We are likely never gonna be as powerful as in Crucible.
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Then i think you are mistaking the vibes by a lot. I am NOT interested in making this game easy mode, i DON'T even want to have a separate easy mode in the game like some people. SC trade fills that role perfectly already.
The only thing i ever asked for is meaningful progression WITHOUT trade. That's the only reason i liked harvest and that's all i want. I don't even care how, SSF mode with decent drops, SSF mode with a tuned down 3.13 harvest crafting or something similar, a crafting implemented in a way where it can't be used alongside trade thanks to a certain discord to spiral powercreep out of control, whatever works would be fine by me. I'd be perfectly fine with it even if the progression speed without trade was like 10% or even 5% of what trade league provides but with the current game it's more like 0,00001% of trade progression speed if you play SSF because crafting does not exist and loot is useless past white maps. Trade is just a horrible form of gear progression as far as i am concerned, zero feeling of accomplishment involved. I've bought a mageblood the other day and i literally felt nothing because i didn't find/make that thing, i just bought it from someone else. It's no sweat to go an beat up ubers with 20 divines, heck i've done that already using oh so garbage melee builds. I could do that just fine in trade league if i was so inclined. There is just no point doing it only to restart from zero next league to do it again. Also, read what he wrote, he didn't say anything along the lines of "20-40 divines is something average players can do within a league". He said 20-40 divines is basically free. You do see the difference between those two statements yes? Last edited by Baharoth15#0429 on Jul 7, 2023, 8:05:11 AM
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" Noice^^ first one as well or? 3.26 when?
Don't abandon us. don't turn your backs on the ones loving poe. |
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" "Meaningful"? What does that mean? A path to craft whatever you want? In my eyes, that doesn't really go hand in hand with trading and RNG. The only way to achieve this in the long run, is to either limit these crafts severely (max T3 affixes), or to make them soul bound - or else the economy would delete all sense of progression in a MUCH bigger way than it already does. Maybe you wouldn't care about any of this, but a lot of people would. Personally? I would be OK with vanilla Harvest if they made the items soul bound and/or limited the potential affixes to T3-4. But would the community as a whole? I seriously doubt it. Bring me some coffee and I'll bring you a smile.
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Again, screw the economy, honestly just fuck it. I am so damned tired of hearing it. "mehh we can't do x it would be bad for the economy" this is an ARPG for gods sake. It's so warped that everything in this supposed to be ARPG revolves around the economy. Make the crafting results accountbound, make it an SSF mode without transfer options i don't care just don't force me into this bullshit.
Meaningful = similar to what you can do in trade, can be a good bit (10-20 times) slower for all i care but the possibility to make it past "i've got rare gear with 50 life and 60 total res in every slot" levels should be there and currently that just isn't the case unless you are willing to put literal years into it as a casual or concentrated playtimes equal to that. I played essentially SSF from bestiary to expedition and most of my builds were stuck at like 2 mio dps. Then i started using trade a bit in 3.16 and bam 50 mio+ dps on a build. The gap between trade and non-trade is just absurd, just shrink it to reasonable levels. And yes i know it's never gonna happen but that doesn't change the fact that this game would be so much more appealing towards a large audience if it had a mode for people that actually want to play an ARPG and not an economy simulation. But no, the devs rather spend their time on maso mode to satisfy their fetisch -.- Last edited by Baharoth15#0429 on Jul 7, 2023, 3:12:50 PM
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" You know this is like saying "screw classes in Skyrim", right? It's like giving the middle finger to one of the main pillars this game is built upon, and something many, many players enjoy. Sure, it should be improved - greatly, but it is and will always remain a major factor in balancing. I thought a player playing for as long as you have would've accepted that by now. Bring me some coffee and I'll bring you a smile.
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" This is again a common misnomer, especially amongst the folks that frequent the forums, Reddit, or Twitch. "A LOT" isn't really a lot. In fact it's quite small. Hell more than 80% of players don't even make it to maps, and the percentages drop into the low single figures for the Maven/Eatwr/Exarch categories. Let alone farming and currency acquisition over a period of time. Spending 20-40 div on a single gear slot? That's a tiny, fractional, segment of players. It's like there is a suspension of belief that happens with PoE vets / elites, that they assume most everyone has their same experience. It's not even close statistically, and I suspect often times they really have no idea how the average player experiences PoE. I tend to say they are "out of touch" but that ruffles feathers. I don't know how else to explain it...they simply don't get it or refuse to listen. Like not even to try to understand, despite empirical evidence readily available. "Better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to speak out and remove all doubt."
- Abraham Lincoln |
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" Yeah right, that must be why we get AH requests every week and why so many people were pissed about harvest. Face it, the vast majority of players in this game play it DESPITE trade, not BECAUSE of it. And yeah, it's a design pillar but it's a shitty one and no matter how long i play this game, it won't get any more appealing. Accepting things and liking them are two entirely different matters. |
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" LOL. No, it's not. You can literally do everything you want in PoE without trade. You could even call it SSF, if you will. Problem is, trade is that rotting, mangled corpse in the middle of the room that CW purposefully left there, and the vast majority of people would tell him to fuck off it he was to remove it, so he keeps spraying cologne to not acknowledge how bad that shit is stinking up the room. So instead of removing the corpse and putting a juicy piece of meat for people to nibble on, that corpse spills over to other rooms that have shit to do with trade. Trade is, actually, the Horse DLC none wanted and it fucked everything up since. Ruthless should be [Removed by Support].
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" That is exactly why... You don't see that many advocate for trade to go away, as in "fuck trade". And as I said, trade should be improved, greatly. And we've discussed Harvest and trade for several years. I wish people would just... "Fuck Harvest". As you like to pull the word "majority" out of your behind here, I could do the same; "the majority" of players liked Harvest because it gave them easy access to immense power. Everyone and their grandmother can understand why, and I liked it for what is was. What I didn't like, was how it made loot, essences, resonators, fossils and every other mechanic in the game obsolete because it trumped everything in power. " Please note that we're talking about average players here. Neither of us really know what the average PoE player each league achieves; I'm not aware of any league specific statistics. Also note that I used the words "can do", not "easily do". A couple of divines per week throughout the league isn't really unobtainable for anyone, especially the average PoE player. He has probably played for a while. Bring me some coffee and I'll bring you a smile.
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" I suppose that's fair. It's true the measurements are overall, not specifically league to league. GGG used to provide updates on player percentages for achievements each league but they don't do that anymore. (Insert cynical reason why) However I do feel mostly confident in saying that average players do not spend 20-40 div per gear slot during the amount of time they do play each league. We would be talking about hundreds of divs per build, and...I just don't think that's happening. Maybe I'm wrong, because I can't back that up with data, but even with your "few divs a week" estimate, it seems unlikely. "Better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to speak out and remove all doubt."
- Abraham Lincoln |
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