Could GGG, Shopify, and Zizaran be prosecuted?

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Imaginaerum wrote:

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RitualMurder wrote:

Lmfao

What the hell is going on here

Since the game came out, it's had races and events and the hardest of the hardcore stay awake for 26 hours a day trying to stay #1. For some reason (again since 2012 and even in the beta) some forum users are under the delusion GGG is somehow responsible for the individual player's choice of staying awake

Yet again, since 2012, nobody has been sued, to my knowledge no one has died, and all the hardcore players everyone's so concerned about are still alive and playing (except Kripp but he used to be #1 and still got 8 hours of sleep)

also for real does anyone actually read this OP's paragraphs all the way through lol?

26? Dude I seen Raiz and a few others go 36+ ... It's funny I'll be watching and playing then do life stuff like eat shower sleep go to work come back next evening and they are still at it drowning themselves in energy drinks and looking like death warmed over.

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Nubatron wrote:

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Aim_Deep wrote:

Arnt they synonymous?

https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/ethic


Ethic a set of moral principles : a theory or system of moral values


-the present-day materialistic ethic
-an old-fashioned work ethic
—often used in plural but singular or plural in construction
an elaborate ethics
-Christian ethics

Anyway maybe you shouldnt if playing english teacher is your thing. Not much into book learning. I drive dumptrucks and perfectly happy abt it.:P

I suppose some use them interchangeably as discussed in this article:

https://www.britannica.com/story/whats-the-difference-between-morality-and-ethics


This is the part that I would focus in on though...

"Many people think of morality as something that’s personal and normative, whereas ethics is the standards of “good and bad” distinguished by a certain community or social setting."

That's generally been my understanding of it and how it was taught to me. Ethics are more in line with a group setting a standard for right and wrong; the Hippocratic Oath being an example of a professional group setting a code of ethics. Put another way, ethics is generally set by some sort of group or society, or even a societal norm whereas morals is more personal and specific to an individuals views of right and wrong. I believe in the context it is being used in this thread, it's about what is considered right and wrong for a developer by a community (since a legal argument is attempted).

Using that perspective, I suppose I'm wrong and ethics is the correct usage. My mistake. I was originally thinking of it from the optic of an individual applying their morals against the situation, which in hindsight is still trying to apply a broader sense of right and wrong on the developer.

I'm also well into a bottle of wine so I can't be held accountable :)

Since it does also state that most just use them interchangeably, I'll move on. In the context of this particular thread, it doesn't matter I suppose. But really, what does matter in this thread?

Thats cool man I learned something new. Like group ethics as opposed to individual. Glad you posted.

Jesus these last couple of generations man. Yall have gone fucking SOFT.

First, it's personal responsibility. No one forces anyone to play a certain amount. If you're (and you are) using the 'but think of the kids!' approach, then I'll tell you right back "it's up to the parents." There's good parents, and there's bad parents. And the bad ones will immediately blame any problem on an outside source.

This entire OP can actually be labelled something that's been thrown around awhile; Authoritarian thinking. YOU (op) believe that you know better then others, and want to enforce your personal control over them. Doesn't matter if you think you're IN the right, you HAVE no right to demand control over others as you see fit.

If I want to play for 45 hours straight and die of a blood clot, that's on me. Stop disguising your obvious obsession of control as some heartfelt wish to make the world perfect. We've seen enough of your threads to understand you want to force companies to pay their players, you want to control who can do what in terms of public game modes and prize money, and now you want to assert control and power over how long a person *should* (because it's your own view) play.

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Kopogero wrote:

Personally, if I was a parent, regardless how old is my child 13-25 years old I would like it to be protected, warned (informed) from anything that I could be unaware of, like playing a game that encouraging him/her to not sleep for excessive amount of time.

I'm sorry, but that sounds a lot like the job of a parent, not the job of a game developer. So, if you were a parent, you would not bother explaining these risks and would instead rely on the company to do so for you...in such a case, could you be prosecuted?

Could GGG, Ziz, and Shopify charge the parent for neglect and endangerment of their child resulting in the loss of future business from said child?

...parents be parents. Problem solved.

And before it is asked, yes I do have children. And yes they are all gamers. And YES I actively monitor their play time vs sleeping, eating, face to face interaction, etc...

And I can honestly say that I spent most of my younger years regularly skipping one or two nights of sleep at a time, whether for school cramming, online poker, or gaming. And um...HI! Still here.

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DiabloImmoral wrote:

For real though races are horrible for player health. In my perfect world all races should be by /played if they take over 10 hours to complete the objectives, or the rewards should be by lottery for all players who complete the objectives within a longer time frame.

Do you even race bro ?

Apart from ds_lilly and alkaizer all other player have really ok sleep schedule.

