POE is ACTUALLY dying not the drama queen kind, but the actual kind... From Developer Hubris

Agreed 100%

Posted something similar last league when they added mana cost to trigger, specialy COC.

In D2 you could stop playing for some years and when you got back you knew that a hdin would still be plyable.

They are simple missing the point of their game, Dude poe its not a competitive game, its something to relax, pick some itens, and sometimes pick something trophy.

When ppl get back to poe they see a video of wave 30 and all the crazy sh1t on the build, passives, itens, jewels, well.. they simple let it go.

Its just to much and they keep adding stuff, only ppl that play 8h every day will continue.

The single biggest problem that continues to plague Path of Exile is that the items that drop on the ground are 99.9999% worthless - which leads to a never-changing META of zoom with an ultra-strict filter on going for big fish and currency alone.

There need to be tiers of rolls that can ONLY be attained by dropping from monsters. This is the only way to release the zoom zoom valve and add items back into the game. At the moment every item is crafted or unique with zero rare drops in use except as an early league stop-gap.

Yeah. No. Self cast was almost DoA with PoE. Shotgun only really applied to a few spells. Pretty sure anyone who made a caster tried a fireball shotty at some point but plenty of PoE spells didnt and dont have that crucial projectile tag.

Spell totem support came in well before 2015 and it was a major threat to self cast builds from its inception. GGG had no idea how to make it sufficiently weak in comparison to the inherent danger (and modicum of effort) in self-cast play.

And from there they just kept going down that path. Rather than provide safer but weaker alternatives to self cast, GGG created straight up superior options. Trap supported arc was all but thrown in our faces in a skill preview weeks before its implemented buff, and then later they made mine support very potent.

I know they've tried to course correct. Maybe they have succeeded -- I have seen no evidence here. And this, coupled with GGG's noodly idea of 'melee', is also part of why people question PoE's status as a viscerally enjoyable ARPG over any other, but most recently in comparison to D2R. I think this is something of an unfair situation though. D2 has nostalgia on its side AND we accept that it was much simpler and therefore easier to balance. We do not expect D2's sorceress to be able to change her basic skills into turrets or grenades, or the Barbarian's Whirlwind to proc spells...you get the idea.

And this HAS been a problem with PoE from the very start. They didn't keep a careful enough eye on which supports could do what, and the game very quickly went from a dazzling array of possibilities to a sad narrowing of options as they introduced more and more supports without sufficient limitations.

Which sucks because so many of these supports were inherently great concepts that encouraged creative thinking...but more strongly encouraged uncreative build mimicry. But that's a different argument and I shall leave it for a different time.


The insult to injury here is that in an attempt to balance these clearly superior combinations of skill and support, they've more than a few times sniped some genuinely creative usages of support gems in passing.

But yeah, self casting did not enjoy anything close to a 5 year lifespan in PoE's history. No matter from which point you start: 2010, 2012, or 2013.

"

orsonstfu wrote:

The single biggest problem that continues to plague Path of Exile is that the items that drop on the ground are 99.9999% worthless - which leads to a never-changing META of zoom with an ultra-strict filter on going for big fish and currency alone.

There need to be tiers of rolls that can ONLY be attained by dropping from monsters. This is the only way to release the zoom zoom valve and add items back into the game. At the moment every item is crafted or unique with zero rare drops in use except as an early league stop-gap.

Every single ARPG ever was/is about running as fast through content as possible because the faster you are the more often you can use the item drop slot machine. Remember 10 second mep runs or baal runs? The faster you are the bigger is the chance that good stuff drops.

"

Zerber wrote:

"

orsonstfu wrote:

The single biggest problem that continues to plague Path of Exile is that the items that drop on the ground are 99.9999% worthless - which leads to a never-changing META of zoom with an ultra-strict filter on going for big fish and currency alone.

There need to be tiers of rolls that can ONLY be attained by dropping from monsters. This is the only way to release the zoom zoom valve and add items back into the game. At the moment every item is crafted or unique with zero rare drops in use except as an early league stop-gap.

Every single ARPG ever was/is about running as fast through content as possible because the faster you are the more often you can use the item drop slot machine. Remember 10 second mep runs or baal runs? The faster you are the bigger is the chance that good stuff drops.

