The next thing that needs to be redesigned for the sake of balance

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bhavv wrote:

I've never been able to survive touch of god. I have no idea how to avoid it.

You look for a raised fist. The fist raise comes before the words.

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Boem wrote:

Depends on the reliability of your prediction model.

It moves away from good design if that prediction model fails since it instills
bad-player-experiences.

The intention is solid, the execution not so much.

Then needs more work on the execution. I'm not a big fan of muddying up intention just to settle for a weak but "friendly" execution.

Immortal call + 90+- lightning resist.

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DeviantLightning wrote:

Except going over the cap isn't nearly that trivial. Going over the cap has opportunity cost. Only three uniques directly raise your resist cap and they come with hefty drawbacks. Purity auras obviously compete with other auras and requires further itemization and speccing. Flasks obviously take up slot.

Really? REALLY?

Ok, i admit, going above cap isnt so easy. But you still CAN do it.
There are auras giving maximum resists to all elements. With aura passives those contribute pretty much to res cap.
There are passives, that give you maximum resists.
There are potions, that give maximum resists. With specific nodes, they give even more.
And at last, there are items, that give maximum resists (like Saffel's Frame).

Separately, each of those are relatively OK. But added together (auras+passives+items+flasks), they allow player to have 100% resists to all elements. Yes, this requires certain efforts, but the benefit (invulnerability) is clearly worth that. Furthermore, it's OP and imbalanced as hell.

If you add Immortal Call and Chaos Inoculation there, you can even build a char, that is COMPLETELY INVINCIBLE. Just try it, it will probably be quite a fun.

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Then needs more work on the execution. I'm not a big fan of muddying up intention just to settle for a weak but "friendly" execution.

There is nothing that prevents them from developing fights within the current prediction model limit's and alter them when the model becomes better equipped to handle original intended mechanics.

One-hit ko's, given the current model are poor design and give bad-player-experiences, this becomes worse when experienced in a hardcore-setting.

There is nothing wrong with power-full attacks imo's, but overkill in an unreliable system is wrong.

Simply put, an error that is not a player error should have the ability to be forgiving.

In the current state this is not the case, i think because of the lack of difficulty.(also because of the poor prediction model)

Peace,

-Boem-

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deviantlight wrote:

Except going over the cap isn't nearly that trivial. Going over the cap has opportunity cost. Only three uniques directly raise your resist cap and they come with hefty drawbacks. Purity auras obviously compete with other auras and requires further itemization and speccing. Flasks obviously take up slot.

This is actually wrong, the higher the value's become, the less investment is required to beat the content.(because of increased hp% nodes potential)

For example i have a build with 170%hp increase that runs 78 maps with 120% difficulty (triple damage mod modifiers for example) without any danger. It has 4300hp which is considered low and piety for example deals roughly 300dps per hit. . .

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Boem wrote:

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Then needs more work on the execution. I'm not a big fan of muddying up intention just to settle for a weak but "friendly" execution.

There is nothing that prevents them from developing fights within the current prediction model limit's and alter them when the model becomes better equipped to handle original intended mechanics.

That's kind of like saying there's nothing stopping me from getting my bachelor's degree. There isn't, and I'm doing it, but it's fucking work. Changing the fights "for desync" now means, on top of the work of fixing desync itself, you'd need to also work to change things "for desync" before fixing desync, then change them back (to the way they originally fucking were) after fixing desync. It is compounding effort, for something which may be unnecessary if the desync issue can be resolved in the near future.

What normally happens when games do as you suggest is: because the flaw being worked around was so much effort to fix (if it wasn't, they wouldn't need to redesign the game around the flaw), they burn out after the redesign around the flaw, and never get around to fixing the core flaw in the first place. Why go to all the extra work to get things fixed in the idealistic sense, when you've just completed the work to get things fixed in the weak, pragmatic sense?

Perhaps more importantly: desync — and the performance issues players associate with desync, when they're not actually desync — is/are highly variable. Some systems are hit much harder than others, sometimes due to the system's particular hardware, sometimes due to internet connection... there's a huge host of very different causes and factors. You can't really design around desync even if you wanted to, because it's different from computer to computer. All you can design around are particular, arbitrary desync thresholds. None of these are official, it's just trying to guess "well, assuming the average amount of desync is x" or "assuming 90% of desync is at y or less" and then designing around that. It would be pure guesswork. You still wouldn't get everybody, and there would be a lot of players who have virtually no desync issues currently who would get very weak game design as a result.

