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I had the symptoms early in league too where I'd just freeze for indefinite amounts of time in arena or even ctf.
I think i changed predictive back to off? Something eventually helped.
But no I'm serious I can think of times when uber atziri was the hardest boss and flicker would blast to her and ez her while most builds half struggled with normal atziri. Now atziri is a joke but uber elder has a pretty select few ways to kill it.
I'm actually scared if I'm trying to level in 400s delve with any big double dmg mods and im on 17k es 20% regen from my mines and half high block values. Like always theres a few bs ways that break delve and im sure itll get some nerfs in that direction.
I can think of times when clear speed on average was faster than current, of times when sextant blocking was a thing and xp gains hadn't been nerfed and qotf had no cap...
Shaper content was easier to trivialize when it came out than uber elder stuff now.
I guess my point is that I've seen worse power creep states of the game than now, I mean how are they going to keep this thing alive without adding mods and content? So all i can say is from my experience the state of the game has always had 'power creep.' I think wayyyyy back before i picked it up in beta and the 1 point etc patches were closest to clean but that's natural. And we've both played and enjoyed the game well past that
i think the game has only gotten faster. you mention faster clears with qotf, but the gear/skills have seen so many more buffs.
as for new mods - i don't have any problem with new mods. i have a problem with higher tiers. and i have a problem with new mods being OP.
they nerfed ES only to add it back with the delve mods, for instance.
as far as both of us enjoying the game since... well, ehh. sometimes.
i skipped a bunch of leagues because i was sick of the power creep and would rather have done/played something else. but i always kept poe on my radar in case it came back around.
poe has an added benefit of other games also sucking. and the arpg genre is quite bad currently. but i don't think that excuses all the power creep.
[Removed by Support]
"Your forum signature was removed as it was considered to be inappropriate and a breach of our Code of Conduct."
...it was quotes. from the forum. lolz!
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Posted byrobmafiaon Nov 20, 2018, 9:26:07 PM
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Power creep is awesome and fun. Don't change a thing GGG.
Saved
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Posted by60x7on Nov 20, 2018, 9:48:11 PM
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this is a problem, when your players (and not exactly the original players you started with) start dictating shit
Well, i think that game should be made for players, so listening to them isnt actually bad.
however, as i already wrote earlier, if they indeed want to make a sonic-fast game for rush addict players, then they should change many of game's aspects to accomodate it. Game's engine, for example. They cant make a truly FAST game with that clunky, unoptimised and resource-hungry engine they've got. Also, add auto-pickup, AH, big inventory, identified items drop nd many other things, that wont slow down a player on his ascention to becoming the Quicksilver incarnate.
there is a difference between listening and appeasing while letting them dictate shit
when your ideas of what your game should be like get compromised by players insatiable appetite, it might be a time to think whether you are castrated because you lack the balls to stick to your guns - ie, initial vision
otherwise players will dictate everything, taking leg and arm and then some. akin to kindergartners who will demand a ferrari at some point if you dont put your foot down and refuse them something
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Posted bygrepmanon Nov 20, 2018, 9:53:09 PM
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Power creep is awesome and fun. Don't change a thing GGG.
I fully expect people who like power creep to justify it with something so meaningless as 'awesome and fun'.
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Posted bygrepmanon Nov 20, 2018, 9:54:05 PM
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I had the symptoms early in league too where I'd just freeze for indefinite amounts of time in arena or even ctf.
I think i changed predictive back to off? Something eventually helped.
But no I'm serious I can think of times when uber atziri was the hardest boss and flicker would blast to her and ez her while most builds half struggled with normal atziri. Now atziri is a joke but uber elder has a pretty select few ways to kill it.
I'm actually scared if I'm trying to level in 400s delve with any big double dmg mods and im on 17k es 20% regen from my mines and half high block values. Like always theres a few bs ways that break delve and im sure itll get some nerfs in that direction.
I can think of times when clear speed on average was faster than current, of times when sextant blocking was a thing and xp gains hadn't been nerfed and qotf had no cap...
Shaper content was easier to trivialize when it came out than uber elder stuff now.