I remember them quite well but the difference is that the chase items that were attached to baal runs do not exist in PoE. PoE has far more content that is supposed to offer parallel upgrades through the content. Instead - bases are worth vastly more than rares that drop on the ground... this is an awful symptom of a poor loot system that needs iteration, badly.

"

orsonstfu wrote:

I remember them quite well but the difference is that the chase items that were attached to baal runs do not exist in PoE. PoE has far more content that is supposed to offer parallel upgrades through the content. Instead - bases are worth vastly more than rares that drop on the ground... this is an awful symptom of a poor loot system that needs iteration, badly.

Chase uniques aka rune words where basicaly impossible to get in D2. You can play for a year straight every day and without cheating you would most likley never see a single high tier rune drop.

"

alhazred70 wrote:

Both of these games have much slower gameplay but yet: you don't attack in slow motion (since the "melee revamp" made melee worse and you aren't moving in quicksand and they actually FEEL GOOD when fighting... this is another thing POE suffers from: slow base speed, attack and cast until you have enough investment... D2 feels good to kill stuff in blood Moor ffs.

Haha, this so much.

Playing ACTUAL melee is intentionally gimping yourself during progression, feels clunky and the dps doesn't compare to caster or ranged builds.

"

tomcruisejr wrote:

Haha, this so much.

Playing ACTUAL melee is intentionally gimping yourself during progression, feels clunky and the dps doesn't compare to caster or ranged builds.

Weird my boneshatter zerker I played 10 days ago could one tap the whole screen.

Boneshatter isn't a good example though because its got built in what we've always asked for (splash) and it feels great as a result, my only expedition character I really enjoyed was boneshatter is a mechanically wonderful skill that ticks every box I could think of for how a strike should be.

Strike's primary problem and has been for quite a few patches now is the requirement for extra targets + splash, if the gem has one built in its usually a good skill when it comes down to it (pestilent strike, boneshatter, infernal blow if SC, frost blades, lightning strike etc)

Skills like heavy strike need melee splash and ancestral call, you can gear for the 2nd but its expensive and it feels bad to deliberately limit your attack speed until you remove both.

Its a little like what if every spell or bow required GMP and Fork before it felt OK.

Boneshatter is what they need to be and I hope they buff some others to that standard or add new ones to that standard cause its right on the money, the rest I play with Kitava's feast because it feels so good :D

"

Zerber wrote:

"

orsonstfu wrote:

The single biggest problem that continues to plague Path of Exile is that the items that drop on the ground are 99.9999% worthless - which leads to a never-changing META of zoom with an ultra-strict filter on going for big fish and currency alone.

There need to be tiers of rolls that can ONLY be attained by dropping from monsters. This is the only way to release the zoom zoom valve and add items back into the game. At the moment every item is crafted or unique with zero rare drops in use except as an early league stop-gap.

Every single ARPG ever was/is about running as fast through content as possible because the faster you are the more often you can use the item drop slot machine. Remember 10 second mep runs or baal runs? The faster you are the bigger is the chance that good stuff drops.

You are describing Endgame behaviour, and at least for D2 it was not 'what it was about' from a design perspective. My replay of D2 via D2R with a friend who never played D2 back in the day has been what I imagine most here would consider excruciatingly slow but I am happy to be reminded that ARPGs are, in fact, NOT about going as fast as possible through the content. They are about enjoying the game however one wishes to, and for non ARPG junkies, that will almost certainly not be at a particularly accelerated pace.

But I am not saying you are wrong, because from a PoE perspective, it's all endgame now. That IS by GGG's design because it is well known that their strongest engagement with D2 back in the day was that endgame. So for people who immerse themselves in PoE to then believe this notion that ARPGs are nothing but endgame is perfectly understandable...but it is also subjective rather than objective.

In fact, once my casual gaming group hit a point where any given game is nothing but obvious repetitive grind designed to be tackled via metagaming optimisation, we move to the next game -- and there is no short supply there. Life is too brief and free time too precious to endure any one treadmill when there are other vistas to jog through.

ARPGs might encourage playing as fast as possible but then again so have most games, if 'as fast as possible' doesn't get you killed by the space invaders or the ghosts. Speed chess is a thing too.

But the original 'win' condition for most games is not speed. It's having fun by facing the game's challenge and the sense of accomplishment found in overcoming it. Speed runs as a variant of gameplay typically come *after* a game has been sufficiently enjoyed on its own terms. Typically.