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fair enough, i agree its very artificial solution, but how do we protect the game from turning into boss delete or bust? poe1 has been in that state for years now and its very boring
You don't. You release new challenges for the player, but trying to artificially hold players back from their progression isn't a healthy goal for the game. If you want people coming back to the game every new league, you need to accept that the bosses are going to lose any real form of challenge, especially during the campaign. You make a harder boss further in the maps, build a new challenge for them to take.
All these people that want to police how others play have private profiles because they want to act like PoE 1 is the easy game and 2 is going to be the hard game and if they made their profiles public you'll see they maybe made it to maps, but in most cases I'm doubting it. Yet they think Poe 2 will somehow gatekeep out the players that regularly outperform them in the "easy game". Since that isn't the case now they want damage limits.
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Posted byMr_Vagtastic#4761on Dec 13, 2024, 9:22:55 PM
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fair enough, i agree its very artificial solution, but how do we protect the game from turning into boss delete or bust? poe1 has been in that state for years now and its very boring
You don't. You release new challenges for the player, but trying to artificially hold players back from their progression isn't a healthy goal for the game. If you want people coming back to the game every new league, you need to accept that the bosses are going to lose any real form of challenge, especially during the campaign. You make a harder boss further in the maps, build a new challenge for them to take.
well this was done over and over in poe1, again i don;t find this exciting at all. and in fact most ppl don't hence all the requests about skipping campaign. because like you said yourself old game content turned trivial and you need to get to the very very end to even enjoy it, whihc take longer and longer each new league. so why not just skip the chore
There in lies the issue. If you keep nerfing the player so they have to go longer in the campaign to get to the content they want to enjoy, you're burning players who don't find the campaign fun anymore. Which is a great way to doom the longevity of the game. There's no way to make the campaign "Fun" after 6 or 7 times doing it, it's just not gonna happen. It's already taxing on my 3rd time through it, watching the same drawn out animations for every interaction, the stupid voice lines having to play out for bosses to transition phases. It's tiring. Right now the endgame is in a rough spot, but that's what most people who come back are gonna be playing for, and you can't force people to enjoy the campaign everytime, because it's always gonna be a roadblock to them.
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Posted byAuralysist#4050on Dec 13, 2024, 9:23:20 PM
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fair enough, i agree its very artificial solution, but how do we protect the game from turning into boss delete or bust? poe1 has been in that state for years now and its very boring
You don't. You release new challenges for the player, but trying to artificially hold players back from their progression isn't a healthy goal for the game. If you want people coming back to the game every new league, you need to accept that the bosses are going to lose any real form of challenge, especially during the campaign. You make a harder boss further in the maps, build a new challenge for them to take.
well this was done over and over in poe1, again i don;t find this exciting at all. and in fact most ppl don't hence all the requests about skipping campaign. because like you said yourself old game content turned trivial and you need to get to the very very end to even enjoy it, whihc take longer and longer each new league. so why not just skip the chore
This is exactly why being able to one shot the bosses needs to be possible with only base game mechanics. You are advocating for keeping the bosses challenging but you also admit that people aren't going to want to do the campaign again in season 3 for instance. So which one is it. Do you want to keep bosses challenging but let people skip the entire campaign or do you want people to be able to speedrun the campaign but have to do it every single season. Which one you can't have both.
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Posted byCrypt12#7830on Dec 13, 2024, 9:23:26 PM
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You aren't seeming to understand the difficulty in getting to the point where you can one shot these bosses. Second you don't seem to understand that alot of the endgame bosses actually can't be one shot. Usually if they can its because of a build that got discovered THAT PATCH. The build that did that usually immediately gets nerfed the very next patch.
You said just buy gear go one shot boss is the poe1 cycle. You are failing to consider that gear isn't free you need to be able to farm currency. Nobody is giving you a 1 divine plus cost bow for free. Nobody is giving you a double corrupted GG energy shield chest plate for a "hey thanks guy". Early maps drop next to no currency. Your method of gaining currency goes up with the more difficult content you do.
after you played the game for years there is absolutely no difficulty in reaching a point to skip phases. you don't even need to watch a guide. all you need to see is patch notes or new skills/items. it becomes clear and even if you don't min max the shit out of it, most content in-game is a walk in the park. also i don;t farm currency, i don't trade
You also don't make it very far in the game.
