Gear progression in PoE is like D3 with AH

"

鬼殺し wrote:

If you lot are REALLY LUCKY, the built-in marketplace in the domestic PoE will trickle down to the international version and you won't have to rely (quite so much) on an ad hoc player-made half-measure again.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OXZVofRPhyo -- tell me you wouldn't kill for something like this in game. It seems inadequate for more specific gear-hunting due to lack of search function, but it's great for map/currency/essence trading.

Until then, have fun with either banging your heads against the vastly inferior-to-a-real-marketplace poe.trade setup, or playing solo-self-gimp.

It was cool and awesome to shit on auction houses and market places in ARPGs in 2012 because D3 had one and PoE didn't -- but that was when there was promise of something better for PoE: forum-based offline trading. That. Didn't. Happen. And I reckon it never will. Because it's a massive step back from what players made for themselves in what is now known as Poe.Trade.

As far as I'm concerned, once Poe.Trade was a thing and GGG had to not only recognise it but openly support it, create an official backup of it,and expect people to use it (and balance around that expectation, no doubt), the old 'PoE will never have a marketplace because Diablo 3 did and it was baaaad' argument was dead in the fuckin' water.

And players not only killed that argument, they saved GGG a great deal of effort by 'improving' the trade situation for themselves...and then somehow accepted what is essentially a half-baked marketplace as 'superior' to a real one. And the community got to keep their original moral high ground: we don't have a marketplace/auction house like that dirty Diablo 3...yeah, sure you don't. You just keep telling yourselves that.

Once you get over the stigma and the kneejerk reaction, you'll see that PoE already has a form of marketplace in operation with largely automated functionality...so why not upgrade to a proper, official in-game one?

I would say 'give in to the dark side' but if you use Poe.Trade, you already have. It's just a matter of admitting it and realising it's not so bad. And that it could be so much better. If anything, it's more like turning away from the dark side and embracing the light -- an in-game marketplace is orderly, organised, much harder to scam, doesn't pull people away from what they're doing, 'afk' not an issue, removes the temptation to haggle (which is just not an option on a game where people speak so many different languages)...and basically just makes everything more convenient.

Less time fiddling with shitty third party trade shortcomings=more time actually playing.

"

鬼殺し wrote:

If you lot are REALLY LUCKY, the built-in marketplace in the domestic PoE will trickle down to the international version and you won't have to rely (quite so much) on an ad hoc player-made half-measure again.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OXZVofRPhyo -- tell me you wouldn't kill for something like this in game. It seems inadequate for more specific gear-hunting due to lack of search function, but it's great for map/currency/essence trading.

Until then, have fun with either banging your heads against the vastly inferior-to-a-real-marketplace poe.trade setup, or playing solo-self-gimp.

It was cool and awesome to shit on auction houses and market places in ARPGs in 2012 because D3 had one and PoE didn't -- but that was when there was promise of something better for PoE: forum-based offline trading. That. Didn't. Happen. And I reckon it never will. Because it's a massive step back from what players made for themselves in what is now known as Poe.Trade.

As far as I'm concerned, once Poe.Trade was a thing and GGG had to not only recognise it but openly support it, create an official backup of it,and expect people to use it (and balance around that expectation, no doubt), the old 'PoE will never have a marketplace because Diablo 3 did and it was baaaad' argument was dead in the fuckin' water.

And players not only killed that argument, they saved GGG a great deal of effort by 'improving' the trade situation for themselves...and then somehow accepted what is essentially a half-baked marketplace as 'superior' to a real one. And the community got to keep their original moral high ground: we don't have a marketplace/auction house like that dirty Diablo 3...yeah, sure you don't. You just keep telling yourselves that.

Once you get over the stigma and the kneejerk reaction, you'll see that PoE already has a form of marketplace in operation with largely automated functionality...so why not upgrade to a proper, official in-game one?

I would say 'give in to the dark side' but if you use Poe.Trade, you already have. It's just a matter of admitting it and realising it's not so bad. And that it could be so much better. If anything, it's more like turning away from the dark side and embracing the light -- an in-game marketplace is orderly, organised, much harder to scam, doesn't pull people away from what they're doing, 'afk' not an issue, removes the temptation to haggle (which is just not an option on a game where people speak so many different languages)...and basically just makes everything more convenient.

Less time fiddling with shitty third party trade shortcomings=more time actually playing.

"

Icoblablubb wrote:

i was always against an AH in PoE but as time goes by im slowly turning pro AH side .. PoE has rmters botters yada yada like every other arpg where u can make profit with any kind fo currency .. the so called social aspect that PoE trading right now provides lol well there is none copy/paste t4t wow such social interactions .. i don't see the negative of an AH anymore since its not that different then current trading besides less frustrating dealing with shitty api even GGG's poetrade copy is garbage.

all these current nay sayers give me a solid reason why an AH is bad for the game ? both deliver no social interactions , AH is faster no frustration with afk/character offline dudes flippers still can flip if they wan't to so where are the negatives

"

Aixius wrote:

"

Icoblablubb wrote:

i was always against an AH in PoE but as time goes by im slowly turning pro AH side .. PoE has rmters botters yada yada like every other arpg where u can make profit with any kind fo currency .. the so called social aspect that PoE trading right now provides lol well there is none copy/paste t4t wow such social interactions .. i don't see the negative of an AH anymore since its not that different then current trading besides less frustrating dealing with shitty api even GGG's poetrade copy is garbage.

all these current nay sayers give me a solid reason why an AH is bad for the game ? both deliver no social interactions , AH is faster no frustration with afk/character offline dudes flippers still can flip if they wan't to so where are the negatives

Because those botters and rmters will bot the AH, buying up everything they want to control with scripts and unlimited wealth. People complain about flippers and market manipulation now, it will be 10,000 times worse with an AH unless there is very aggressive and proactive monitoring/banning (i.e. significant work for GGG).

