Reworking summoning. Removes Violent Dead, no more slamming for Zombies. Way to go.

21(zombie gem) + 2(ascendancy) + 3(empower) + 1(global weapon) = level 27 zombie

8 max zombie at level 25+. we get our lost 1 zombie.

76(cdr speed at 20) + 7*4(cdr speed per level) = %104 cdr speed.

new : 4(base slam cd) / (1+1.04) = 1.96 sec cd.

old : 5/4(flesh binder + 2 violent deads) = 1.25 cd.

I think damage lose is not that big. Zombie level is the biggest damage boost. It can compensate the damage lose.

For clearspeed you can close the gap with new support skills and mov speed buff.

if you use it on skin of loyal or +3 pseudo helmet you can have even shorter slam cd.


extra jewel slot(s) from violent dead is a plus.

"

pphnx wrote:

21(zombie gem) + 2(ascendancy) + 3(empower) + 1(global weapon) = level 27 zombie

8 max zombie at level 25+. we get our lost 1 zombie.

76(cdr speed at 20) + 7*4(cdr speed per level) = %104 cdr speed.

new : 4(base slam cd) / (1+1.04) = 1.96 sec cd.

old : 5/4(flesh binder + 2 violent deads) = 1.25 cd.

I think damage lose is not that big. Zombie level is the biggest damage boost. It can compensate the damage lose.

For clearspeed you can close the gap with new support skills and mov speed buff.

if you use it on skin of loyal or +3 pseudo helmet you can have even shorter slam cd.


extra jewel slot(s) from violent dead is a plus.

After seeing the patch notes AND the passive tree, I suspected zombies were being nerfed but not to the point of not being viable anymore like many have been saying. There's a lot of potential to make up for that loss in other ways. Just have to re-optimize the build is all.

Looking forward to the patch.

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Draegnarrr wrote:

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atrofear wrote:

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Draegnarrr wrote:

The slams baseline now -_- why does everyone go on tilt after reading one line

You lose about 224% cooldown recovery for the slams. That is the issue.

You have no idea what time you lose on the slam they could have halved its base cooldown and we won't find out until they put the gem info out or more likely when we go out and test.

What is with literally no one reading the patch notes? That includes OP, of course.

We know exactly what happened to the base cooldown because it's literally right there: 5 seconds to 4 seconds.

The previous cooldown with all available cooldown reductions was 5 / ( 1 + modifiers) = 5 / (1 + 3) = 5 / 4 = 1.25 seconds. Which wasn't exactly permanent uptime if you were doing anything to speed up your minions, but whatever. Still short.

The current cooldown at level 20 is 4 / ( 1 + modifiers) = 4 / ( 1 + .76) = 4 / 1.76 = 2.27 seconds. Notably worse.

Let's say you're minmaxing and push your zombie gem to level 32 as a necro with +1 corrupted skin of the loyal and two +1 minion gem wands (21 base + 2 from necro + 2 from wands + 2 from skin + 5 from level 6 empower in skin), at 4 per level that's 124% cooldown reduction (it starts at 0 at level 1). So the best you'll get with that kind of thing is 4 / (2.24) = 1.785 seconds of cooldown.

So, it *is* worse than before, even with some crazy gear, but not as worse as OP is implying. Kinda sad but whatever.

"

That isn't even really the point you could swap a link out for melee splash on zombies and they'd still do more damage post patch than they did before -_-. Zombies clear is limited by movement speed and all the summons absolutely destroy bosses unless they get melted by AoE which has been vastly reduced in likelihood.

End result is Clear > faster, bossing > faster, survivability > higher

The zombie slam can't be avoided. Not only is melee splash a big loss of a support gem but you're suggesting something that would require investing in accuracy for zombies. Not great.

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pphnx wrote:

extra jewel slot(s) from violent dead is a plus.

Eh, if you did hypothetically get always-up zombie slams, then violent dead was functionally 45% increased zombie damage in one jewel. You're gonna be hard-pressed to replace that for a summoner who was all-in on zombies. I feel like they're trying to push broader minion builds.


Personally I'm just excited to try level 31 herald of agony though.

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codetaku wrote:

The zombie slam can't be avoided. Not only is melee splash a big loss of a support gem but you're suggesting something that would require investing in accuracy for zombies. Not great.

You literally need one abyss jewel with minion accuracy on it to cap them out or you know you could reserve the infinitesimal amount of mana it requires to run precision for how good it is. I doubt you even need level 20.

running minion splash isn't great and I personally wouldn't do it, but I genuinely believe zombies will outperform 3.7 zombies even if you did. My point wasn't really to say everything will be sunshine and roses I just got tired very quickly of the zombies dead lul hyperbole based on slam cooldown alone. (also nobody is mentioning that they increased the radius it might end up being smoother anyway)

Just what you'd expect from GGG. Killing non OP fun builds for now reason.

If there is one thing that GGG is truly good at it's hyping up a league, feature or rebalance to the last minute just to then tear your hopes apart upon releasing the patch notes. 'Removing' that jewel is a mistake. A giant mistake.

Have they given us the specs on the zombies yet? They could easily have changed them along with everything else. If the basic zombies now slam more often, then they break even with what they used to do.

</crickets>

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Shagsbeard wrote:

Have they given us the specs on the zombies yet? They could easily have changed them along with everything else. If the basic zombies now slam more often, then they break even with what they used to do.

</crickets>

At this point I'm more interested in any changes they made to the default attack of zombies. If it does more damage or has a shorter attack delay.

"

pphnx wrote:

21(zombie gem) + 2(ascendancy) + 3(empower) + 1(global weapon) = level 27 zombie

8 max zombie at level 25+. we get our lost 1 zombie.

76(cdr speed at 20) + 7*4(cdr speed per level) = %104 cdr speed.

new : 4(base slam cd) / (1+1.04) = 1.96 sec cd.

old : 5/4(flesh binder + 2 violent deads) = 1.25 cd.

Thanks for the math. The extra 3 levels on the zombie is ~44% more damage overall, so it balances out the slam while also doubling their max HP.

I normally run a +3 minion helm with minion dmg/conc effect each league, so pretty much guaranteed to be one-shotting everything except bosses now if the zombies manage to reach them before golems/spectres wipe the board clean. Can look forward to L30 zombies, i guess push for 31.

Strongly considering running Guardian instead for the self onslaught buff though since all that extra minion damage is excessive.

just tried zombie build without violent dead and montregul grasp ...it still work well (15 zombies , 2 golems , 3 spectres + animated guardian ) . so ,with the improvement on the gem + the buff from carion golem , it would stay a very strong build !!!!

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Gulch wrote:

Adios!

Haha. I started playing Dark Chonicle again on the WE. Reminded me of the start of the game, when Cedric first uses the Ridepod

"Adios!"