GGG Please Figure out how to stop Boosting (screenshots included)

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Desbris wrote:

Why is GGG allowing boosting on the ladders, especially players in the top ten as these players are going to gain alot of in-store credit and some even physical goods. I have no idea why it is allowed and why these will not be disqualified from gaining any of the rewards for the race.

And 90% of players boosting admit it freely, due to them believing it is helping the game, or that because it is only beta it does not matter, but GGG is already aware of the boosting situation so it should of been banned and prohibited. Not exactly a fair policy for those who do not boost.

Des has hit the nail on the head here.

WHY are GGG allowing this and rewarding people for it ?

I have given up with the race. At 1 point the guy i was running maps with and mayself were doing quite well(1 top 10 and 1 top 15) but we are a group of 2 and cannot compete with boosted groups so there is no point trying.
At this point for me the game is failing and believe me when i say if there was a refund option i would be taking it.

Fair policy does not seem to come into it. Just lets reward the boosters and screw everyone else.


The week and month race have achieved nothing but bad feeling among the community due to the fact that this is known about having nothing done about and still rewarding people for it.

Why don't GGG speak up about this as it has apparently been discussed in Alpha and let people know.

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TehHammer wrote:

What's really depressing is not only does the level 10 get ~83.5% of the exp when it's close to the level 1, but the level 1's share (~16.5%) gets completely removed from the mix when he's more than 2 screen widths away, so the level 10 got 100% of the exp after the bonus (113 * 1.95 = ~220 exp).

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MrDDT wrote:

The only slightly confusing thing here is that you say that the "share" the level 1s get when they are far away is "completely removed from the mix" however, its not removed at all. Its just not shared (or you might call taken) from the person killing because the level 1s are too far away. So again, the person solo killing (or being boosted if you will) is getting 100%+65%per extra person's exp when he kills a mob away from the group.

Yes, this is exactly what I was saying. When at a distance it doesn't get shared, the level 1's share gets completely removed from the mix, and the level 10 gets 100% of the exp (including all bonuses), which I thought I clearly stated.

This has made it obvious that my proposed exp cap solution wouldn't do a darn thing.

The problem with your cap is that if someone wanders off, they're not just getting punished for not being with the group, they're getting uber punished. Put it this way, if you're in a group and you wander off, your effective exp gain should never drop below a 1:1 ratio with the effective mob's life, otherwise they'd be better off soloing for exp. That would severely discourage party play.

In a 6 man group, if you wander off, you're doing 350% more damage to kill a mob, you should get 350% more exp. The problem with boosting is that you get 425% of the exp for doing 350% more damage, which is a ~21.4% (425/350=~1.214) increase to that ratio.

The reason 2 man parties aren't popular in races, 150% hp:165% exp is a 10% increase in effective exp gain (165/150 = 1.1), you're getting more than double that in a 6 man party.

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StillSingle wrote:

XP = Base * (1 +(.5n)*1.3)

That's exactly how it works, although I'd write it up as:
Exp = BaseExp * (1 + (AdditionalPartyMembers * 0.5 * (1 + 0.3)))

As you said, it is effectively the same as a 65% bonus per party member.

So a white "Rattling Bones" giving 115 exp in a party of 5 would look like:
115 * (1 + (4 * 0.5 * (1 + 0.3))) = 414 exp.

What I'd suggest, now that I've learned how the mechanics actually work, is that they remove the 30% party bonus if there aren't nearby players to share exp with. Basically, right now, if I join a 6 man group and wander off solo, I'll have to deal 350% more damage to kill mobs, but I'll get bigger packs, so less travel time and no one to share the exp with, so I'd get 425% more exp for killing a mob with 350% more exp. Not counting problems like taking more hits while bringing packs down, getting hit more often, bigger need to kite, etc., I'm better off doing this than play solo.

If they removed the 30% party bonus, it wouldn't make as much sense unless you're doing an excessive amount of overkill. This, of course, would open the door to allow bots to follow you and keep that 30% party bonus, but would at least complicate things for now.