And go tell those 2 about their lifestyle and see the result. i can tell it to you because it already happened in the racing discord : they'll tell you to fuck off and mind yourself

There is a good reason why every food product has a label stating a detailed info on the ingredients, the day it was made as well as the expiration day, which by the way most choose to trust in, since most also don't know how long certain products can last before they're damaging to their health.

Parents deserve for their children to be better informed and protected with the same information. Children also do not think and act like adults, often hiding things from their parents, like they would pretend they would go to bed, but then go back to playing a game as example, not being fully aware of the harm that could be causing, again if they weren't fortunate to receive the information, information which by law should be AVAILABLE.

Despite how much lobbying the tobacco industry put, still at the end no amount of $ brought back the victims, which why they end up being sued by billions and then forced to label graphic images on their products as well how smoking is harmful to the health.

GGG, Shopify, and Zizaran have responsibility to INFORM the community of the health risks and complications for skipping sleep for many days or not sleeping at all. Many individuals these days follow streamers who log 24-36 hours without sleeping (particularly in this game), and then believe it's alright to do the same, especially the younger ones.

If it was my child that wasn't sleeping for days, because some promoter/company/organizer lured it to compete in some special event for a chance at a big prize (while I was believing that my child is sleeping at nights), and then days later to find my child collapsed on the floor, guess what I would do to those who were responsible, and in the position to inform/warn my child of the health risks, yet "purposely" failed (didn't care).

Anyone who has no ETHICAL/MORAL (call it w/e) conscience to do the right thing, and usually those who only care about profits (money) regardless what lives they might ruin in the process deserve a harsh justice. I'm not here to impose how somebody should live their lives, but to raise awareness that we all have a responsibility, especially those who are organizing/promoting such events, those who are in the position to warn/inform. It's not possible for a parent to always be on top with every single thing their child is doing. We all want to protect our children the best we can with the knowledge we have, but the responsibility is not all on the parent.

Not sleeping or barely getting any sleep has been proven to be a significant factor to win the biggest prize multiple times now in these type of events. Finally, not all have the same endurance or body to endure such marathons. Some might also be unaware of how to achieve what they see others are doing and in the process cause severe harm to their health. So, again those who are responsible to promote events that can endanger the health of others at least must notify/inform the public (participants), so they aren't liable/responsible for whatever follows afterwards, and that's the minimum what they can and should do.

Labeling needs to much stonger with everything. Like why arnt mouse boxes saying they could give you carpel tunnel used excessively. Maybe you should becaome an attorney and start suing? Money talks at the end of the day. Most people dont do anything without financial motivations one way or another.

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Kopogero wrote:

GGG, Shopify, and Zizaran have responsibility to INFORM the community of the health risks and complications for skipping sleep for many days or not sleeping at all.

its very simple.
no. no they don't.
it is not their responsibility, nor should it be.

you mention ethical/moral (call it w/e) to do the right thing, while also saying if you were a parent and your child died or w/e from choosing poorly to not sleep for days....
well sorry, but you shouldn't be looking to point fingers at anyone other than yourself at that point. as the parent, as the GUARDIAN.

too many people are unwilling to do this now-a-days. point the finger at yourself and take responsibility. its why we have government governing over how large of a SODA you're allowed to buy and ridiculous shit like that. because people actually do believe or at least fall for the nonsense you're spouting here.
sadly.

Wow. Where are they regulating soda size? Back when I was in HS they pulled all the vending machines cuz you know for the children so we just went across the street to 7-11 and bought 44oz instead of 12oz lol.

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Kopogero wrote:

There is a good reason why every food product has a label stating a detailed info on the ingredients, the day it was made as well as the expiration day...

Yes, because with the modern food industry, it is impossible to know otherwise what all went into this product.
But you're asking for health warning on a game, which is essentially the level of self-imposed infantility otherwise only seen in people suing a company for not labelling their coffee as hot. WTF?! If you're too stupid to know such things, you should not be allowed to live unsupervised. Or drive a car...

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Kopogero wrote:

Parents deserve for their children to be better informed and protected...
If it was my child that wasn't sleeping for days, ...

...then social services should take it away from you, because you wouldn't behave as a responsible adult. You'd have failed as a parent. How can you not notice your child's state for such a long time? Gaming addiction does not happen overnight.

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Kopogero wrote:

Not sleeping or barely getting any sleep has been proven to be a significant factor to win the biggest prize multiple times now in these type of events. Finally, not all have the same endurance or body to endure such marathons...

Well, duh. The people who push the hardest win the races. That's life. And even really talented sprinters will not beat routine marathon runners at the highest levels and vice versa.

No, your fake concern for the health of children is just a verbose smoke screen for your usual gripe:
You want to be paid to play, but you know you'll not win any races in PoE. Yet instead of finding a game where your play/life/whatever style is more suitable to perform well, you whine and whine here.
Take responsibility for own choices. That's called growing up.