PoE is better than D2...
" What I learned is that every forum has its 'bittervets', the guys who have played the game for a long time and have thus burnt out on it and are now unhappy that the game they once so loved isn't that much fun anymore as back in the days when everything was new and shiny. Instead of showing a healthy reaction and just moving on to another game, they clinge to the past and try to convince everyone how the current state of the game is bad and how in the past everything was better. I guess they're either addicted to the game and can't get off of it or they are emotionally immature and can't move on without causing a lot of spite :3 GGG banning all political discussion shortly after getting acquired by China is a weird coincidence.
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" That is a good list there dude https://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/1552460 - my drop solution
Specs: CPU - i5 9600k, geforce 2060, 32 gb ram, ssd, 2133/2333 mz.----- EXILES EVERYWHERE, PLEASE?!?!?! |
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Nothing in that list is objectively better and some points are not even a point at all. Honestly in many listed points PoE far exceeds D2.
Compiling a vague list without any supporting arguments is pretty lame. |
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" This. First I wanted to answer because answering point by point posts is autismal fun to me but then I just overcame my assburgers and ignored it. GGG banning all political discussion shortly after getting acquired by China is a weird coincidence.
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" You replied with an incredibly general statement and now you're trying to use personal experience as evidence. I've played this game longer then you have and have poured thousands of more hours into it, and I haven't even gotten a single drop that has come even close to a Lionseye Glare, let alone something like Shavs. My personal experience trumps yours right because I've been playing longer? If we're gonna play the game of "let's use personal experience to validate my argument" I'm gonna win that one. Path of Exile will never, on any planet come close to Diablo 2 in overall game design. Diablo 2 had a more comprehensive experience with a smoother gear and character progression curve, and overall the balance was alot more sound. The level design is better, the overall diversity in builds is much higher, there's no "economy" to ruin your day, and the balance team at Blizzard never outright ruined builds unless it was warranted (for example Skelly Mancers causing all sorts of lag with their crazy number of summons on the screen which they had to reduce). Diablo 2 in every possible way has Path of Exile beat, even with outdated netcoding the netcode works better in Diablo 2. That's saying alot considering Diablo 2 is a fucking ancient game. How anyone says shit like "Path of Exile so gud" when Diablo 3 still shits on it in terms of number of players, number of viewers on streams, and overall in many other departments (and Diablo 3 isn't even that good of a game) is beyond me. And please, don't give me that bullshit argument about popularity doesn't = quality. Diablo 3 RoS has been out long enough where if it was a shitgame people would have stopped playing it en masse already (similar to how Diablo 3 Vanilla was a garbage game and their numbers plummeted after 6 months). " What I learned from the interwebz is that there are people who will worship their favorite heroes/games and not think objectively for once in their life, despite the fact that instead of gaining or retaining players, Path of Exile is massively bleeding players. Ever thought of that? It's not like hey PoE went down to a decent sized community and its just remained that way (which is the sign of a healthy population that has stabilized). No, lots of players are quitting, in particular lots of players who have invested thousands of hours and have contributed quite alot to the community through either feedback or their knowledge of the game. GGG has basically lucked out that they basically don't have competition outside of RoS, because if they did, they would get utterly smashed. Last edited by allbusiness#6050 on Jul 7, 2014, 9:53:07 PM
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" Ever consider that perhaps it's not the game, but you that's doing it wrong? I mean we see a lot of the same top guys staying on top league after league. They stream, their wealth is accounted for (so no RMT-BS claims), many of them come up with the top builds, they just know what they're doing. Are you trying to say they just get very lucky every time they log on? Oh and what a "comprehensive experience" those never ending boss runs were huh? The only thing that kept D2 alive for so long was dueling and the underground economy, whether you knew about it or not. PvM was so easy, did you really think the best items in the game had value because people wanted to run baal .0001% faster? Ah also, funny little thing to think about. Blizzard may not have balanced the game around an economy (although that's a bit of a stretch too). But they certainly balanced it around duping. Diablo clone was literally a sink for duped SoJs. Not to mention the runewords coming out from 1.10 onward. Which required a minimum of 2 items (high runes) that were each more rare than any of the rarest items in this game BY FAR. They fully expected them to be duped and circulated. Not everyone could dupe, but everyone could certainly trade duped items. They knew this from the get-go. If that isn't balancing around an economy, I don't know what is. IGN: Smegmazoid
Long live the new Flesh |
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"Copies of Diablo: Battle Chest continue to be sold in retail stores, appearing on the NPD Group's top 10 PC games sales list as recently as 2010 (1). Even more remarkably, the Diablo: Battle Chest was the 19th best selling PC game of 2008 (2) – a full seven years after the game's initial release – and 11 million users still played Diablo II and StarCraft over Battle.net in 2010" (3).
