Worst Death Penalty mechanics I've ever seen!

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Gannicus2491 wrote:

I remember how it went insane, when you needed too long for the boss kill act2 and the big toad started to enrage. In this times it was already a big thing to reach act3 and manage to get to the battlefields.
Or the enrage at the ubers, when you had nearly no more chance to not die, because the duo enraged. This was a time D3 was still hard to play and no chance without items from AH.

Happy that we have no AH in PoE

Explain to me the benefits of not having an Auction House in a game that relied on its playerbase to create a trading website and nearly lifted that same site to integrate into their own.
Is it because there's no ingame UI? Because we have an Auction House. It's called poe.trade.

I could try to explain or simply give you the advice to read the thread of chris wilson about the trading and why he will never wants to have an ingame in UI auction house. He explained why and also talked about the droprates or the motivation what could get lost, if the way to buy items is far easier when you not even have to leave the game for a moment to open your browser in background. It makes a huge difference for new players, when it is so easy to get all your gear from supermarket. The chance for trading is given but with the forum site or poe trade and with the player to player action.
Would you really enjoy having bad droprates to have an auction house, because if you want the one you will also get the other thing.
Please read his thread, it explains the situation. And not even 100 more threads will change this, he told so.

Please, don't discuss trading and auction house in this thread. Both trading and death penalty have one thing in common - primitive solution for a serious problem. I understand GGG's arguments in both cases, but there are many good solutions for these problems. It is quite a bit of work, but it would lower players frustration = more income from stable and bigger palyer base.

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iamstryker wrote:

This was a long time ago so my memory might not be perfect. I don't recall the enrage timer. I do remember gold being worthless and not caring about it.

Like I said, at one time the amount of gold were raised to almost absurd levels and you had to go back to lower levels to farm for it to support you going to higher levels. Dying took 10% durability off your items. And gold were never useless back then, it was used to buy items at the auction house.

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iamstryker wrote:

There is a middle ground between people who like meaningless deaths and people who like hardcore. Hardcore is extreme.

Hardcore isn't hardcore enough and softcore is extremely unforgiving; you should lose your character and all his items if you die playing hardcore and you should be able to play without losing your piece of mind playing softcore. There's no need for a middle ground, in fact, what we have right now is hardcore mini and hardcore nano - too narrow between the two.

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Vresiberba wrote:

Hardcore isn't hardcore enough and softcore is extremely unforgiving; you should lose your character and all his items if you die playing hardcore and you should be able to play without losing your piece of mind playing softcore.

I was really hoping this thread was gonna get lost in the sea of GD.

You joined Oct 2012 and have 78 Achievements completed.

I joined January 2018 and have 85 achievements completed.

Your highest level is a 91, and was likely a totem build in abyss.

My highest level is a 93 from beastiary, my first full league. I also managed an 87 or 88 in the flashback, the last month of beastiary.

You completed 22 challenges in Abyss where I managed 19, despite literally starting the game for the first time after over a month of league had passed. I would have finished a few more off but I wasn't paying attention to the forums too closely and didn't realize it was ending sooner than I expected.

I currently have 24 in Incursion versus your 13. I don't think I even had the motivation to login to just do dailies for the first few weeks after burning out on the previous flashback.

Why do I bring this up?

When I was learning the very basics and dying repeatedly, I made observations and did some light reading online to learn more about some of the game mechanics.

It didn't occur to me that I should complain on the forums that the death penalty is the worst I've ever seen.

We get it, you want to hit 100. But not really. If you did, you would have just like every other person with at least a single level 100.

Players have managed 100 in SSF hardcore.

Yet some of you feel it's too punishing to have unlimited lives.

Some players can hit 100 in less than 7 days.

Yet even months or years aren't enough for others.

Instead of posting responses to justify your stance for PoE SC needing easier leveling -
focus those efforts on improving as a player.

I'm just one newish random player who's managed to surpass your progress over years in just weeks and there are so many well beyond mine. I don't hold it against them, but I also don't put them on pedestals either.

You can blame Poe and SC being "too hard", or you could do what gamers do and just get better. SC offers the peace of mind that no matter how often your character dies, you're never at risk for it to get deleted.

Or, just simply realize you don't wish to put the effort forth required and stop pursuing a goal you see as unobtainable.

