...::: Ten Commandments of SFL :::...

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Note to our esteemed moderators: guys in case you plan to move this thread / I would appreciate if you keep this thread at least day or two in general just to attract enough attention. TY.
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......:::: Intro, Disclaimers ::::......
Ok people, I tried convince myself that this is not worth it but I simply must do this, you understand. First let me introduce several rules, announcements and notes;

1) This is not place for debate. We have heard all arguments for and against thousand times. Yes we know it's stupid and yes we know it will never happen but humor us and leave us to our dreams and imaginations, we harm no one. If you don't like SFL idea, please move on - there is nothing for you here. If you came here 'to disagree' you will be politely asked to leave. First time.

2) This is place for SFL endorsers to gather, discuss, bounce ideas, talk and work out good and bad sides of each possible approach.

......:::: Why All this, short intro, trivia and confessions ::::......
Well having started my SFL poll few days back I really haven't expected that kind of results and debates that followed. What's funniest of all I'm not that much fanatical about SFL but mere curiosity (are really so many people in favor or are they just loud minority...?) Brought me to all this. In case you've missed it this was my "poll" and "poll results" threads. If you want to debate I believe they are still quite alive and all up for it in there.

In whole process of "gathering data on interest" I've heard a lot of good points for and against SFL, some of them were making much sense. And, like it or not, I've started to ponder of problems and obstacles asking myself simple question; is there way to make this actually work? Is whole thing viable? Meaning easily introduced and make work seamlessly with rest of game, upsetting no one and making everybody happy? To make wolf full and sheep on count as on my country would say.

So lets start;

=============== 10 COMMANDMENTS OF SFL ===============

1. SFL is league where you find or make things you use. No trading is allowed, permanent PA is forced on players and all other things are open to debate /or optional?/ (for example, using of guild stash, being able to take things that other players drop on ground or sharing stash between characters)

2. SFL should in no circumstances be easier to play then normal league. Some changes would have to be introduced to make it somewhat similar in difficulty as any other standard league, or bit harder, never easier. Some sort of improved crafting should probably be introduced to compensate for lack of trading (which, let's be honest makes game much more easy.) Simplest way of achieving this would be to increase ORBS drop rate but exact method can be debated later.

3. SFL should be very VERY similar to any other standard league in everything. That includes drop rates and way the game works /interacts. This rule is very simple and very practical. Less change we demand/expect more probable is the chance that developer will introduce SFL. Average player usually have bunch of "ideas" how to improve game easily but has very little understanding of tremendously complex developing process and how painstakingly difficult are even smallest changes made. Not to mention balance which can go all way out the window with even seemingly small and insignificant changes.

4. SFL should have same drop rates for everything, especially uniques, rares, with possible exception of Orbs. I've though about this long time and even with extremely low top uniques drop rate I think it would be important to send clear message that this league is not about goodies and making things easy, or making people in standard leagues feeling screwed. We don't want to make this league appealing to newbies, rather to (even more) hardcore players.

5. That is all for now. I expect your input in finishing these 10 comandments. What SFL should DEFINTITELY be like.


......:::: Problems, Issues, Ideas ::::......

1) First and obvious problem to address would be availability of gems. Simple solution; make one standard NPC in each act (lime Maramoa for example) selling better and better selection of gems throughout the game. At least ones that are available from quests. Rest of gems - that can be debated.

2) Orbs. IMO magic items affecting orbs are OK. I would improve drop of Regals by 3-5x, they drop rarely and they can introduce blue affecting orbs in game - each good blue to become rare. Otherwise blue items get useless pretty fast. Jews are mostly OK thanks to jew recipe (6S). Chaos - probably 2X. Chromes. Well I would say 2-3X. Fuses. Ah those buggers :) At least 3-5X and good recipe like 4L item to get 1 fuse.

Oh yes, one way or the other orbs should be permanently bound to SFL player account. You cannot get rid of them by any means except of vendor or using them.

3) Expect yor input further.


......:::: Possible concept guidelines /mechanics of SFL ::::......
If you ask me SFL should not be "L" at all. By L I mean league. (we're gonna call it like that just not to confuse people now). Why not? Well first although league seems like natural way of introducing new things, making temporary league would only be short term fix. When league ends there would be problem in incorporating self founders to trading economy. Yes we can introduce options for them to keep their way of playing but we could do it right away, no league necessary. We actually need permanent solution here. It does not had to be new permanent league like hardcore, maybe there is a solution....

