I'm Surprised to Find that Melee is Easy
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If we're going with the hyperbolic replies approach, I'd say his gear was the best that has ever been seen in the entire world and I offer 500 ex ;)
The point stands. Melee ain't necessarily melee. Putting viper strike and static strike, and dual strike and cyclone and crit and RT under the one heading and saying 'alllllll's weeeellll' may not be the best approach to winning popularity votes. Even looking at weapons themselves and trying to compare axes and swords to daggers, maces, staves and claws raises some pretty fundamental differences. |
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so youre saying a shit melee build with shit gear is shit, and that means melee isnt easy, is that what youre trying to say?
i feel like every bit of gear posted by both players combined would cost less than 1 mirror, are we really saying this is such ridiculous gear that no real conclusion on melee can be made from it? I love all you people on the forums, we can disagree but still be friends and respect each other :) Last edited by Snorkle_uk#0761 on Mar 18, 2015, 12:40:45 AM
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" maybe they are saying it, but I'm saying something else: melee with gear that "costs 1 mirror" is a good melee. ranged with gear that "costs 1 mirror" is a fucking Horseman Of The Apocalypse. the disparity is just too much. my Main character in Standard (and overall highest level) is a Bow Ranger. so powerful. so fun to play. can do Palace Dominus, Merveil, Weaver, Double Boss Museum (6 nasty unique critters) and whatnot. accumulated gear that probably "costs" a dozen Exalts if I actually knew "economy" enough to estimate it all. my 2nd Main is melee. dual strike + cyclone. probably the best/most widely used kind of melee around at the moment in terms of gem setups used. gear that's better than the Ranger's in most slots, because he's my first PoE character with Legacy gear dating back to around March-April 2013. pretty good, but I still can get obliterated in the kind of content the Ranger now takes for granted. @GGG, no. that does not mean "nerf the fuck out of my Ranger". it means "buff melee". buff it, so I won't need the kind of gear BearCares is using, or the kind of Legacy Gear my Cycloner does, to feel powerful while playing a melee character. Alva: I'm sweating like a hog in heat Shadow: That was fun Last edited by johnKeys#6083 on Mar 18, 2015, 3:45:08 AM
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" This ^ You have to look at every build individually and only GGG really has those numbers of which is "best". " OP had a click bait title and instead of saying the above and having the next few posts ask about his gear, content he has done, and build, he could have said "My melee characters is tanky USING lightning coil, a staff with 12% block (because other 2 handers don't get that), taste of hate, and divination distillate to increase my max ele resists. I feel my character is very strong using static strike (melee skill not linked to melee splash but conc effect, another thread for a different day) and a 400dps staff. My staff even has 96% spell damage which works well with my crown of eyes." We would have all probably agreed that with that stuff his character is tanky and strong and moved on. I need a signature to look legit Last edited by Hunt8722#0984 on Mar 18, 2015, 12:07:53 PM
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This league I've played a ranger and a totems caster. For the ranger I had a 6L bow and a +1 arrows quiver. For the totems caster I had some ridiculous daggers and a six linked soul mantle. I'm just comparing apples to apples. With all the builds I played this league I had decent equipment and the melee build was the best from my experience, and I don't even have a 6 link the way I did with those other builds.