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SeCKSEgai wrote:

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Vresiberba wrote:

Hardcore isn't hardcore enough and softcore is extremely unforgiving; you should lose your character and all his items if you die playing hardcore and you should be able to play without losing your piece of mind playing softcore.

I was really hoping this thread was gonna get lost in the sea of GD.

Yeah, I bet, because this topic is unbecoming for you... "serious" gEyMeRz!!1, innit.

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Vresiberba wrote:

"

SeCKSEgai wrote:

"

Vresiberba wrote:

Hardcore isn't hardcore enough and softcore is extremely unforgiving; you should lose your character and all his items if you die playing hardcore and you should be able to play without losing your piece of mind playing softcore.

I was really hoping this thread was gonna get lost in the sea of GD.

Yeah, I bet, because this topic is unbecoming for you... "serious" gEyMeRz!!1, innit.

No at this point it's just the stubbornness and stupidity that some people show publicly on the forums - but then again there are people that argue the earth is flat as if they never learned anything in general science.

But GD isn't GD unless people are complaining - at least incursions kept most of the vocal folk content and busy grinding out their challenges.

Since people tend to discuss the title rather than the content, let me quote the OP:

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Buster1013 wrote:

First of all, I am not against death penalty. It is present in games since beginning of video games, but in PoE it doesn't make sense. Why? Because (in most cases) dying doesn't give you a lesson - if you don't know what mistake you have done, you won't learn anything and repeat mistake in the future.
For example, I finished Temple of Atzoatl many times, but I died 2 times during boss fights. Why? I have no idea. I'm playing totem build, so I have put totems and dodge attacks, but in these two cases I've died. The same problem is with some map bosses. I have just started endgame bosses, but in that cases, I knew why I've died, so it is not a problem.
I think it is mostly caused by graphic - there are too many effects, so it is difficult to see danger. In Diablo 2 boss attacks are clearly - I know which attack killed me. In PoE usually I have no idea what is going on (excluding endgame bosses). Another problem is very low zoom, so you don't see whole arena. Third problem is huge damage spikes, which usually one-shot players. It is primitive and artificial way to make game difficult.

The issue isn't really the death penalty itself, as he/she mentions explicitly, but no info/feedback about what killed you.

In my experience this is sometimes obvious, like in boss fights. Maybe the bugger hit you over the head and one-shot you or something. But often I have no idea what killed me either. It would be nice with some kind of feedback about what did it. Some kind of combat log or something. Maybe it would be horribly messy given the hordes of enemies who die to a button-click, but in cases like this it would be very useful. Was it physical? Elemental? Which type? Some on-death mechanic? Critical? Something else?

I can imagine to have a discussion about how stupid death penalty could be, when you get one shot from somewhere, you can´t even see, like two screens far away in a far distance. Then it is really not amusing to lose a lot of experience points, what took long time to get in higher levels.
But to talk about that there has to be a death penalty is not needed, as long every player understands that without it, it would be a dying through high tier maps to get fast 100.
Then the game would lose its special. It is not like in other game to reach a level and then you are ready to ....level another level, in PoE level100 is a big special, what is not for every player, who wants to get there with no effort. To reach 100 is like the cream on the top.

I just level to 9o, if it works then maybe even 91 is still to reach.
At 91 I got all my gems to 20/20 or more. Then dying doesn´t care anymore and it can make fun to run maps, you know, you will get terrible beaten maybe 6times. Don´t care anymore.

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Gannicus2491 wrote:

I can imagine to have a discussion about how stupid death penalty could be, when you get one shot from somewhere, you can´t even see, like two screens far away in a far distance. Then it is really not amusing to lose a lot of experience points, what took long time to get in higher levels.
But to talk about that there has to be a death penalty is not needed, as long every player understands that without it, it would be a dying through high tier maps to get fast 100.
Then the game would lose its special. It is not like in other game to reach a level and then you are ready to ....level another level, in PoE level100 is a big special, what is not for every player, who wants to get there with no effort. To reach 100 is like the cream on the top.

There are many better solutions than death penalty. The simplest one is "increase map difficulty and rework experience penalty". I think that leveling to 100 on white maps should be impossible. PoE should reward players for doing harder content, but currently it is better to mindlessly farm very easy maps.