Do all the XP penalty complainers just body brigade through the game? Honest question

"

Orrion300#4027 wrote:

And how are we supposed to find upgrades?

Vendors only refresh on leveling up, so they're out.

The majority of people don't have enough currency to craft their own gear, so that's out.

Can't buy upgrades for the same reason - that costs currency, especially if you're looking for specific stats combos.

Drops are pretty random, as well, so you might be farming forever before you find a drop that way.

----

Hell, a lot of people can't even tell what an upgrade IS because, once again, the game is very convoluted, and you receive very little help.

"

alhazred70#2994 wrote:

As insensitive as this might sound (not my intent but I'm being honest): games have to have a lose condition or they aren't games.

"

alhazred70#2994 wrote:

"

Akedomo#3573 wrote:

Why are you only asking for 20%? This mechanic adds so much to the game, wouldn't it really be better at 50%? What's wrong with 50%?

So multiple things (ignoring what you seem to be trying to do here which is to try and turn an argument of degrees into one of absolutes); the penalty becomes harsher the higher level you are. When you level past 90 that 10% starts representing a much stiffer penalty. You could argue (I would) that higher just becomes unreasonably harsh for "SC" at higher levels and that because the game does have "confluence of bullshit" deaths that are not earned that these become too extreme.

If the game was balanced better I would play HC BTW, and 50% wouldn't phase me at all. But its not, and also lag and server problems are real things so...

10% is tried and true, and derived from years of play testing its enough to feel like punishment. Its balanced, except for the fact that there's always going to be some players who don't want any negative consequences in their games and thus will always rage about it on the forums if they're bad at the game and in some cases refuse to even consider that adapting and gaming and not the XP penalty might be their problem.

Again at some point a larger penalty starts pushing the current basic mode of the game closer to the territory of HC, if GGG devs decided they wanted both ways of playing to be considerably closer to each other though I'd live with it. I don't guess they want that which explains their balance point. Which I agree with and think is fine at 10%.

Plenty of shit I don't agree with GGG on, but this one I do.

"

Nyon#6673 wrote:

"

bovideos#9752 wrote:

XP penalty sucks... plain and simple.

And don't bring D2 into the discussion because:

1) It's an early 2000's game. Different times.

2) No BS deaths because of random sh1t you can't control or can't predict or can't even see. D2 deaths are, usually, 100% on you. Also, you can get most of it back by collecting your dead body.

Create your own, separate, elitist gatekeepers league if you think XP penalty is so exciting. Toss in the 1 death per map in that league also. It's not fun game design, you're just a glutton for punishment who have 0 care for your own time.

1. You cant just decide that D2 isnt comparable because its from 2000s without explaining or giving any reason why. Thats not how anything works ever.
Its a game in the same genre, thats been praised and enjoyed by millions that has the same mechanic and many still enjoyed it. Many still do, its irrelevant if the game is old or not.

2. Poe2 has no random shit you cant control or see either. Your failure to see on death effects doesnt change the reality of the world.

3. Even if you were correct and the game had hidden invisible effects to kill you then it would still be irrelevant.
How is it not instantly obvious that the solution is to fix the "random shit mechsnic that you cant control or see". Its yet again completetly irrelevant to weither xp penalty should stay or not

"

Mouser#2899 wrote:

Being killed is a lose condition.

"

Mouser#2899 wrote:

Make the content challenging is players will struggle to overcome it. They won't be able to just zerg or bodyslam past it, because those strategies won't work.

It should require mastering multiple mechanics, utilizing your dodge rolls and movement skills, timing your attacks and skills, etc...

Getting all that down should REQUIRE multiple attempts to a) figure out the mechanics, b) develop a game plan, and c) execute that plan correctly.

This isn't simply a "farm to win" aRPG. It also leans into twin stick shooting and wears its Soulsbourne influence on its sleeve.

"

Akedomo#3573 wrote:

So If I understand you correctly. You feel the mechanic can be too harsh at 50%? The penalty is just too much?

"

alhazred70#2994 wrote:

Only if there are consequences that are impactful enough to make you want to avoid it.

Fun fact in Trade SC clear speed meta circles your build is considered bad if you don't AT LEAST die some of the time. In other words: if you're not dying sometimes you have too many passives or suffixes devoted to defense that could more optimally be spent on clearing faster.

"

alhazred70#2994 wrote:

Sure I don't disagree with any of this. How you make things challenging is the question and without consequences for poor play you simply can't.

"

alhazred70#2994 wrote:

If you're butting up against the XP penalty a lot: its because you're not playing the ARPG correctly. You're intentionally losing; Stop that. You'll enjoy the game a lot more if you stop intentionally losing.

Your instinct as a gamer playing a hack and slash ARPG when you die to often should be to go back to a previous or optional zone and farm a bit. Get some upgrades, maybe a level. Why do you think you're supposed to just steamroll ahead until the last boss dies or you reach a leveling equalibrium because you lose XP throwing your face at it faster than you gain XP? Thats not the intent of the game or genre.

Playing well in an ARPG mostly means killing things for loot until you're powerful and not dying. Unlike a souls game or a platformer or a strategy game, here the entire goal of the game is to outscale the content with a powerful character. NOT puzzle solving acumen, 4d chess, thinking 20 moves ahead, not precise flinch jumping skills at the pixel edge of a platform and not pattern recognition of what moves the enemy always does on repeat. (though ofc POE2 is weaving a bit of this in, again though its still mostly outscalable as it should be using the ARPG gameplay loop)

Imagine this mindset in a strategy game: I'll just keep using the same tactic and hope for a different result via some RNG; sounds like the definition of insanity right? Its sure as hell not gaming.

I know this seems obvious to some but the amount of complaining about XP penalty suggests that a LOT OF PEOPLE CLEARLY NEED TO HEAR IT.

Stop losing intentionally.

"

alhazred70#2994 wrote:

"

Akedomo#3573 wrote:

So If I understand you correctly. You feel the mechanic can be too harsh at 50%? The penalty is just too much?

I just explained that I think there's such a thing as both "too much" consequence, and also "not enough". Not sure if you're stuck on this 50% number because you think there's some got'cha moment here or what.