I guess my point is that I've seen worse power creep states of the game than now, I mean how are they going to keep this thing alive without adding mods and content? So all i can say is from my experience the state of the game has always had 'power creep.' I think wayyyyy back before i picked it up in beta and the 1 point etc patches were closest to clean but that's natural. And we've both played and enjoyed the game well past that
i think the game has only gotten faster. you mention faster clears with qotf, but the gear/skills have seen so many more buffs.
as for new mods - i don't have any problem with new mods. i have a problem with higher tiers. and i have a problem with new mods being OP.
they nerfed ES only to add it back with the delve mods, for instance.
as far as both of us enjoying the game since... well, ehh. sometimes.
i skipped a bunch of leagues because i was sick of the power creep and would rather have done/played something else. but i always kept poe on my radar in case it came back around.
poe has an added benefit of other games also sucking. and the arpg genre is quite bad currently. but i don't think that excuses all the power creep.
Es is back in larger than pre nerf values in some cases thanks to delve but without vaal pact meta you can buy similar tiers for 1/4 the price so idk if thats actually power creep (it's harder to use effectively).
To one extent i agree with you. There are overly blatant ways of getting damage if you know which skill to put it with and this is definitely due to the tiers/mods/ascendancy. But this is a syndrome of an old game and knowing the patches that led to here.
The same seemingly overly powerful items might be shit on the wrong skill choice alone, even when intuitively they should scale the same way. So rather than complain about power creep I think I'd rather complain about balance issues, play-ability, and diversity knowing that mods/tiers/tree options are going to get stronger as the game adds content.
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Posted bytheD4nk0wlon Nov 20, 2018, 10:01:32 PM
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I had the symptoms early in league too where I'd just freeze for indefinite amounts of time in arena or even ctf.
I think i changed predictive back to off? Something eventually helped.
But no I'm serious I can think of times when uber atziri was the hardest boss and flicker would blast to her and ez her while most builds half struggled with normal atziri. Now atziri is a joke but uber elder has a pretty select few ways to kill it.
I'm actually scared if I'm trying to level in 400s delve with any big double dmg mods and im on 17k es 20% regen from my mines and half high block values. Like always theres a few bs ways that break delve and im sure itll get some nerfs in that direction.
I can think of times when clear speed on average was faster than current, of times when sextant blocking was a thing and xp gains hadn't been nerfed and qotf had no cap...
Shaper content was easier to trivialize when it came out than uber elder stuff now.
I guess my point is that I've seen worse power creep states of the game than now, I mean how are they going to keep this thing alive without adding mods and content? So all i can say is from my experience the state of the game has always had 'power creep.' I think wayyyyy back before i picked it up in beta and the 1 point etc patches were closest to clean but that's natural. And we've both played and enjoyed the game well past that
i think the game has only gotten faster. you mention faster clears with qotf, but the gear/skills have seen so many more buffs.
as for new mods - i don't have any problem with new mods. i have a problem with higher tiers. and i have a problem with new mods being OP.
they nerfed ES only to add it back with the delve mods, for instance.
as far as both of us enjoying the game since... well, ehh. sometimes.
i skipped a bunch of leagues because i was sick of the power creep and would rather have done/played something else. but i always kept poe on my radar in case it came back around.
poe has an added benefit of other games also sucking. and the arpg genre is quite bad currently. but i don't think that excuses all the power creep.
Es is back in larger than pre nerf values in some cases thanks to delve but without vaal pact meta you can buy similar tiers for 1/4 the price so idk if thats actually power creep (it's harder to use effectively).
To one extent i agree with you. There are overly blatant ways of getting damage if you know which skill to put it with and this is definitely due to the tiers/mods/ascendancy. But this is a syndrome of an old game and knowing the patches that led to here.
