[3.5] Occultist Vortex/Cold Snap ES/CI - Deathless and Safe Uber Elder and T16's

Said I wouldn't reply in here anymore but here I am again, some quick notes on the new gems.

Malevolence: 50% reservation kills it for me. I agree with Monti_Jones and it's not giving me enough to be able to justify the cost. My lvl100 betrayal tanky setup from p97 would go from 664k -> 726k shaper dps on vortex. The aoe is whatever. Pretty bad in my opinion.
Zealotry: I'd probably chose this over Malevolence actually, if anything. 5% less damage compared than Malevolence but you gain consecrated ground vs bosses. Question is if it drops the ground on the target or yourself. I'm still skipping it, 50% reservation kills it for me here too.

Just to explain my reasoning on Malevolence a bit more:
Despair functions as a more multiplier just like Malevolence does since it says "enemies takes increased dmg from dot effects" which means: my dmg happens -> that dmg gets multiplied = it's an More modifier in a roundabout way.
Despair would give us 35% more (20/20) which turns into 40,25% with our increased curse effectiveness from tree. Against Shaper that becomes ~13.7% more after penalties is accounted for.
Despair would only reserve 35% however. We then get these numbers:
Malevolence gives us 0.4%moredmg/reservation.
Despair gives us ~0.39%moredmg/reservation (vs shaper) but tons more against normal bosses and mobs since they don't have the same curse reduction.

Most of us already decided against despair in previous league so why would we want something that costs us even more to fit into our build this league? If anything you'd swap one curse for despair instead and call it a day. Lowlife variants probably love these gems however.

(did I miss something in my thought process here? super tired atm)

TL:DR Malevolence costs too much, despair probably better, would not recommend. Nothing changed.

Since this tree will only give us 2.6% crit chance. Would you say that EO is not worth it anymore?

The 5-95 to 0-100 crit chance range effectively make EO 1/3rd of effectiveness right? (7.6% -> 2.6%)

Or is that not how EO works?

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BoiledGrape wrote:

Since this tree will only give us 2.6% crit chance. Would you say that EO is not worth it anymore?

The 5-95 to 0-100 crit chance range effectively make EO 1/3rd of effectiveness right? (7.6% -> 2.6%)

Or is that not how EO works?

we proc eo+ee with sb/oos in our weapon. nothing changed.

edit: they function just as prepatch. we dont link CD to them. weapon doesn't have crit chance on it.

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Lysithea wrote:

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BoiledGrape wrote:

Since this tree will only give us 2.6% crit chance. Would you say that EO is not worth it anymore?

The 5-95 to 0-100 crit chance range effectively make EO 1/3rd of effectiveness right? (7.6% -> 2.6%)

Or is that not how EO works?

we proc eo+ee with sb/oos in our weapon. nothing changed.

sb/oos still has 5% basecrit?

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Lysithea wrote:

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BoiledGrape wrote:

Since this tree will only give us 2.6% crit chance. Would you say that EO is not worth it anymore?

The 5-95 to 0-100 crit chance range effectively make EO 1/3rd of effectiveness right? (7.6% -> 2.6%)

Or is that not how EO works?

we proc eo+ee with sb/oos in our weapon. nothing changed.

Ah of course, and those skills will have the weapon crit chance added to them right?

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Monti_Jones wrote:

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Opticazian wrote:

Im wondering due to mana reserve number,

Malevolence being a multiplicative mod number, is it going to out perform Aspect of Spider?

Mana reserve rate is gonna be high. May just have to Drop 1 curse out of the double curse setup.

Im thinking, Manev + Disp + Temp Chains (With Impresence). A few mana reserve reduction nodes.

Fitting in Malevolence seems to be tough and possibly not worth it. Damage numbers are still fine after all even without it.

From my knowledge, to run Malevolence you would need to:
- drop blasphemy curses and drop aspect all together
- if you want to keep a blasphemy curse, have a reduced reservation amulet of choice
- if you want to keep aspect, get Sovereignty nodes
- if you want to keep double course, use curse on hit or Bane

Either way you end up using up more sockets than you already are and we are already kinda starved on sockets. It would be nice if someone finds a way to fit in Malevolence but for me personally the costs seem too high.