Spoiler
Also, I think that D2 has a much more well-planned, thorough, and streamlined unique item structure. Then, you add in the also seemingly well-planned set item structure. Then you add in the seemingly well-planned and simplistic skill trees. D2 took the "keep it simple stupid" principle and maximized it so well. The monsters, particularly unique monsters, and accompanying mobs, also appear to be very well planned and placed (as many are in PoE as well). Valuating and trading items was not so f*cking tedious as it currently is in PoE. To me, decision-making in D2 did not seem nearly as tedious or ambiguated (not really a word) as it does in PoE. In PoE, I find myself not giving a f*ck about so many items and modifiers because of my perceived difficulty of item valuation and the fact that very few items really strike a positive chord with me. I'm not a fan of the whole 'trade-offs' philosophy of passives and item modifiers. It surely has its place, but D2 conditioned me to be more interested in the symmetry and synergistic qualities of item modifiers. Certain items in D2 are so memorable to nearly anyone who played the game for any notable period of time. Honestly, in PoE I do not find too many items or monsters so deeply memorable as compared to D2. Chin Sol is an item that I really like. I also find Perpetus to be a very memorable creature. There was such a unity to D2's world and items that it all worked as a cohesive leviathan ARPG. PoE still seems scattered, fragmented, or non-streamlined on so many fronts. Bottom line: D2 had me so d*mn addicted. PoE has me addicted as well, but it seems to be more out of hope than out of true satisfaction and enjoyment at this point. It's as if I want to relive the D2 experience, but there are too many stupid items, stupid modifier combinations, cheesy mtx and item art, cheesy monster-names, goofy trollish artifacts scattered throughout otherwise very cool looking zones, and ridiculous time and item sinks with minimized payoffs for me to have a fully satisfying gaming experience. Also, I am certain that I am having difficulty adapting to however GGG wants me to play. "How to play" PoE is simply not clear enough, imo. D2 made "how to play" so d*mn clear. Sorry, but D2 > PoE. TY to those who called me out on my BS on these forums. There is no benefit to being so selfish as to fail to acknowledge others' differing beliefs of what "should be" or believe your own opinions so supreme as to be factual and thus dismiss others' opinions as being somehow a lie or delusional.
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" Maybe we're different, I don't need a Shav's to be happy. I can also farm you a Lioneye's in a day, where's the problem? How can you play thousands of hours and have nothing? It's literally impossible unless you deliberately gimp yourself by not trading at all. " I disagree with everything but the economy part, but that was your point from the beginning: D2 is much easier and therefore doesn't rely on the player having top notch gear to faceroll it. The progression curve in PoE feels smooth until you hit a wall (this wall exists in D2 too) and by the time you hit that wall you're pretty decently geared and can faceroll almost everything. The balance has good and bad sides in both PoE and D2, PoE build diversity is at least on par with D2 despite it being the harder game (easy game = you can faceroll with everything = more diversity). Not sure how often builds were ruined in D2, but in PoE this rarely happens. People love to exaggerate ('omg I lost 5% DPS my build is RUINED!') but overall GGG is doing a good job at not pissing off everyone. They 'ruin' some builds for the higher good (see the upcoming changes to remove snapshotting) but they eventually buff or change them in a way that makes them viable again (though this sometimes take too long, I agree). " Netcode in D2 was hilarious, you could provoke desync all day every day, which was even a solid PvP tactic x) What does this discussion have to do with D3's popularity? Is CoD suddenly the best shooter in the world? Is Fantasy Westward Journey (1.5m+ concurrent players) the best MMO in the world (google that shit, it's ridiculous)? Stop grasping at straws. You also don't even know how many players RoS has atm. GGG banning all political discussion shortly after getting acquired by China is a weird coincidence. Last edited by Xavderion#3432 on Jul 7, 2014, 10:18:52 PM
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" Ah, the good old 'PoE is dead' with the obligatory ad hominem included :) By your logic I won't ever play PoE again because I was in the PoE Steamchart for the first two and a half months of the new leagues, but after that I'm not in the chart anymore because I stopped playing. PoE bled me so to speak. It's definitely dead.
Spoiler
You're grasping at straws m8.
" It actually did went down to a decent sized community. And every now and then there will be occasional player spikes (release of 1.2.0 for example) and then it will again go down to a decent sized community. And so the cycle continues :) GGG banning all political discussion shortly after getting acquired by China is a weird coincidence.
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" Bingo. The "power at a price" philosophy of PoE with artificial drawbacks sucks really badly. The rare items are stale and bureaucratic, the uniques are gimmicky and lackluster. I consider PoE's item system to be the worst in the entire genre. It's absolutely infuriating. I would also expect a game that focuses on rare items so heavily to make some innovation in that area. It's funny, when somebody criticizes certain aspects of the game (Selffound league, legacy items, desync), PoE players get defensive and say the game wasn't really made for that group of people (Selffounders, Softcore, Hardcore), but there is barely anybody left. And most problems manyfest themselves in the later difficulties so people always leave pissed. Almost nobody leaves the game on good terms, and they leave for different reasons. If you can't keep the core audiences, who's left? I am having real trouble figuring out who PoE was made for. My best guesses: -Streamers (Frequent updates = more videos; "hilarious" and "totally fair" HC death videos, difficult game mechanics, many build combinations) -People who like to be called hardcore gamers, whatever that might be.(It's funny when they break, acting tough at first, defending the games flaws, and then melting down in glorious rants admitting that it sucked from the start) -Puzzle gamers, maybe? -Armchair game designers (like me :-), analysing the ongoing trainwreck) But not the core RPG audiences. The game isn't about playing RPG style. It's about outsmarting the game, the designers, and the competing players for broken build combinations, which will subsequentially get nerfed. The bank always wins, as you know. And these cheese builds thus become standard builds after a rebalance. So you have the cheese builds, making ends meet, whereas normal RPG-builds get creamed. Cheese builds and range builds become the standard, as is Alt-F4ing. The game ceases to be an RPG at that point and becomes something different. It's really interesting to see these consequences, because the philosophical set-up of the game seemed appealing. I'm a proponent of a laissez faire approach to dealing with broken builds and outsmarting the system, and PoE's concept codifies that. I always used joke and cheese builds in D2, like melee-sorc and melee-necro. PoE seemed like a game just for me. I would not have thought it would end up that badly. |
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