EA killed for "Surprise Mechanics", TencentGGG slides on "Mystery Box". How?

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DarthSki44 wrote:

Topic body.

I'm still a little unsure how there is universal condemnation and hilarity on EA's defense of loot boxes, yet GGG seems to get a pass on theirs.

If EA said they were not gambling, but rather mystery boxes, I still feel like everyone would have laughed at them.

How does Tencent, just as massive as EA, get away with this? I'm actually curious.

Well, to start, not everyone condemns mystery boxes. Not even half of gamers condemn mystery boxes. Probably fewer than 20% really hate them - because if a large enough fraction of players truly hated them the way they claim, they would exert enough market pressure to force meaningful change.

Those who do hate mystery boxes generally have shitty arguments that boil down to 'I have no self control, please save me from myself' which, thus far in human history, isn't what politics exists for.

One can also like mystery boxes as a concept, if not always in execution. I'm very happy with how PoE does boxes. I'm 5/10 on other implementations. A few I've seen are just awful. When they're bad, instead of pitching a fit, I just don't buy them. If I think the system is salvage-able, I will give that feedback to the company on what changes could be made to entice me to buying a few.

While holding those opinions, I can still watch the EA person over in Europe make an ass of herself by mentioning that internally they are called 'surprise mechanics'. Like, you're not fooling anyone lady - that's really bad spin.

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DarthSki44 wrote:

Topic body.

I'm still a little unsure how there is universal condemnation and hilarity on EA's defense of loot boxes, yet GGG seems to get a pass on theirs.

If EA said they were not gambling, but rather mystery boxes, I still feel like everyone would have laughed at them.

How does Tencent, just as massive as EA, get away with this? I'm actually curious.

It's overall animosity i think. And it stacks and stacks and stacks. When someone is hated, everything that is unethical stands even more.

They ruined every company they ever acquired, destroyed every single franchise we ever loved. And put bullshit boxes with exceptionally retarded RNG in a full price game.

I mean, i don't like lootboxes but in GGG's case, i understand. Atleast we get a good game.

EA however? Man... i despise that company. Lies, ruin, and flat out mockery to anyone that call themselves a gamer.

To answer your question, if a law against lootboxes passes, GGG will suffer too. It's just that EA is an infamous name and it's often the first thing people bring up. Also ofc, Tencent is absolutely massive, it's really hard to go against them. If that's how it works, im not taking their side either. But fo all i care, EA can go suck it.

That and GGG don't spew bullshit like "surprise mechanics" in front of the world. That statement alone should have resulted in a forced shutdown by itself.

how?

ask how the same people praises GGG for every thing even $30 hideouts without effort or fuck ups with patches..

it's like for the majority here it's their first game ever played that they don't know better and they take anything like good sheeps as yes.. all it takes is just 1 post saying "sorry" for be back to the praising status

again same names that see QoL changes to make the game better for everyone it's instantly put down with personal ego arguments most of the time, they want to keep paying for QoL rather than improving the game for everyone

VERY hard these days to know what this community is about.. between whales, npcs or simply hardcore roleplayers or naive folks or simply many people first love in games..

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teknik1200 wrote:

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DarthSki44 wrote:

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teknik1200 wrote:

All things aside this feels like comparing apples to oranges.

How? Both are loot boxes.

EA says it's a surprise, GGG says it's a mystery.

I'd have to look at GGG's loot boxes a bit more to give a solid answer but I don't care about loot boxes and I'm not going to bother with it.


The biggest one was already mentioned, EA's provide an advantage and you need to buy a loot box to get the item. Mass Effect 3 was the last game I played by EA that had them and got a bitter taste them. When the only way to even get the upgrade is to sit there and gamble for it it's a problem.

The fact that it's a P2W mechanic in a paid game is besides the issue but does designate the difference between apples and oranges.


I know you do have to wait to purchase the GGG items individually but as there is no game-play advantage you are not put aside by waiting for individual items.

I don't know if GGG lists the items in their boxes or the odds.

It's not just that it's a gamble so much as the forced gambling.

GGG isn't immune to p2w either. Go play a full league with only 4 starter tabs lemme know how that goes :P Is it possible? You bet! Is it a hell of a lot easier with tabs? You're darn tootin it is. P2w

EA is seen as worse because they usually try to sale retail game with loot boxes on top. FTP games get more of a pass because the people who enjoy them know they have to get money someway.

And one group is a lot bigger then the other so they draw way more attention.

I see it as it's only a gamble if you can lose money from it. You can't do that with this games lootboxes.

I remember my friend showing me them in Battlefront 2 when it came out. You could either get a head or a bunch of other useless junk, or OP mods for the heroes that made them massively more powerful.

You clearly wouldn't ever want to get anything but the mods. The lootboxes in this game though have nothing but cosmetics that are all great. I was so hyped getting the rainbow hypno toad during that last flashback.

P.S. Wallsh, I'm doing my second league now with just the starter tabs, it's plenty of space if you don't hoard.

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BloodPuddles420 wrote:

I'm doing my second league now with just the starter tabs, it's plenty of space if you don't hoard.

So all you have room for is currency, maps, and fossils?

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Wraeclastian wrote:

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BloodPuddles420 wrote:

I'm doing my second league now with just the starter tabs, it's plenty of space if you don't hoard.

So all you have room for is currency, maps, and fossils?

The currency only takes like 3/4 of a tab when I'm letting it pile up, and I only get fossils as I need them. Maps are horse shit though, It's hell trying to manage and keep them organized in a single tab. At one point I was just letting them build up in my characters inventories until I could get a chain upgrade to clear some room.

A few things:

1. EA's games are designed around the boxes - pretty much P2W. GGG stays very far away from any sort of P2W. Stash tabs are the closest thing, but at that point, you're pretty much grasping at straws to make a point.

2. The core game needs to be good. No one minds supporting a good game with their wallet. However, if your core game is crappy AND you stuff the consumer's face with cheap cash grabs, it leaves a sour taste in their mouth.

3. PoE is free-to-play, hence their only source of revenue is MTXes. EA's $60 game is a marketing platform for more in-your-face revenue generation.

4. GGG releases its mystery box contents to the store. This means that, people that do not want to gamble can still get the same MTXes by paying outright for them. With EA's loot boxes, this isn't a possibility. You are stuck playing their roulette.

Apart from this, GGG as a company has a good relationship with its playerbase. EA is on the other end of the spectrum. So, a slight misstep by GGG is taken by the playerbase in good spirit and they are usually great about being transparent and forthcoming with information. On the otherhand, almost all of EA's communication is corporate crap lingo, so the playerbase doesn't feel the love to cut them any slack.

So yeah, on face value, while both EA loot boxes and GGG mystery boxes are the exact same thing, the environment in which they present themselves make quite a bit of difference. Even then, GGG does get a lot of flak for the mystery boxes and their MTX model in general.

Yep, they're the same garbage practice and it's really unfortunate GGG still do it. By far the most embarrassing thing about the game.