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Posted byMr_Vagtastic#4761on Dec 13, 2024, 9:24:10 PM
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A damage cap is laughable, you know what that means? It means the optimum strat becomes reaching the damage cap and then stopping because there's no point to trying to reach more damage and instead overloading on defensive stats so you can't die. And then do you know what the balance will shift to after that? The other end of the spectrum where bosses need to be given way more 1 hit kills and defense bypassing abilities going by your logic.
Unless of course your ideal is for everybody to just turtle their way through the giant empty maps with hordes of enemies.
My early access feedback: https://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/3639607
My Witch early access feedback: https://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/3632153 Last edited by Morghus#4174 on Dec 13, 2024, 9:28:41 PM
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Posted byMorghus#4174on Dec 13, 2024, 9:24:44 PM
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i feel you op.
it s the end of the illusions.
balance is still as bad as poe with the horrible outlier builds and the shit tier skills.
just saw a warcry build that hit super hard almost whole screen.
now future will tell if they keep it that way or not. but somewhat funny to see all the believers in the vision suddenly realizing it maybe not as visiony as they thought it was.
anyway, for me, damage or no damage, games feels too slow. and on top of that i see a fucking warcry build.
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Posted bySerialF#4835on Dec 13, 2024, 9:25:03 PM
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This is exactly why being able to one shot the bosses needs to be possible with only base game mechanics. You are advocating for keeping the bosses challenging but you also admit that people aren't going to want to do the campaign again in season 3 for instance. So which one is it. Do you want to keep bosses challenging but let people skip the entire campaign or do you want people to be able to speedrun the campaign but have to do it every single season. Which one you can't have both.
They want it so tedious that they're the only ones who still play so they can be the best players on the servers.
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Posted byMr_Vagtastic#4761on Dec 13, 2024, 9:25:20 PM
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fair enough, i agree its very artificial solution, but how do we protect the game from turning into boss delete or bust? poe1 has been in that state for years now and its very boring
You don't. You release new challenges for the player, but trying to artificially hold players back from their progression isn't a healthy goal for the game. If you want people coming back to the game every new league, you need to accept that the bosses are going to lose any real form of challenge, especially during the campaign. You make a harder boss further in the maps, build a new challenge for them to take.
All these people that want to police how others play have private profiles because they want to act like PoE 1 is the easy game and 2 is going to be the hard game and if they made their profiles public you'll see they maybe made it to maps, but in most cases I'm doubting it. Yet they think Poe 2 will somehow gatekeep out the players that regularly outperform them in the "easy game". Since that isn't the case now they want damage limits.
man I remember the first character I had that made it to shaper guardians, the bosses were actually hard but all of my upgrades to push my damage further were multiple divine and I had no idea how to make good money to push it further. eventually I got lucky and got a really expensive void stone which pushed me to being able to do Eater and the Exarch. The bosses were challenging and actually made me do mechanics. Anyone saying this is easy either hasn't done it or let other people give them the currency or items for their build.
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Posted byCrypt12#7830on Dec 13, 2024, 9:27:54 PM
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The game's very complex and only going to get more complex when they add the other 6 classes. I worry about their ability to balance any of it from what I've seen.
Good. Balance is boring.
Yup, balance is the death of fun. This isn't a competitive game, and all the games in this genre have shown multiple times that it's most fun when it goes off the rails.
Thank you, I dont get this fixation on forcing everything to have the same dps/balance if it just makes everything mundane. POE is meant to have builds that get experimented with and some person comes up with a build or idea that "breaks" the game but that's what's fun and interesting about POE. If people want over regulated builds with no experimentation Im sure their are other games that can fulfill that niche. really the only people who should be worried about build power are the ones who race each league but even thats a small subset of people. Its not like POE is a PVP game.
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Posted byErebus1800#6364on Dec 13, 2024, 9:28:56 PM
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man I remember the first character I had that made it to shaper guardians, the bosses were actually hard but all of my upgrades to push my damage further were multiple divine and I had no idea how to make good money to push it further. eventually I got lucky and got a really expensive void stone which pushed me to being able to do Eater and the Exarch. The bosses were challenging and actually made me do mechanics. Anyone saying this is easy either hasn't done it or let other people give them the currency or items for their build.
Seriously and this league tier 17s were obliterating people, these guys don't know because they haven't done it.
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Posted byMr_Vagtastic#4761on Dec 13, 2024, 9:29:37 PM
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