Me personally, I get desync of moderate severity — that is, to the point I actually notice it — maybe once every four or five hours of play time. When it does happen, it's a huge pain; I still remember my Nemesis character's death to map Brutus who suddenly teleported to my location a few seconds before my death (strange, because I didn't teleport to his), a death actually at the hands of a random skeleton as I was trying to escape on less than 10% life. The impact was devastating, and the desync involvement definitely left a bitter taste. However, I can literally play for hours with no desync whatsoever. Should the 95% of my playtime be balanced around something which accounts for less than 5% of my experience?

In conclusion, fuck your idea, and it's a derail anyway.

Something as easy as removing the ToG attack after a blink from dominus would fix a lot of
bad-player-experiences. Without removing the mechanic from the battle.

Thus not actually devaluation the experience/mechanic, while making it less punishing on the model they utilize.

I agree it's a derail do.

Peace,

-Boem-

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MortalKombat3 wrote:

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DeviantLightning wrote:

Except going over the cap isn't nearly that trivial. Going over the cap has opportunity cost. Only three uniques directly raise your resist cap and they come with hefty drawbacks. Purity auras obviously compete with other auras and requires further itemization and speccing. Flasks obviously take up slot.

Really? REALLY?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WUJFuRoWyWc

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Separately, each of those are relatively OK. But added together (auras+passives+items+flasks), they allow player to have 100% resists to all elements. Yes, this requires certain efforts, but the benefit (invulnerability) is clearly worth that. Furthermore, it's OP and imbalanced as hell.

If you add Immortal Call and Chaos Inoculation there, you can even build a char, that is COMPLETELY INVINCIBLE. Just try it, it will probably be quite a fun.

You're a CI build with power uniques who went down to Marauder, and gave up a shield he could've used for more ES. If you hadn't noticed that's a huge points and gearing sink. It's incredibly substantial. (On top of the Dream Fragments or Auxium and an Eye of Chaluya you're already wearing.)

I deleted my explanation of why Saffell's has severe trade offs but thought this was evident to anybody who actually looked at it. It has no armor, ES or resists to speak of. It has no life. It has spellblock which is only good if you spec block nodes (which are expensive and spread out) and are willing to give up physical block.

So for most intents and purposes it's a wooden board that won't block anything and won't give you any other stats.

If you're sinking your helmet slot for Geofri's/Alpha's then yes, it's conceivably quite easy to run three Purity auras with Discipline and cap them at level 23. But again, still no ES. And you then just implied to me you spent more points for aura economy and buffs.

You also forget to mention, that this build has vulnerabilities to physical that you're just patching over with granites and Immortal Call. And I sure wouldn't use CWDT to kick off the latter.

Flasks are temporary and a build optimized for max resist is hardly the only build that can use them.

Ya, nerf everything to squat so that the game content cannot be fully done by fairly avid players right? Balance is BS

The big pro point of the current resist sytem is, that its intuitivly to understand, however, I agree, a formular like you suggested is a lot better in terms of balance.

I didnt like that you mentioned Diablo 3, as the mechanic of damage reduction is pretty stupid, as armor AND resist are basically the same and are HIGHLY INFLATED. I guess 80+% reduction is realistic, so basically characters in D3 take only 1/25 damage by "default".

However, the League Of Legends system is perfect, as its scaling and its "readability" is done in a more proper way.

For instance: If you have 1000 HP and 100 Armor, your EHP are 2000. If you have 200 Armor, your EHP are 3000 and so on.(each point of armor/magic resist is like +1% EHP)


Shall resists be uncapped in the new version?: Of course, as its scales linearly.

If a resist mechanic like LoL was implemented, getting more and more resistances is not problematic, because of "diminishing returns".

Increasing Armor from 0->100 gives more "relative EHPincrease" than 100->200 Armor, so even if you stack ridiculous amounts of Armor, it has the same "scaling behaviour" like stacking HP.

Coming from Diablo 2, the current resist system feels cool, and it is, because you also might feel powerful "abusing" it, but actually in terms of balance, its a distaster.


I am for implementeing a linear scaling, easy to read/understand resist system, which can also be made counterable by introducing resist penetration to give flavour to certain enemies.

I think we people should be ready to be open for a new resist system and not stick to the 75% stuff, just because we are used to it.

The 75% system has those disadvantages:

-non linear scaling, it becomes better, the more you get(for no reason?)
-inconsistant itemization. You got 30%+40%+25% resist? Nice, you wasted stats! Feels, good, right?
-imbalance of overcapping and therefore weird lategame balance (if one enemy skill does 180% damage of you HP, while you have 75% resist, than there is clearly something wrong)

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ExiledRenor wrote:

stuff

Just for reference, D3's damage reduction mechanic is also linear in armor and in resist. It does feel a bit silly (redundant, unnecessarily complicated) to have two mechanics that are basically the same, though.