Ahh, I havnt run numbers in POB honestly. But that stinks....
It does look like a nice idea, but mabey it wont be the best idea.

Oh and it was so early. I didnt mean Impresence, i mean solstice vigil hehe

I only ran around with this build the last week of Betrayl for fun. with really crappy gear, it was very fun to play. Its going to be my league starter this time around. Hoping with all the new ES gems / nodes, the ES gear dosnt spike to high heaven on trying to get some semi decent peices. Even the delve fossils are gonna get nutty to buy =p

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Monti_Jones wrote:

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Opticazian wrote:

Im wondering due to mana reserve number,

Malevolence being a multiplicative mod number, is it going to out perform Aspect of Spider?

Mana reserve rate is gonna be high. May just have to Drop 1 curse out of the double curse setup.

Im thinking, Manev + Disp + Temp Chains (With Impresence). A few mana reserve reduction nodes.

Fitting in Malevolence seems to be tough and possibly not worth it. Damage numbers are still fine after all even without it.

From my knowledge, to run Malevolence you would need to:
- drop blasphemy curses and drop aspect all together
- if you want to keep a blasphemy curse, have a reduced reservation amulet of choice
- if you want to keep aspect, get Sovereignty nodes
- if you want to keep double course, use curse on hit or Bane

Either way you end up using up more sockets than you already are and we are already kinda starved on sockets. It would be nice if someone finds a way to fit in Malevolence but for me personally the costs seem too high.

While you are correct about the requirements, Solstice Vigil is a great fit for the build and takes care of the reservation for one defensive curse, which I found to be more than enough during the last league.
Beyond that, taking Sovereignty (and the reservation node below CI) does not cost you more points than taking the extra curse node would (as you no longer need the int node just below it), and actually frees up a socket for you since you don't need Enlighten Support anymore.

Overall I think it's mostly a question of whether you prefer the extra safety and versatility of the additional curse, or the extra damage output / area of effect of Malevolence.

Edit: As a note about using Despair instead of Malevolence, while it's a valid option, the aura doesn't require you to be close to whatever you are damaging, and provides AoE and duration instead of just damage. There's also the question of what sort of Watcher's Eye modifiers it will have, and how costly they will be.

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Ragnarok37 wrote:

Edit: As a note about using Despair instead of Malevolence, while it's a valid option, the aura doesn't require you to be close to whatever you are damaging, and provides AoE and duration instead of just damage. There's also the question of what sort of Watcher's Eye modifiers it will have, and how costly they will be.

Very true, I glanced over those effects since I deemed them to be a nonfactor overall. Watchers eye modifiers could very well be the true X-factor. If the mods are bad for us however, I think I'd stick with betrayals setup. That's assuming there isn't some new crazy unique or other synthesize mods that shake things up.

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joyjoy88 wrote:

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Bowberry wrote:

managed to craft my sceptre(finally), I'm thinking the +X% cold damage over time multiplier slightly beats the X% minion increased damage with X% damage full life mods?

How exactly did you create this DoT version? Which crafting procedure?

w/ the opal sceptre base you would transmute > alt spam > t1/t2 +X% Cold damage over time multiplier(prefix) > regal > annul/prefix lock whatever to isolate > multimod it
or w/ fossil crafting: opal sceptre base > bound, pristine, corroded(optional) > X% minion damage w/ X%damage on full life > annul/bestiary split(tooexpensive) to isolate > multimod it

Painful process but once you finish either way it'll be very nice as it does add a good chunk of damage. Could buy one but they are really expensive!?! atm

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Bowberry wrote:

Painful process but once you finish either way it'll be very nice as it does add a good chunk of damage. Could buy one but they are really expensive!?! atm

Thx, I know that fossil one into minion dmg/full life dmg, used it myself, but for that DoT/cold dmg one, is there also fossil craft (like Aetheric+Frigid) or the classic alt/regal/multimod is best and easiest way of creating this beauty?