cannot use the same support gem twice in different spells

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bobtank#2490 wrote:

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CaffeinatedFog#0188 wrote:

To hear GGG tell it, this restriction promotes build diversity. If you could use any support gem any number of times, you'd just choose whatever supports give a skill the most damage, like in PoE1. Where in PoE2, skills are more situational, and you need to decide with your support gems what place you want each skill to have in your build's gameplay.

I would argue that it doesn't promote build diversity but does the exact opposite. Any decision whether the limit is there or not is typically going to be "what support out of the available support pool can I put here to increase my character power most efficiently". Progressively removing gems from that pool is not giving you more options for build diversity, it's objectively giving you less. It gives the illusion of more build diversity because it forces you to use supports you othetwise wouldn't otherwise considered. But if the limit was removed, those options would've still been available regardless.

+1 build diversity will suffer from this change, everyone will just run the most efficient gem setup for each skill and any deviation from that will be large hinderance for your build especially when they nerf and balance based on the top preforming players/builds. Novel and jank builds are basically dead and you have to play the one or two build GGG deicides are the builds for your ascendancy.

I don't like that limitation too, because it just force me to switch the gems during the game often because i want a good skill for single targets like boss fights or stronger mobs. And another for multiple standard mobs. I cant have that because usually i need nearly the same support gems for both attacks. So i can decide to have either one realy strong of the two and one realy weak or both medium strong or i press G and reposition the gems depending on the enemy wich is pretty stupid.
If there would be plenty of supports to choose but there isnt that much.
They added weapon slot bases skill points but yet limit the skills itself that much.

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Erebus1800#6364 wrote:

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bobtank#2490 wrote:

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CaffeinatedFog#0188 wrote:

To hear GGG tell it, this restriction promotes build diversity. If you could use any support gem any number of times, you'd just choose whatever supports give a skill the most damage, like in PoE1. Where in PoE2, skills are more situational, and you need to decide with your support gems what place you want each skill to have in your build's gameplay.

I would argue that it doesn't promote build diversity but does the exact opposite. Any decision whether the limit is there or not is typically going to be "what support out of the available support pool can I put here to increase my character power most efficiently". Progressively removing gems from that pool is not giving you more options for build diversity, it's objectively giving you less. It gives the illusion of more build diversity because it forces you to use supports you othetwise wouldn't otherwise considered. But if the limit was removed, those options would've still been available regardless.

+1 build diversity will suffer from this change, everyone will just run the most efficient gem setup for each skill and any deviation from that will be large hinderance for your build especially when they nerf and balance based on the top preforming players/builds. Novel and jank builds are basically dead and you have to play the one or two build GGG deicides are the builds for your ascendancy.

i'm not so sure that build diversity is better with it. it will force people to simply play with what is the best and avoid try other stuff. and instead to allows people to have multiple skill you will have tweaks, you will try to limite yourself like before.

plus you have a few other choice that make build diversity not soo good, you play minion you will run a scepter for the spirit, means no other weapon skill because if you use by example a bow skill you equip your bow, then your scepter spirit is not on anymore, leading to your minion to despawn.

anyway, i'm not for a full freedom, but i feel 2 copy of support gem will be a good compromise. because right now, you barely have any choice in terms of support and skill/spell...

it would make the game too easy. imagine a 25% speed buff on any attack skill you desire? it would simplify the game too much and people could shut off their brains. which i do not feel is a good thing.

this system right now rewards creativity and ingenuity

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torchwoodtooms#0275 wrote:

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NicknamesOfGod#1810 wrote:

Yes, it's intended. You can only socket each support skill once per character.

This is incomprehensible..

Limiting support gems to one slot isn't fun. Please change this GGG. I agree with OP.

I think the limitation makes the game more engaging for the average player by making their choice more meaningful. By "average player", I mean someone who doesn't just follow a guide every league and zoom to endgame and instead plays the game and figures out things on their own.

In PoE 1 it was almost always obvious what cookie-cutter supports go with each skill, with some being mandatory for every skill that can benefit from them.

In PoE 2, supports are generally much less powerups and instead impact the playstyle or intended use of a skill, while skills are more powerful on their own.

By "build diversity" they mean the emergent, natural state of thousands of people making their own choices. Also, some supports are literally a matter of a gameplay style and these choices become less obvious.

Will there always be a PoB-optimal choice of supports given a build? Sure. Will it be significantly more powerful than a slightly different setup for a different playstyle? GGG and I hope not.

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CaffeinatedFog#0188 wrote:

To hear GGG tell it, this restriction promotes build diversity. If you could use any support gem any number of times, you'd just choose whatever supports give a skill the most damage, like in PoE1. Where in PoE2, skills are more situational, and you need to decide with your support gems what place you want each skill to have in your build's gameplay.

This is just an awful way to do it. It's forced diversity, rather than natural diversity.

Let people use what they want. If you want them using other spells. Make the spells better. Make other support gems completely change how the spell works.


Honest to god. If they want people to have build diversity. They need to go back to the drawing board.

Why are spells just spells, and not spells that can build off eachother, or combo? There's so many games with combat systems that could be learnt from. Whatever they did with this system, it just doesn't feel good.

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Akedomo#3573 wrote:

This is just an awful way to do it. It's forced diversity, rather than natural diversity.

Let people use what they want. If you want them using other spells. Make the spells better. Make other support gems completely change how the spell works.


Honest to god. If they want people to have build diversity. They need to go back to the drawing board.

Why are spells just spells, and not spells that can build off eachother, or combo? There's so many games with combat systems that could be learnt from. Whatever they did with this system, it just doesn't feel good.

+1

Couldn't agree more.

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xenigmatica#6388 wrote:

They don't want diversity. They want simplification and power.

That, exactly that. You just nailed it.

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Redthorne82#3177 wrote:

Lemme get this straight. If you could just give all the abilities the same, strongest, supports...that would be diversity? If all skills were build the same?

What if everyone in a room looks exactly the same. Do we call that diversity?

This is just a blatant propaganda from PoE2 devs by which they tried to push down our throats, and many ppl swallowed it. But by far not so many as they wished.
As I wrote earlier, I get their point of a vision to make diversity, but this is just not the way at all. Works for few builds, sure, for many it doesn't.
It BREAKS them or in better case CRIPPLES down.
You fully ignore the fact, that it's not only about "having the strongest", "most DPS" supports.
There are skills, that are not about DPS.
So this argument about BiS dmg boost is half-thruth. As I said, cripples down other skills.
Also one more thing. "If you could just give all the abilities the same, strongest, support..."
Gues what's gonna happen asap builds for PoE2 come out?
They will pick the strongest support gems combos and "all" will follow that build. The only difference gonna be vs PoE1 that they will have only less options from support gems to chose, but the exact same pattern will be replicated, that is: insterting the Best in slot from the "available" a.k.a. restricted support gems pool.

I mean let's be real here. This decision makes so little sense that they had to actually put default options in the options menu that keep you from cutting the same gem twice because intuitively you should be able to cut and use whatever the heck gem you want to use. If I wanted to use scattershot in every ability I have that works with scattershot, why can't I? That's not diversity. This is the same thing a game like World of Warcraft does. "Here's your tier set, now go out and play the same build everybody else playing your class plays".