"

As for a solution, SSF is a goldmine waiting to be balanced; buff the droprates in SSF and you'll see a ton of new PoE players who want to play it but can't be fucked sitting in their hideout for hours to experience the "real game". I say this because when my friends open a stream to see what PoE is about, this is what they see 90% of the time (the other 10% being HH Burial Chambers farming, of course).

"

Grendahl wrote:

"

As for a solution, SSF is a goldmine waiting to be balanced; buff the droprates in SSF and you'll see a ton of new PoE players who want to play it but can't be fucked sitting in their hideout for hours to experience the "real game". I say this because when my friends open a stream to see what PoE is about, this is what they see 90% of the time (the other 10% being HH Burial Chambers farming, of course).

This is what we all expected when SSF went live. I would rather have the chance to see the gear I want drop for me than farm chaos to pay someone else for gear they don't want.

Which is more rewarding? Automated AH and farming for chaos orbs to buy the shinies? or the gear you want/need dropping within a reasonable amount of time of you needing it?

I get that some items will still take dozens or even hundreds of hours, but I'd still rather this see items I want drop for me, because that feels more rewarding and less like real life (where I grind, make money, and pay someone else for shit they don't need.)

"

FrodoFraggins wrote:

"

鬼殺し wrote:

If you lot are REALLY LUCKY, the built-in marketplace in the domestic PoE will trickle down to the international version and you won't have to rely (quite so much) on an ad hoc player-made half-measure again.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OXZVofRPhyo -- tell me you wouldn't kill for something like this in game. It seems inadequate for more specific gear-hunting due to lack of search function, but it's great for map/currency/essence trading.

Until then, have fun with either banging your heads against the vastly inferior-to-a-real-marketplace poe.trade setup, or playing solo-self-gimp.

It was cool and awesome to shit on auction houses and market places in ARPGs in 2012 because D3 had one and PoE didn't -- but that was when there was promise of something better for PoE: forum-based offline trading. That. Didn't. Happen. And I reckon it never will. Because it's a massive step back from what players made for themselves in what is now known as Poe.Trade.

As far as I'm concerned, once Poe.Trade was a thing and GGG had to not only recognise it but openly support it, create an official backup of it,and expect people to use it (and balance around that expectation, no doubt), the old 'PoE will never have a marketplace because Diablo 3 did and it was baaaad' argument was dead in the fuckin' water.

And players not only killed that argument, they saved GGG a great deal of effort by 'improving' the trade situation for themselves...and then somehow accepted what is essentially a half-baked marketplace as 'superior' to a real one. And the community got to keep their original moral high ground: we don't have a marketplace/auction house like that dirty Diablo 3...yeah, sure you don't. You just keep telling yourselves that.

Once you get over the stigma and the kneejerk reaction, you'll see that PoE already has a form of marketplace in operation with largely automated functionality...so why not upgrade to a proper, official in-game one?

I would say 'give in to the dark side' but if you use Poe.Trade, you already have. It's just a matter of admitting it and realising it's not so bad. And that it could be so much better. If anything, it's more like turning away from the dark side and embracing the light -- an in-game marketplace is orderly, organised, much harder to scam, doesn't pull people away from what they're doing, 'afk' not an issue, removes the temptation to haggle (which is just not an option on a game where people speak so many different languages)...and basically just makes everything more convenient.

Less time fiddling with shitty third party trade shortcomings=more time actually playing.

I'm not sure why you are suggesting this. They have been adament that their philosophy is that it should on of the following:

1) It's easy to find what you want but harder to make the trade
2) It's hard to find what you want but easy to make the trade

They will not and should not make it easy to find and trade

"

鬼殺し wrote:

See, more D3 RMAH/AH baggage blinding people to where things really are, here and now, with PoE.

I completely agree that the reliance on an AH killed what little D3 interest I had. Knowing that whatever I found, I'd be better off selling it and using that gold to buy something far superior.

But honestly...is PoE really that far from that now? It's a result of a massive playerbase all engaging with a market, bringing their little contributions to the overall whole. And TencentGGG have to be aware of that and have to balancing the game around it.

Those who engage in PoE's trade setup now but argue that PoE shouldn't have a built-in AH/marketplace because D3 had one and look how that went are cutting off the nose to spite the face. And, I think, living in denial. Just a little bit.

As for the drop rate correlation? It's already proven to be low enough to justify marketplace-like behaviour, because players went and made one. It's not a very good one, but it's there.

A fair point regarding the need to make items even rarer in the event of a fully automated marketplace -- but so what? SSF is a bad joke anyway.