Aura Change Feedback and Suggestion

^ not to mention they consume mana which you have to address with faster regen to spam a mob down before OOM or lose major EHP as a MoM user. Nothing "free" about aura. Ask any CI caster how free they are while he's chasing T1 mana and regen on every slot.

So let me get this straight.

6 pages of thread here, 24 on my thread, and god knows how many elsewhere... and only ScrotieMcB, who has mostly been actually DEFENDING GGG as of late, is the one who understands that the correct solution is to have multiple support gems for auras that contend for a socket, with re-adjusted numbers so that reduced mana reservation is not absolutely required anymore and people can choose if they need it or not for their build, while paying an opportunity cost to get it?

If that's the case, then the beta feedback must be 100% full of shit, and there is absolutely ZERO chance that we will see a good implementation in the core game, since the GGG "balance team" monkeys will take even longer than the average forum poster to figure out what they should be doing. Especially since they have been giving us bullcrap about "reducing socket pressure" and "needing more accessibility" which they won't be able to take back now.

Nah, let's not worry, I'm sure their insane experience from having "played the game to high maps" will shine through... God, it's so stupid it's not even funny.

This nerf is especially devastating when you consider Inner Forces gone. Not sure why no one isnt talking about this 1 2 punch. 21% aura nerf is huge. That right there alone broke some of my builds like 100% flasked resits ones (-1 on that). Then when you consider I wont even be able to run all DEFENSIVE aura as before either its just devastating. Guess I already know what build I'm playing tho now i'm in a box. LL shavs who can still run massive aura. Seems most powerful build was least effected based on number of reduced mana nodes they take in the first place.

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TheAnuhart wrote:

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CanHasPants wrote:

Free cheap auras is a bad idea, plain and simple. Anybody who has been here 2+ years should understand why.

You are just trolling goetz because you think that's all he does to others. Let it go, man; I'd have expected better of you if I hadn't just read several posts of it. It's childish and toxic.

Free? I guess that's where I differ to most, I look at investment differently.

Having % auras reserve less as they level requires investment of time, you need to level your character, you get access to more auras, or as it were, less reserved as you and the gems level. Gem level is tied to character level. Not high enough level? Can't use higher gems.

Goetz' suggestion is that at lvl 24(?) investing GCPs (or whatever currency, however obtained, to simply buy a 20Q gem) one is at their full progression other than tree reserve nodes? It's like the beta version now but rather than cutting out reservation progression other than end game accessing enlighten gems, it throws all reserve progression on lvl 24.

Even the live reduced mana progression is better than this.

Free means without any additional cost, just because it requires a certain level to use doesn't mean it isn't free.

Would your suggestion of reducing mana cost work for gem level, yes, is it something GGG will likely do. Probably not, for a number of reasons. 1 they have +1 to socketed gem level items and a helm that has +2 to aura gems, not to mention the fact that you can corrupt a gem to 21, so you can easily have a level 23 gem that gets the benefits of both damage\defenses AND reduced mana all based off of the gem level, doesn't that seem a bit too much, especially considering they want auras to be less powerful?

You wouldn't invest 20GCPs in a level 24 character, especially not in HC. You would wait until you reach endgame if first character and depending on the circumstances on how its implemented invest accordingly. If you party alot those people can help you invest to make your character stronger, therefore more useful to the party, if solo yes it will take longer or perhaps along the way you can purchase higher quality auras. Either way my suggestion gives you the ability to progress gems like you should be able to in PoE, decide if quality is something your build requires and if so find means to get it.

It doesn't cut off progression completely, enlighten is currently a very rare gem. Not only do you have to get it you have to level it AND corrupt it in order to be the same as reduced mana, my suggestion would only require you to level auras and GCP them or buy\find a high enough quality one along the way to level. Comparing either solutions (current beta or mine) to live reduced mana isn't a fair comparison, my suggestion was to improve on GGG's idea of making multiple auras have cost and take time, whereas yours is simple just to replace reduced mana with gem level, which already gets enough benefits for most builds anyway.

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PrimordialDarkness wrote:

So let me get this straight.

6 pages of thread here, 24 on my thread, and god knows how many elsewhere... and only ScrotieMcB, who has mostly been actually DEFENDING GGG as of late, is the one who understands that the correct solution is to have multiple support gems for auras that contend for a socket, with re-adjusted numbers so that reduced mana reservation is not absolutely required anymore and people can choose if they need it or not for their build, while paying an opportunity cost to get it?

I've seen the suggestion and a variety of options would be absolutely ideal yes, and in a long-term conception of design philosophy, probably the best way to encourage diversity - certainly as apposed to the Nerf Hammer vs. What Is Popular that GGG is going for.

But I doubt it's a realistic expectation for them to actually implement at this point. What are the odds they'll add new gems for this solution when they're already trying to use an existing gem as a (halfway) replacement for Reduced Mana?