Perhaps a combination of a shared exp cap and the removal of the 30% bonus when wandering would make most sense. If you're alone, the bonus only scales with the hp bonus of mobs, 50% per additional party member each (to use the algorithm, ExpWhenWandering = BaseExp * (1 + (AdditionalPartyMembers * 0.5))). If you're in a position to share exp, you can't get more than SharedExperience / NearbyPartyMembers with possibly some form of scaling to allow more so that a player higher leveled than nearby party members get some bonus, but obviously not level 1->level 80 bonus. ;)

This is weird.
It appears to me that the people who are boosting think of themselves as an helping element or some sort of saint for the community and game development - just by proving that boosting can be done.

Well, thanks to all boosters for ruining the ladder race for normal players.
It's not different from using hacks/bots imho and i pity those who do!

I'd like to see a name tag for those who boosted just like they did with oldman and his bot.

BOO!

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Stretch163 wrote:

Des has hit the nail on the head here.

WHY are GGG allowing this and rewarding people for it ?

You've missed an important point.

How do you suggest GGG profile this behavior?

How easily could GGG's chosen method of profiling be circumvented?

When it's circumvented, should they strengthen their profiling?

It's an endless circle, and in the current state of the game policing it is simply wasted money. They have to get their systems worked out, first. Then maybe we see some policing. Rewards absolutely don't matter one bit with a complete wipe about a month and a half off.

summary: until the underlying systems that facilitate this behavior get addressed, trying to make and enforce some rules against it is simply a losing battle. Get the systems right first, then we'll see about rules. The rewards are good; they encourage people to playtest more.

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In a 6 man group, if you wander off, you're doing 350% more damage to kill a mob, you should get 350% more exp. The problem with boosting is that you get 425% of the exp for doing 350% more damage, which is a ~21.4% (425/350=~1.214) increase to that ratio.

The reason 2 man parties aren't popular in races, 150% hp:165% exp is a 10% increase in effective exp gain (165/150 = 1.1), you're getting more than double that in a 6 man party.

I dont think you understand the full concept of why boosting is so good.
Yes you are getting 21.4% more exp per HP/EXP ratio.
But its a LOT more efficient to kill a mob with 3.5x HP than it is to go looking around the map for mobs. Most of the time people OVER DPS, or are doing AOE damage. Not just because they getting 21% more exp. Trust me its much much better than 21% more exp.

This also doesnt count the fact that in solo each map would give 100% exp.
In a boosted map, the map gives 425% exp per map.

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Funcrusher wrote:

This is weird.
It appears to me that the people who are boosting think of themselves as an helping element or some sort of saint for the community and game development - just by proving that boosting can be done.

Well, thanks to all boosters for ruining the ladder race for normal players.
It's not different from using hacks/bots imho and i pity those who do!

I'd like to see a name tag for those who boosted just like they did with oldman and his bot.

BOO!

Say I'm level 82, playing with 5x level 65s. Is this considered boosting? We are all killing.

well if you're all together and you share xp its not boosting at all.

But you don't share equally

The higher the level difference, the more exp goes to the highest lvl player.

Thereby boosting his exp gain

If they're all together, he's getting 25.8% of the exp. From my experience, he's probably far out-DPSing the other party members and his exp rate is lowered because the AVERAGE damage done per person is what ultimately determines the rate at which the exp is gained. If it wasn't for the 21.4% full party bonus to exp, he'd probably not be gaining exp faster than soloing.

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Zakaluka wrote:

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Stretch163 wrote:

Des has hit the nail on the head here.

WHY are GGG allowing this and rewarding people for it ?

You've missed an important point.

How do you suggest GGG profile this behavior?

How easily could GGG's chosen method of profiling be circumvented?

When it's circumvented, should they strengthen their profiling?

It's an endless circle, and in the current state of the game policing it is simply wasted money. They have to get their systems worked out, first. Then maybe we see some policing. Rewards absolutely don't matter one bit with a complete wipe about a month and a half off.

summary: until the underlying systems that facilitate this behavior get addressed, trying to make and enforce some rules against it is simply a losing battle. Get the systems right first, then we'll see about rules. The rewards are good; they encourage people to playtest more.

Stop bringing up the typical rewards that get wiped, that is irrelevant, I have made it very clear I am referring to actual in-store credit and possibly physical goods. So therefore it DOES matter and for some people they believe it is unacceptable that these boosters will GREATLY benefit from this.