Why is the right side of the tree so devoid of life?

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Tortunga wrote:

I think you and me got a different definition of being tanky. I play hc exclusively, and so for me being tanky is all about mitigation. Avoidance is nice if you can get it besides mitigation, but never instead of, as it's unreliable.

In this case life + regen stacking is the best defence by far. Armour + endurance charges only works against physical hit damage, and for larger hits you need a lots of armour to make a dent (To half the hit you need 10x as much armour). Evasion/dodge/block are all unreliable.

tanky is tanky where ever you play. If you actually read what Ive written previously its that pure avoidance is shit and you always mix it with mitigation, thats a form of hybrid. If we have a different definition of tanky it could be because you may have never played a build that would even count as tanky by the standards Im holding builds to.

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Tortunga wrote:

And come on, streamers play the game 8+ hours a day pretty much every day.

and I dont? Ive spent 8 hours a day pretty much every day for the last 5 years playing around with combos of defences and running them in high maps, other people like mathil have been spending the same hours playing around with damage mechanics in high maps, other people have been spending that time looking for speed xp meta builds to race for lvl100 with. Youll never see me in a speed levelling thread or an epeen dps thread trying to teach experts in those areas how to suck eggs.

Look at someone like Havoc, last time I tuned into his stream and saw him playing a tanky build was a max block/spell block cyclone marauder in invasion. Nothing but speed farmer virtually glass cannon builds since, spectres, vaal spark, go go go faster builds. you think these ppl are trying to be as tanky as possible? Half the time hes in a tabula.

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If hybrid defences or defences besides getting as much life/ES where good, they would know it.

I think youll find quite a few streamers do know about it. Ive heard nugi talk on occasion about how good es and evasion are together, Ive seen him trying to squeeze grace aura into low life builds because he knows hybrid defence like that is rly strong.

The sort of people who push ladder on hc though are mostly not streamers, and most of the people pushing are playing racing specs, theyre not trying to make some ultra tanky character, theyre playing speed xp builds. If simply getting enough lifepool is enough for them to be tanky enough to gamble at hitting lvl100 with it then they will just bank on a static drop like a belly thats always gonna be on the market, gives them lifepool, run with it. Theyre not going to race ladder day 1 of a league with a build idea that involves a triple t1 vaal regalia, a lvl4 enlighten, an uber atziri drop vertex, high rolled supreme spiked shield etc thats gonna cost a fk load of cash, even if the resulting build they can get with those items literally has 4x the ehp of what theyre actually gonna play. Do they need to be more tanky? Hopefully not. will it make them get to 100 faster? No. Thats why they dont even care to look into such things.

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zzang wrote:

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Snorkle_uk wrote:

convince you of what? what is it you think im trying to convince you of?

Oh right i forgot you trying to have an "honest" and open "discussion" about your opinion. Nevermind dude it never was worth the time. Yeah armour and evasion works if u dont have a lightning coil/ other means of static defenses and block to replace those outdated crap mechanics.

I dont even know what ur talking about at this point zzang, and thats probably because ur not rly getting what im talking about.

the point was made that mixing defences as a hybrid was the worst way to play defensively, I just made the case that it was probably the best way to make defences. Admittedly you brought up low life guardian es stacking, and yes I will concede that I should have mentioned that as the exception as for sure thats an ultra powerful defence method with high regen, fair play.

do you think going pure armour or pure evasion is a good idea? I dont think you do, I feel like you think theyre shit just like I do, I think you also believe that evasion with a coil or armour with block shits all over the 2 core defences alone. So im not rly sure why youre trying so hard to disagree with me.

I'm done with you. YOu clearly think you solved the mystery of defences on your own, and that every other player in the world has it wrong.

The only thing I can see is that you set extremely high bars to start with for a build to even be considered tanky. Minimum of 7k life, legacy kaoms, lightning coil, etc. Otherwise defences don't work.

If they don't work on their own or just combined (and not getting 50k of each like you prob do), without the need to get 7k life as well (which is 220% life for any non Kaoms/Belly build), then defences are not working. Period.

I'm pretty sure you put almost every point you got in defences and are using mirror like gear, just to make defences seem viable.

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Tortunga wrote:

I'm done with you. YOu clearly think you solved the mystery of defences on your own, and that every other player in the world has it wrong.

no thats clearly not what I said and clearly not the case.

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Tortunga wrote:

I'm pretty sure you put almost every point you got in defences and are using mirror like gear, just to make defences seem viable.

again thats so far from being true.


minimum 7k life, legacy kaoms... ok, I do actually have a legacy kaoms, I have 1 build that uses it, it has 11,400 life. Its not as tanky as a fair few 7k life builds I have. Youll have to take my word for it as ull probably never play either of those things.

Whatever mate, well done putting ur profile to private to avoid showing off youve got 1 character over level 80, presumably getting to lvl88 with that guy is enough to presume you know better than I do how these things work and completely disagree with me about a whole host of things you have 0 experience actually playing while I have 10,000 hours experience playing them. Of course you know better and I must be wrong.

Stop being so full of yourself... You really think that out of the million of million of players, nobody would came to the same conclusion as you did, if defences where alright? Look at the hundreds of posts over the years all saying the same thing; Defences suck. But no they are all wrong...

And sorry that not everyone has time to play 8 hours a day for 5 days straight. Really get a fucking life, thats even in gaming standards patchetic...

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Yeah 4k-5k hp I suppose but I do have 99999999999999k dps I find that really really dumb the fuck is the point of other defenses if their so fucking bad is my issue with it.

Higher EHP is good how do you think my slayer lives?

8k EHP with VP it's only defense is it's damage and it's leech that's it. It doesn't have armor; It doeesn't have EV rather barely any EV basically.

My wander is dodge + evasion and you know how it is for RNG it isn't going to fly some dumb shit hits you and 3/4 of your hp gone so if your layer of defense is completely RNG that's not going to work at all. Your core defense in my case is... just HP and it's mindless 90000 billion DPS.

That really doesn't make sense I mean I guess the whole the best defense is the best offense.

The funny thing is, it would actually make sense in a game that isn't balanced around oneshots.

Imagine a world where a) it takes more than 2-3 hits from monsters to kill an evasion build and b) leech rate is actually hard to cap out, at least for left side/RT builds. In that world, evasion is a useful primary defense because you have time to regain life between hits, and what the right side loses in life regen, it gains in leech rate from the higher DPS. It makes perfect sense.

I'll leave it to the reader to count how many ways PoE manages to fuck up that very simple system.

This is still needed.

Peeve of mine for years. They need to add more.

I'm not letting this go lol

this stuff really need a rework in general.

Like life, ES and a few defenses

Because balance, now let go.