D4 no gud, send me poe2 thx

"d4 is so shit man it makes me run around the world for stuff to do why they can't be like poe where I sit on top of my balls and get mirrors by manipulating the market.."

d4 mmo what in heavens fuck.. if that's the case what is people calling the usual groups on trade league every league? unless I'm missing something here the interaction with others can happen on poe as well just grouped and not the usual ssf outside towns.. which everyone and their mother knows that towns in trade league are used as massive ADs for microtransactions rather than anything useful.

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DarthSki44 wrote:

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Reinhart wrote:

Playerbase size is not a good metric for what constitutes a quality game, neither as the amount of articles published gives a good idea of a great scientist.

Says who? You? You and a friend? You and a group of your friends?

Im sure you can see the problem inherent with this logic.

I'd agree somewhat, but only as far as saying playerbase isn't the only metric. "Quality" itself which is often subjective, typically does have some objective measurement as well depending on the topic or item being discussed.

If a million scientists agree the Earth is round, and a dozen say it's flat, I think the size of the sampling matters in that context to establish credibility or quality of opinion. No?

argumentum ad populum.

But playerbase comparison is always a sub metric for if a game is good or not. Comparing player base of Diablo IV and POE isn't right because they are polar opposites in terms of complexity.

Diablo IV sells because it is a simple ARPG. POE doesnt sell to a lot of people because of how complex it is. A couple of friends of mine said you need to be a no lifer to enjoy the game. That is why they choose Diablo over POE.

At the end of the best metric for NON PAY TO WIN games is how much revenue they get from the game. We know Diablo Immortal wont be beat by Diablo IV for sales revenue. We will see how much money people spend on the game in the long run that matters.

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skjutengris wrote:

a crafting simulator and not an arpg anymore.

We must be playing different games. Playing since 2018, and avoiding crafting like fire except to fill out the free suffixes and prefixes with basic crafts from a crafting bench. Still having a blast and making OK currency for a casual scrub.

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esostaks wrote:

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skjutengris wrote:

a crafting simulator and not an arpg anymore.

We must be playing different games. Playing since 2018, and avoiding crafting like fire except to fill out the free suffixes and prefixes with basic crafts from a crafting bench. Still having a blast and making OK currency for a casual scrub.

I do crafting but it doesnt take as much time as actually playing the game.

Dave: the shared town thing/instanced world concept wasn't from an MMO but Guild Wars 1. Until then, it was one or the other.

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Foreverhappychan wrote:

Dave: the shared town thing/instanced world concept wasn't from an MMO but Guild Wars 1. Until then, it was one or the other.

IT is definitely an MMO quality, and most GW players would tell you GW was still an MMO, even though it played more like a Warframe/Destiny 2 Lobby-based game.

Its still an MMO-based feature. It existed in EQ. I think people are spoiled on WOW and its seamless world, but a a lot of other MMOs mostly only feel like an MMO in town, and there are loading screens going into the worlds.

Then you start getting into the semantics of what constitutes an MMO, and as someone who frequents the MMO sub-reddit this is a rabbit hole not worth getting into because everyone has a different definition.

Point is, PoE has features that you find in mostly MMO's or MMO-lites. Destiny, Warframe, GW, you name it. And these features were in the game in 2011. Shared hubs, leading into player housing(hideouts), etc. It has MMO qualities so I find it ironic people are putting D4 on blast for similar things. Because D4 looks more like a Destiny 2 with very limited shared world space and towns holding a finite amount of people.

Its a dont throw stones in a glass house scenario to me.

EQ had shared everything. Towns. World zones. Dungeons. Anyone who played it knows the pain of camp spawning and spawn camping. There were literally queues of people sitting in front of some of them -- Flowing Black Silk Sash : IYKYK.

Almost no Tyrian considered GW1 an MMO and ArenaNet definitely refused that classification for the game, since at the time MMO meant fully shared world -- GW1 innovated the notion of shared town, instanced everything else. Maybe I missed a game before it that tried it but GW1 was the game that made it a thing. Shared town hubs, instanced areas with mission configurations or exploration mode. Maximum party of 8 in any such instance. Fast travel for free between towns and hubs. I logged 5k hours on GW1, probably slightly more on EQ and DAoC. Compared to those, GW1 is not an MMO, and no one can change my mind on that one.

And I know that PoE drew on GW1 more consciously than it did MMOs. MMOs typically don't innovate, and GGG wanted to innovate with POE, so they looked to a game they knew and loved. Because of course they did: GW1 is a masterpiece, a game made once defying imitation -- GW2, a true MMO, didn't even try. Similarly, there will always only ever be one PoE, because no one wants or needs to be this insane again. Ignorance and naivete was a key ingredient to PoE's existence, as it is the key to a lot of surprise works of genius, inasmuch as a computer game can be considered such.

Oops, 1 minute left. TBC. Maybe.

After 4h of queue/disconnects/desyncs/queue to start queue/not loading textures/downgraded graphics in some zones/unskippable cutscenes/fps drops I can say Diablo 4 is at Fallout 76 beta level. Not to mention that melee is in even worse situation than in PoE.

Someone doesn't know what a stress test is.

This isn't about you or your personal experience. It's not a marketing demo. Blizzard have been doing these for decades. If you don't know why, that's on you.

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Foreverhappychan wrote:

Someone doesn't know what a stress test is.

This isn't about you or your personal experience. It's not a marketing demo. Blizzard have been doing these for decades. If you don't know why, that's on you.

Thank you for telling me what it is about, let me repay the favor:
If you also don't know that it is a sample of their product, it is on you, but nice to see you defending diablo so eagerly despite all it flaws. Did you already bought the game and you're subconsciously trying to convince yourself that D4 is not so bad? Thanks for passive aggression, helped me to feel the vibes of PoE forum.

You can also tell me why my opinion is invalid, because it is "just a beta".