The same seemingly overly powerful items might be shit on the wrong skill choice alone, even when intuitively they should scale the same way. So rather than complain about power creep I think I'd rather complain about balance issues, play-ability, and diversity knowing that mods/tiers/tree options are going to get stronger as the game adds content.
you cannot balance without addressing power creep
again, power creep makes old content obsolete and irrelevant and boring pushover. it has nothing to do with op items. malachai used to be somewhat challenging even on normal and cruel. hes a complete pushover now with white items.
the fact that BASE damage is so much higher than before is a huge reason why the power crepe is rampant.
there was a video post-ascendancy which showed an elementalist with no passive tree allocations and just 6 points into their ascendancy clearing dried lake area - something that wouldve been impossible pre-ascendancy
if your BASE damage is 10x what it used to be against the same mobs in story content, there's a problem. and it has little to do with balancing items or skills. I do agree balancing is shit though.
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Posted bygrepmanon Nov 20, 2018, 10:19:06 PM
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whats the last time you got killed by blue/yellow leapers ? goats ? evangelists ? evangelists used to be dangerous as fuck to evasion builds in 1.0
note that these mobs being dangerous has nothing to do with what items youre wearing or what skills youre using
its the fact that you delete them so fast their mechanics are utterly useless and harmless, they might as well be rocks or goo, that constitutes power creep
you couldnt delete them so fast back in the day and they actually did shit to you.
Last edited by grepman on Nov 20, 2018, 10:22:28 PM
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Posted bygrepmanon Nov 20, 2018, 10:21:54 PM
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its the fact that you delete them so fast their mechanics are utterly useless and harmless, they might as well be rocks or goo, that constitutes power creep
you couldnt delete them so fast back in the day and they actually did shit to you.
The fact that people don't really interract with most monsters ( and by most it's .... really most past some point ), is a real problem imo.
I hardly see GGG changing that though :S.
Hopefully I'm wrong.
SSF is not and will never be a standard for balance, it is not for people entitled to getting more without trading. Last edited by Fruz on Nov 21, 2018, 12:04:46 AM
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Posted byFruzon Nov 21, 2018, 12:04:24 AM
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@grepman
1.Content gets harder, char power lvl increases to balance that. Proper argument, hence dunno what you're talking about. Yeah the power lvl of chars has risen more than the difficulty of the content, but that doesn't cancel my argument + it seems to be what GGG (and most players) want, so that's that.
2.Lame? Nah, quite proper. People play PoE "a lot" now too and the population has kept growing continuously and people enjoy it, so ppl enjoying it in 2013 has nothing to do with it, because they enjoy it now too...lol.
3.It meant that the majority of the playerbase in a league for an example, consist of either newbs or intermediate players and most of those ppl won't reach the real endgame (Uelder,Uatziri,Shaper etc) anyways, so having more powercreep doesn't affect them really. It's the same for veteran players, because even if there was less powercreep, they'd easily reach endgame and clap everything in it anyway. It's similar to how the lv 95-100 xp changes (when they made it so you need more exp to lvl) don't really affect anyone cos most ppl won't even go past lower 90s and the vets will get 100 regardless. That's what i meant :)
Quit after Legion, rejoined PoE to see what the game's like now in 3.12. Last edited by Paldamus on Nov 21, 2018, 2:31:21 AM
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Posted byPaldamuson Nov 21, 2018, 2:27:53 AM
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content is getting harder? no. they are adding top-end content (and then gate it behind serious time tax). the game content is the same as 2-3 years ago
monsters in tier5 map are the same as 2 years ago. monsters in story content are the same.
what changed is we get A LOT better rares during our progression so things like 'cap lightning resists for Chambers of Sins' are not important anymore. same comes with ABSURD damage we can dish out
with some (as always - POE is about 'some') skills you can clear monsters without giving them a fighting chance as early as level 12! (ignoring Idiots Pen for a while)
no, the content is not getting harder. there are just 2 moments when i can die while leveling new character in a new league - solaris/lunaris fight because I DO NOT CARE ABOUT RESISTS AT ALL! and depending on a skill - kitava. but before i reached kitava act10 i already got showered with orbs to the point i could equip my go-to skill and items setup. without trading
power creep and content streamlining. + hefty dose of RNG to make it look like a progress while in fact it is just tossing dice hoping for that 1 roll
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Posted bysidtheraton Nov 21, 2018, 4:54:46 AM
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