I didn't mean to 'be trolling' but when I "commit" to a build, as I alluded to in the first post, I try to make it work as best as possible. And I already knew I would need to be tanky before I even hit level 2 with this character and that is why I set out to secure lightning coil/flask combination. The same way you'd set out to secure some empower gems when you plan to commit to playing arc. (well at least I would xD) Also about the weapon. Yes, it is pretty sweet weapon. But it's also what I would consider overkill. I could deal 1/2 the damage and still clear trash mobs just as quickly. They only have so many hit points. Last edited by BearCares#6660 on Mar 18, 2015, 3:32:44 PM
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" that bold part is untrue white mobs (like small apes) might be 1KO with a 300pdps staff, but magic/map mods mobs of the 'upper echelon' (like leapers, bonestalkers etc) would definitely not be 1KO with a weapon half as good and then all the problems start to pile up - you do not kill fast enough -> more mobs remain a danger -> more hits land -> more damage taken + more distractions (stuns and/or status effects and/or pot management) -> much easier to reach that 'and now you die' threshold. for a melee weapon is of make-it-or-break-it importance. your staff is good. and you pretty much 1KO everything beside some rares that melt quickly anyway. get something more.. 'obtainable' as a weapon (and make it not a staff as staff requires pretty damn good gear to maintain accuracy worthy of going crit in the first place) and then melee is.. the crap most of the players sees it is ranged on the other hand can remain as safe as it is using 1-5c weapon this is the f.. difference people that measure builds in mirrors cannot grasp. that pretty much everything is easy once you drop that 600pdps 2h.. |
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" Completely disagree (I have experience of both styles of mirrored builds), there is very little difference between 15 ex range and 200 ex range except in 6 man parties. Whereas however, when you get into 40 ex+ range for melee you get insanely good clear speed. Not saying that that is balanced at all but I can say give me 50 ex and I can beat most TS rangers in clear speed with melee. Also you may post your melee/ranger's gear and I can give you a complete valuation on the price. Also show which legacies you are using, I can't really think of many you could use unless it's Facebreakers or BoR. IGN: Chundaziri 8/8 Ambush/Invasion Complete - 21/06/2014 8/8 Warbands/Tempest Complete - 10/08/2015 Last edited by Chundadragon#1131 on Mar 18, 2015, 6:04:54 PM
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A quick wrap-up of some of the issues people tend to raise:
- first and foremost, melee tends to get you up in the face of spells a lot more - for the close-in skills, melee splash feels pretty gimpy AoE-wise and can lead you into trouble quickly - 2handers other than staves do not have block, and don't have enough crit either to be worth investing in (Doryani's catalyst excepted), particularly on the new tree - swords have generally useless accuracy implicit mods - there is poor balance between skills. Cyclone is nuts (and seems to be what most people think of as 'melee'. Cycloning means *much* less chance of being hit, by spells as much as physical), dual strike, ground slam and certain others can be very good but are often not and can still leave you in significant danger. No one likes viper strike that I've heard of. - armour, something most melee players would think of as 'get lotz!', is counterintuitive. While most would assume you get more protected the more you have (Sherman tank versus a person wearing chain mail), you're actually better off picking a point and starting to invest in evasion/ES after that point - melee is particularly susceptible to nerfs through CWDT changes and proliferate changes, something everyone seems to want at the moment (ya plicks), presuming no magic 'fix' for armour goes in (I'm cynical personally) Whether you experience those will of course depend on your setup and the skill used. I'm not disagreeing with Snorkle or others that melee *can* be great. It's just sometimes quite poor. I would personally like to see Chunda's 50 ex challenge go down, ranged (KB or TS) vs melee... Especially if cyclone were ruled out. Edit: and the metrics of that race should include not only cost and clear speed but deaths and investment vs return i.e. % of points spent on defence versus dmg. Last edited by davidnn5#4453 on Mar 18, 2015, 6:19:53 PM
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" It should be a hardcore race tbh. |
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Wasn't thinking of Cyclone actually, in terms of clear speed I would build like this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j-MoQ5lRsco Obviously though I'm not winning any prizes for tankiness unless I'm going further down the rabbit hole in terms of currency but see -> The gap between mirrored and 10 ex range is smaller than it's ever been for a long time, I hope the gap between mirrored melee (which is genuinely quite good) and cheap (dogshit) melee similarly decreases. IGN: Chundaziri 8/8 Ambush/Invasion Complete - 21/06/2014 8/8 Warbands/Tempest Complete - 10/08/2015 Last edited by Chundadragon#1131 on Mar 18, 2015, 6:35:34 PM
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