizer

That has precisely nothing to do with "cutting the lifeline." You're swatting some flies after they've already buzzed about. "Cutting the lifeline" is to reduce the number of people that resort to RMTing even before they get there.

I really don't care for the whole map concept in the current form. I hope it will be done away with in the future. That system is going to turn a whole lot of players off in the long term. I like the idea of zones you can enter whenever you want and the zone has randomized affixes without grinding map drops.

I understand why the map system is currently in place. The game isn't finished, the developers want the game to be as grindy as possible. The map system going forward, I can tell you right now, catastrophic if that is the long-term plan. In the short-term, I can understand the system as nothing more than a stop-gap.


My personal opinion of this game is that it is a fine game, until you start hitting end game. The biggest problem other than balance is the transition.

The game flows very well, then all of a sudden, you hit a brick wall that isn't fun. Grindy just for the sake of being grindy isn't good. There is challenge done the right way, then there is challenge done the wrong way.

A system that is extremely masochistic is the wrong way.
A system that is accessible but extremely challenging is the right way.

I see nothing wrong with making maps always accessible but putting timers on them. If you're not geared enough to tackle that map, the timer runs out and you're booted out, the penalty is a lockout for several hours.

This means people will have to have a certain gear level to tackle the content. You can create whacky penalties for failure, the point is, the area is always there rather than hoping you roll maps.

A Map system I would like to see is one that champions constant progression.

You have the entry level zone, some basic map affixes. Once the player farms the zone, he/she gains access to the next tier. For instance.

Tier 1, Entry level.

Level 66 zone, once defeated access to 67 zone is gained.
Level 67 zone, once defeated access to 68 zone is gained.
Level 68 zone, once defeated access to 69 zone is gained.
Level 69 zone, once defeated access to 70 zone is gained.

Tier 2, 20% harder than Tier 1.

Level 70 zone, once defeated access to 71 zone is gained.
Level 71 zone, once defeated access to 72 zone is gained.
Level 72 zone, once defeated access to 73 zone is gained.
Level 73 zone, once defeated access to 74 zone is gained.
Level 74 zone, once defeated access to 75 zone is gained.
Level 75 zone, once defeated access to 76 zone is gained.

Tier 3, 40% harder than Tier 2.

Level 76 zone, once defeated access to 77 zone is gained.
Level 77 zone, once defeated access to 78 zone is gained.
Level 78 zone, once defeated access to 79 zone is gained.
Level 79 zone, once defeated access to 80 zone is gained.
Level 80 zone, once defeated access to 81 zone is gained.

Tier 4, 60% harder than Tier 3

Level 81 zone, once defeated access to 82 zone is gained.
Level 82 zone, once defeated access to 83 zone is gained.
Level 83 zone, once defeated access to 84 zone is gained.
Level 84 zone, once defeated access to 85 zone is gained.
Level 85 zone, once defeated access to 86 zone is gained.

Tier 5, 80% harder than Tier 4, random status effects.

Level 86 zone, once defeated access to 87 zone is gained.
Level 87 zone, once defeated access to 88 zone is gained.
Level 88 zone, once defeated access to 89 zone is gained.
Level 89 zone, once defeated access to 90 zone is gained.
Level 90 zone, once defeated access to 91 zone is gained.

Tier 6, 100% harder than Tier 5, random status effects(no temporal chains), 10 minute timer(smaller maps)/timer expire = ejection/lockout for 4hrs.

Level 91 zone, once defeated access to 92 zone is gained.
Level 92 zone, once defeated access to 93 zone is gained.
Level 93 zone, once defeated access to 94 zone is gained.
Level 94 zone, once defeated access to 95 zone is gained.
Level 95 zone, once defeated access to 96 zone is gained.

Tier 7, 120% harder than Tier 6, random status effects, 6 minute timer(no temporal chains)(smaller maps)/timer expire = ejection/lockout for 6hrs.

Level 96 zone, once defeated access to 97 zone is gained.
Level 97 zone, once defeated access to 98 zone is gained.
Level 98 zone, once defeated access to 99 zone is gained.
Level 99 zone, once defeated access to 100 zone is gained.

Tier 8, 250% harder than Tier 7, random status effects, Death limit, each player has a total of 3 deaths before being locked out of the zone for 48hrs.

3 random bosses end bosses, pulling from any previous map/act bosses.


There you go, constant progression, challenge, not relying on random map grinding. Those who execute won't incur penalties, those who fail, will suffer lockouts, this means execution is paramount at the top level.

I'm glad that my old post in this thread, managed to re-open the discussion.
thank you Aysnvaust, for the quote.

and PlaceholderText, it is as I told you in your "skinner box" thread: you have to reward the players for their effort (in loot or otherwise, like unlockable quests, achievements etc'), and give them other options to progress, if they are not RNG-lucky with map drops, but are skilled enough.

if you don't - it creates demand for RMT. pure and simple. the link between the two is a direct and clearly visible one.

if you do - you'll cut the lifeline of RMT. make your players enjoy the game as opposed to making a large portion of them feel like they are grinding for nothing.

and then you can take your trusty banhammer, call your favourite website-lawsuit lawyer, and proceed to wipe the bastards out completely.

The talk in the OP about the system forcing people to resort to RMT is ridiculous. This is purely a "keeping up with the Jones'" problem. If your neighbors didn't buy a new bmw, you wouldn't feel like you need one too.

This problem is going to come up in any game where there is a high cap on how much currency can help you and players are free to trade currency. Policing RMT in a game like this is always going to fail worse than the war on drugs unless extreme restriction are imposed. Also players who use RMT are always going to have an advantage.

The solution is to not have your self worth wrapped up in how you compare to the other people who are playing the game. And if that's unavoidable, know that players who are spending real cash are in a totally different category than you.

All the talk about the problem being that high level maps take extra currency to obtain is missing the point. If everyone had to do this, it wouldn't be an issue. It's just the people who QQ about the RMT players and the RMT players themselves that are the issue.

"

A_Riot_Coming wrote:

The talk in the OP about the system forcing people to resort to RMT is ridiculous. This is purely a "keeping up with the Jones'" problem. If your neighbors didn't buy a new bmw, you wouldn't feel like you need one too.

So why have a ladder at all if you don't want people to try to 'keep up with the Joneses'? Did the developers at GGG expect to have completely changed human nature?

making a new account wont conceal your identity


ggg know exactly who you are because of the unique mac address's your modem + router + computer use, your I.P address, browser cache.


Maybe you changed your I.P session address, or used a proxy thinking you would be hidden , guess what... they know!