You may notice that even with 5x more fuses chances to fuse usable 5L are minimal (we won't even mention 6L in here...) Let us say that our goal would be for each player at level 80 has at least one 5L item. IMO together with increased fuse drop one way of increasing 5L chances would be to increase high number socket drop in all items. For now we are seing 5 or 6 S items pretty rarely. If we would increase chances of 5S or 6S by 3X, we could fix the very low 5L chance for SF players. Just and idea, dont get angry on me now :)


IMAGINE THIS (My Take);____________________________________________________________

When creating ANY character in ANY league, you have SFL Enabled button at side. Explanation (little (?) button) would be something like "Disables trading and slightly increases crafting chances. For experienced players only"
Checking button would do things I mostly describe in "10 commandments" ie. disabling trading mechanics, forcing permanent PA and making orbs account bound with slight increase in drop rates. Everything else would remain the same. SFL players could interact and mingle among gaming populace of whole game easily.

Oh yes, other two options/buttons could be "disable sharing of guild stash" and "disable sharing stash between characters" so every player could scale how "hardcore" your experience could be. Oh yes, with "guild stash shared" one month cooldown time in changing of guilds should be imposed as well.

And it would be nice if some effect, like small aureola or shine/aura could be put on SF players, so rest of players know who they are dealing with :)

As I see it that could be relatively easy to introduce and would satisfy many. If you have more ideas, comments please share.


One more time, this is place for ideas and creative input. Please so not soil it with negative posts or comments.

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TL DR, sorry, not any.

reserved

I respect your attempt to control the conversation with what we're allowed to say in your thread, but you should know that anything you do to keep people from voicing opposition to your ideas weaken them rather than strengthen them.

There is no compelling reason to start a SFL other than a bunch of people who think the grass will be greener there. It wont be. They'll be back whining that the Standard leagues have it too easy and that they DESERVE better treatment. It's not going to happen.

That is one big wall of troll bait.

I wish you luck in holding a constructive conversation though.

Edit:

So... if everything's the same except no trading... why bother?

If you and I are playing Domination and I decide to trade, how does that effect you? Why is that effect significant enough to warrant its own league?

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Shagsbeard wrote:

I respect your attempt to control the conversation with what we're allowed to say in your thread, but you should know that anything you do to keep people from voicing opposition to your ideas weaken them rather than strengthen them.

There is no compelling reason to start a SFL other than a bunch of people who think the grass will be greener there. It wont be. They'll be back whining that the Standard leagues have it too easy and that they DESERVE better treatment. It's not going to happen.

I respect your opinion but I do not care for it.

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If you don't like SFL idea, please move on - there is nothing for you here. If you came here 'to disagree' you will be politely asked to leave.

If you have nothing creative or positive to contribute, don't. Is it really so hard to keep your interest on things you like, for a change? Must you meddle in everything? This is not directed to you, more like rhetorical/philosophical question.

There are enough SFL duplicates out there. Go throw you 10 softies in them.

Stop attempting at Diablo3ising Path of Exile.

My most sincere best regards.

I didn't want to edit another addition to the other post so making a new one.

So I read more and saw the catch.

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Thorien_Kell wrote:

4. SFL should have same drop rates for everything, especially uniques, rares, with possible exception of Orbs.

...

2) Orbs. IMO magic items affecting orbs are OK. I would improve drop of Regals by 3-5x, they drop rarely and they can introduce blue affecting orbs in game - each good blue to become rare. Otherwise blue items get useless pretty fast. Jews are mostly OK thanks to jew recipe (6S). Chaos - probably 2X. Chromes. Well I would say 2-3X. Fuses. Ah those buggers :) At least 3-5X and good recipe like 4L item to get 1 fuse.

I caught "SFL should have same drop rates for everything" the first time but missed "with possible exception of Orbs" since I was glossing over it a bit.

So that at least makes more sense. I personally would want a weighting system added to item drops, affix allocation, and unique selection so that thing you find line up a bit more with your level range. As usual it would be a balancing trick between pay out and time in.

I like your "Self Found Only" checkbox on character creation as a rough concept. Implementation might actually be more troublesome than a league, though.

Nothing related to the SFL topic, but you could at least not use a picture of the diablo 3 barbarian IMO.

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PureLaine wrote:

There are enough SFL duplicates out there. Go throw you 10 softies in them.

Stop attempting at Diablo3ising Path of Exile.

My most sincere best regards.

Stop turning Path of Exile into an ARPG? POE is already more Diablo3 than an ARPG, because D3 was the the one that brought the economy shitstorm and made it a requirement to play.
Newsflash ARPGs never have been advertised as trading simulators. And ARPG does not mean Diablo-clone. There are have been tons of long running ARPG games like the Ys series.

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Morgoth2356 wrote:

Nothing related to the SFL topic, but you could at least not use a picture of the diablo 3 barbarian IMO.

This is viking, didn't knew it was pic from D3 but it matters not. D3 stolen the idea of barbarian from Conan, so what? It's just harmless illustration.