With the Lycosidae nerf GGG is really saying

It is still better than nerfing items again and again.

I've never played a character that had much trouble with accuracy. Is this really such an issue?

"

Shagsbeard wrote:

I've never played a character that had much trouble with accuracy. Is this really such an issue?

it is not an issue with accuracy obtainment its an issue with numerical optimization. Simply put, the net cost of putting so many +accu affixes on already costly expensive gear tends to favor the cheaper more brute force option of lycosaid.

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Shagsbeard wrote:

I've never played a character that had much trouble with accuracy. Is this really such an issue?

no it is just a case of people being spoiled.

they want their crit builds to be powerful and cheap. forgetting that the accuracy investment is kind of an intentional downside to going crit that is supposed to exist.


people complain about the clear speed meta and builds doing too much damage .. but frankly that is because of things like lycostae

these short-cut mechanics that honestly dont have nearly enough downsides to justify what they provide.

vaal pact was another such mechanic.

but its too be expected for people to suffer withdraw

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Saltychipmunk wrote:

"

Shagsbeard wrote:

I've never played a character that had much trouble with accuracy. Is this really such an issue?

no it is just a case of people being spoiled.

they want their crit builds to be powerful and cheap. forgetting that the accuracy investment is kind of an intentional downside to going crit that is supposed to exist.

Let's see.
Crit build on the right side of the tree with minimal investments in Accuracy on gear: 95% hit chance
Crit build on the left side of the tree with minimal investments in Accuracy on gear: 82% hit chance

Yep. No problem there. People are just entitled. How dare anyone raise issues that GGG has not addressed for years even if the discrepancy has been brought up.

Lycosidae was a bandaid, I agree. But they just removed the bandaid without doing anything else. I'm sure there are people at GGG who are patting themselves on the back about how great they are at manipulating their economy though by shifting unique tiers around. Gotta get that sweet sweet player interaction.

"

Nephalim wrote:

"

Shagsbeard wrote:

I've never played a character that had much trouble with accuracy. Is this really such an issue?

it is not an issue with accuracy obtainment its an issue with numerical optimization. Simply put, the net cost of putting so many +accu affixes on already costly expensive gear tends to favor the cheaper more brute force option of lycosaid.

Pretty much.

Accuracy competes with resistances, which can already be nasty enough to get if your build uses more than one or two unique items. Both accuracy and resistances also compete with attributes, if you need more of those. Those three ALSO compete with crit stats for crit builds, because Grinding Gear hates us all and wants us to cry. And they have a thing against prefixes being good, apparently. Anyways. Suffix slots get super squeezed, and items with three really good suffixes your build needs are inevitably twenty times the price of items with two suffixes you need (and a mastercraft slot if you're fortunate. Hint: you're never fortunate).

Lycosidae removes accuracy from the equation and makes gearing your character just ever so much smoother and easier without sacrificing EO the way a Resolute Technique build does. So do Kongor's Undying Rage and Lioneye's Glare, but those are much more limited in their applications and also can't be Necromantic Aegis'd over to fix horrific minion accuracy issues. It's a quality-of-life deal absolutely, not really a build maker or build breaker, but there's a large number of builds that are a whole lot harder to make without Lycosidae.

"

Namcap wrote:

Let's see.
Crit build on the right side of the tree with minimal investments in Accuracy on gear: 95% hit chance
Crit build on the left side of the tree with minimal investments in Accuracy on gear: 82% hit chance

Yep. No problem there. People are just entitled. How dare anyone raise issues that GGG has not addressed for years even if the discrepancy has been brought up.

Lycosidae was a bandaid, I agree. But they just removed the bandaid without doing anything else. I'm sure there are people at GGG who are patting themselves on the back about how great they are at manipulating their economy though by shifting unique tiers around. Gotta get that sweet sweet player interaction.

Is this sarcasm? why? so the accuracy on the accuracy side of the tree turns out to be better than the accuracy of the non accuracy side of the tree?


isnt that just common sense? isnt that exactly what dexterity is supposed to give people as a stat?


what bandaid are you talking about? a bandaid suggests they were fixing something. there was nothing TO fix. the left side of the tree having bad accuracy is a clear intuitive trade off for having a primary stat that scales physical damage and adds life implicitly


so really what we should say is this

Crit build on the right side of the tree with minimal investments in Accuracy on gear: 95% with about 30% increased physical damage from strength and about 75 hp extra

also has shitty life nodes

vs


Crit build on the left side of the tree with minimal investments in Accuracy on gear: 82% hit chance
with about 70%+ physical damage from strength and 150 hp extra

also has excellent life nodes


all lycostae is...is power creep, pure and simple. it did not need to exist. crit builds .. on either side of the tree did not need a weapon that gives 100% accuracy for effectively free.


and on the topic of minions , no those fuckers did not need it either and frankly that shield is terrible for minion build diversity

gee fellas which do i pick , a 2 hander that gives me 15% more damage because it adds minions
(or really any minion 2 hander)

or do i take the shield that gives me an 80% more multi. i mean holy shit move aside baron .. lycostae is the most powerful attack based minion item in the game by several orders of power

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Saltychipmunk wrote:

Is this sarcasm? why? so the accuracy on the accuracy side of the tree turns out to be better than the accuracy of the non accuracy side of the tree?

isnt that just common sense? isnt that exactly what dexterity is supposed to give people as a stat?

The problem here is that life nodes are a hard requirement if you want to play anything at all. Accuracy is a necessity only for a small subset of left side builds which already aren't terribly attractive because of lower crit pool, lackluster weapon options and the clash of accuracy rolls with crit rolls on gear that can have both.

So, even if your base life pool is lower you will still take life passives because you absolutely need them, but if you're getting miserable returns per accuracy node you will either skip the whole thing with Lyco or won't play left side crit at all because, unlike getting more life, nobody's forcing you to.

but is that an actual problem? is it actually a problem that the left side of the tree actually sucks at accuracy?


the two sides of the tree arent suppose to be performing equally well at everything.

having bad accuracy is a very clear trade off for having better access to life.


and while life is more mandatory than accuracy. it doesn't change the fact that an attack build will want both.


So it is a choice , easier access of hitpoints as a trade off for bad accuracy . or have great accuracy as a trade off for truly awful access to life?

I like the rarity change personally, but my favorite part of this thread is the 48 different ways people spell this shield :D