So far Rory's response thus far is something to the effect of 'well we just need to nerf Enlighten's bonus then' (specifically to the point of questions about wealth gating).

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goetzjam wrote:

1 they have +1 to socketed gem level items and a helm that has +2 to aura gems, not to mention the fact that you can corrupt a gem to 21, so you can easily have a level 23 gem that gets the benefits of both damage\defenses AND reduced mana all based off of the gem level, doesn't that seem a bit too much, especially considering they want auras to be less powerful?

OMFG.

I couldn't get passed this bit, sorry, Goetz, you just bew it up.

AND YOU CAN CORRUPT A 23 QUALITY.
AND USE ENHANCE FOR FUCKTON MORE QUALITY.

For crying out loud, Goetz!!!!

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TheAnuhart wrote:

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goetzjam wrote:

1 they have +1 to socketed gem level items and a helm that has +2 to aura gems, not to mention the fact that you can corrupt a gem to 21, so you can easily have a level 23 gem that gets the benefits of both damage\defenses AND reduced mana all based off of the gem level, doesn't that seem a bit too much, especially considering they want auras to be less powerful?

OMFG.

I couldn't get passed this bit, sorry, Goetz, you just bew it up.

AND YOU CAN CORRUPT A 23 QUALITY.
AND USE ENHANCE FOR FUCKTON MORE QUALITY.

For crying out loud, Goetz!!!!

Why are you taking this so personal man?

Yes you can corrupt a 23 quality, actually if you've read the thread that was part of the benefits of such system like one I am purposing, you can choose to plan for a 21\20 or a 20\23, how awesome is that?

Enhance won't work, idk why you people keep saying that, the whole purpose of my purposed idea for quality auras is to REDUCE the mana required to run it to the point of current reduced mana. Enhance has a mana MULTIPLIER which gives exactly the OPPOSITE effect that you would want if you are trying to reduce the cost.

For crying out loud if you would read the post instead of just skimming and finding the line that has more to do with your ego then it does with the idea you might now that.


Worth mentioning that I do think adding other support gems for auras is a good idea, but that doesn't have really much to do with the discussion I was trying to get going here, but rather after the reduced mana situation is figured out, what more can they do to make auras interesting.

Show your math.

What levels of reduced reserve should each % quality on an aura give?

Bear in mind, we don't want to just shift red RM -> blue Enlighten -> green Enhance.

I'll give you something to start with.
Gems quality to 20%
Gems corrupt to 23%
Enhance has a 125% multiplier.
Enhance gives +8% quality at lvl 2
Enhance gives +16% quality at lvl 3
Enhance gives +24% quality at lvl 4
Enhance gives +32% quality at lvl 5
Enhance gives +40% quality at lvl 6

Why won't they fix mana reservation on auras and leave additional free socket for active skills ? Reduced Mana and Enlighten should not reduce mana reservation on auras.
Aura gems at higher levels could have less reservation cost.

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TheAnuhart wrote:

Show your math.

What levels of reduced reserve should each % quality on an aura give?

Bear in mind, we don't want to just shift red RM -> blue Enlighten -> green Enhance.

I'll give you something to start with.
Gems quality to 20%
Gems corrupt to 23%
Enhance has a 125% multiplier.
Enhance gives +8% quality at lvl 2
Enhance gives +16% quality at lvl 3
Enhance gives +24% quality at lvl 4
Enhance gives +32% quality at lvl 5
Enhance gives +40% quality at lvl 6

So now that you realize my idea isn't as terrible as it appears to you I have to explain it to you how every little detail about how they implement it?

I could spend the time to do that, or you know the people that get paid to do it could. I am sure they can make quality of the gems matter just enough to make an actually having a quality gem over using enhance work. Of course for some reason you listed level 6 enhance which is only possible with atzri's disfavor to my knowledge.

But hell lets dig deeper into this, lets say that with a level 5 enhance you can reduce the mana cost paired with either a 20 quality or 23 quality gem more then the desired 42% (which would be the goal for 20 quality aura like wrath)

Lets see what a build like this would take:

21\20 or 20\20 auras, individually fairly cheap, but if you are stacking auras, which you would be in this case can get quite expensive and time consuming to do so. If you don't require 21 auras much less time or cost investment, but then again we are looking at the mid and endgame scenarios here.

Enhance, in order to get level 5 we need a corrupted pair of boots/gloves, chest (probably not this) with +1 gems. Of course this also boost our aura's up by a level, so you already kinda want +1 gloves or boots regardless of build (ideally of course)

In order to have the required enhance for that you need a level 4, which is only possibly by buying or corrupting a level 3 (successfully yourself)

So I could do the math and prove that the cost would be so significant that the people running such a build in a temp league would be almost impossible to achieve without dedicating yourself to NL and make currency to buy everything, in which case they can already afford whatever bullshit FOTM build is super strong anyway.