Is pre nerf harvest actually balanced for SSF and standard players ?

GGG could quite easily remove TFT trading from Harvest and return it to its former glory.

1. Remove the crafting bench
2. Items crafted on must have been in your possession when you first entered the Harvest instance.

Job done... No soulbinding (which GGG doesn't like) needed.

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Cyzax wrote:

GGG could quite easily remove TFT trading from Harvest and return it to its former glory.

The "problem" with this, is that they don't see it as "glory". Of course they could easily do it, but they don't want to, and I understand them perfectly.

I agree with Yamface's argument about it invalidating the other content the problem is I feel like it still does, I occasionally use other sources to craft but all thats really changed is the exalts per craft ratio not the fact we use harvest to craft.

How many current strong crafts are predicated on reroll prefixes/suffixes for example? I already can't believe they didn't make that one a T4 but most items start off with one side "finished" then iterate on the other.

I'd actually have been happier if post harvest league we never saw it again, it doesn't fit their design for anything else.

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Cyzax wrote:

GGG could quite easily remove TFT trading from Harvest and return it to its former glory.

1. Remove the crafting bench
2. Items crafted on must have been in your possession when you first entered the Harvest instance.

Job done... No soulbinding (which GGG doesn't like) needed.

Former glory no good. All we did is farm Hamlet 24/7 until we got a full kit...

GGG as well as most players want a diverse game-play.

It's in a pretty good spot except tier 4's basically non existent. That's because of TFT. Anyway, we use fossils, essence and Jun/ansling/veiled chaos more this way.

Harvest felt like cheating. It was bad for the game. It was fun for a week or so but would have ruined any hope for long term development. People really need to get over that.

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Shagsbeard wrote:

It was bad for the game.

What people say for any mechanic they dont like.

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Shagsbeard wrote:

People really need to get over that.

Yeah... what people say for any mechanic they dont like.


You aren't wrong, its bad for the game YOU want. But what 99.9999% of the forums wont ever accept is that the game we want to play isnt how most other people experience PoE.

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Phrazz wrote:

Nothing is "balanced around" SSF, and probably never will.

Except when Harvest was in the game.

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VolcanoElixir wrote:

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Phrazz wrote:

Nothing is "balanced around" SSF, and probably never will.

Except when Harvest was in the game.

Even that wasn't, because it favored trade leagues more. I played both sides of harvest. Up until the last 3 days, I pretty much played it in a SSF manner; I would get about 15-30 of each seed, and populate my garden as soon as I got seeds, and would rotate about 4-6 plots per harvest. My rate of crafting was okay, but the variety meant I was working like 20 crafted items at the same time, and none of them were really getting done. I'd get 3 good prefixes or suffixes, and then have to consider awakeners/Augs/etc which usually wouldn't work out.

When Harvest had 3 days left, I began buying everyone's stacks of 900+ Seeds of specific types (Life, Chaos, Seed 4's) and planting them en masse over my entire farm, so that the entire farm would be ready per 3 maps. I began getting about 3-4 Augs and 2-3 Removals every time I harvested, and started crafting about 16 mods per trip to craft.

I didn't quite get finished that way, but made sizeable gains. I then had a friend who was 36 Challenges and trusted on TFT start working some items for me (I mainly did this during Ritual though)

I can tell you straight up: buying in masse the SEEDS was by far the most productive use of my time, currency, and crafting success by far. TFT Exacted a serious cost to search mods that you had to farm back. Seeds could be bought for a few chaos.



I miss crafting this top the most.

Almost everything else, I can still craft now, reasonably well, because GGG upped the rates of high tier rolls, and removed a LOT of mods from influences.



This shield was almost perfect, but I was sleepy one night and chose the wrong way to get rid of a deterministic mod removal; It used to have level 5 CWDT ELDER on an Atzoatl shield.

Good luck getting Elder on an Atzoatl shield now.

Also an impossible ring now (almost)

More now nearly impossible items.

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yamface wrote:

tft has nothing to do with the kind of power prenerf harvest had and i hate when people use tft as the scapegoat of harvest. yes tft created its own problems, but its not like magically getting rid of trade discords will conveniently fix everything

people have to accept the fact that when this was used properly, with or without trade, harvest invalidated everything else about poe. in the ritual league, harvest invalidated the ritual mechanic itself, it invalidated harbinger farming, legions, delirium mirrors, alva temples, metamorphs, blight encounters, you get the idea. anything that slowed down sacred grove hunting was a waste of time

What are you talking about? Harvest didn't invalidate anything in Ritual.
There was still plenty of 6-12 ex/hour farming methods outside of Harvest.

Ritual was invalidated during a league where Ritual Vessels were 6 chaos orbs?
People didn't catch up to it during Ritual until Ultimatum, but ritual farming was the absolute best way to farm pure Mirrors in the game.
Cutedog farmed 3 Mirrors that league and averaged 1 mirror every 100 maps he did or something like that.

I literally farmed a mirror in 3 days in Ritual by running Legion in New Vastir for over 10 ex/hour. So legion certainly wasn't invalidated.

Harbinger farming was invalidated? I don't know what game you were playing. Harbinger farming was the absolute best low investment farming strategy the game has ever seen. Every casual player under the sun was running hundreds of Canyons farming Ancient Orbs grinding up for their first headhunter ever doing Alch and go strategies. For higher investment people included Gilded Metamorphs in Valdos together with Harbingers and Betrayal double rank ascendency point and could easily farm 5-6 ex/hour investing 15 chaos per map.
Harbinger farming was so popular that Auspicious Watchstones literally were 20 exalted orbs.

Delirium mirrors weren't invalidated by Harvest. Problem with Delirium was that it wasn't on the map device and people hadn't thought about buying Delirium rolled watchstones from trade yet.
Everytime Delirium appear as a Zana mod it becomes one of the best metafarming strategies. Had Delirium been on the map device in 3.13 it would easily have been a 10ex/hour strategy.
Delirium mirror aside, 3.13 still had Fractured Map farming with x5 Scarab Delirium Orbs which is the most busted farming strategy the game has ever seen. Easily more profitable than Harvest was. People with minmaxed builds, me included were making 20ex/hour farming Fractured maps.

Alva temple was invalidated? Alva temple was as strong as it ever has been. It's basically a gambling option for the lategame.
During endgame ritual double corrupts were selling for 4 ex. Double corrupt on gems were selling for ~2 ex and you could up Transcendant Flesh to make ~2 ex profit. Was it profitable to farm Alva and double corrupt random stuff? Depended on your RNG.

Harvest farming was one amongst dozens of insane farming strategies in 3.13.
It didn't invalidate anything. There were several strategies that could compete with it.

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Deadandlivin wrote:

very long post

why would anyone do any of that to farm mirrors when you can generate a 6x t1 mod item in less time? using gear that costs next to nothing. with an investment cost of also next to nothing per map?

not to mention farming mirrors has always been a time gate strategy. the later you get your builds ready to farm mirrors, the harder it gets as the price always increases over time to slowly match standard's prices. you dont have to worry about any of this when you camp harvests.