Are Stashtabs PAY2WIN?

I view stashtabs like a walk I take on a Sunday and when I pass a house with all the windows with closed curtains, lots of boxes piled outside in an open garage and the car also has boxes inside of it.
They're known as hoarders that close themselves inside and of mind and never let the light in.
On the other side of the street where the houses have lights on, I give out a sigh and walk on.

every league they release more redundant items that need to be picked up and stored.

there are
div cards
currency that stacks to 10 or 20 and will take up multiple tabs
maps - current league I need over 5 tabs to store them
essences
delve crap
scarabs

every league its getting worse as even if you have the tabs to store all that the amount of time that has to be spend juggling inventory goes up.

they making it worse on purpose since its beneficial for profit but detrimental for the game

"

asdfen wrote:

every league they release more redundant items that need to be picked up and stored.

there are
div cards
currency that stacks to 10 or 20 and will take up multiple tabs
maps - current league I need over 5 tabs to store them
essences
delve crap
scarabs

every league its getting worse as even if you have the tabs to store all that the amount of time that has to be spend juggling inventory goes up.

they making it worse on purpose since its beneficial for profit but detrimental for the game

"Annoying you until you finally say 'fuck it' and open your wallet to remove the annoyance" is actually a pretty common pay2win tactic.

Most GGG apologists ignore this, though, because it's so much harder to defend.

I'm pretty sure owning a currency tab, essence tab, map tab, and fragment tab will SAVE you time, not COST you time like so many people like to go on about. Yes, EVEN if you are a pro. And wealth gained vs. time spent sounds like a pretty widely accepted win condition for literally any loot-based MP ARPG. People often talk about variations of exactly that when evaluating the power and overall desirability of a new build, not to put too fine a point on it.

And no, clearing the game or some variant of clearing the game (like reaching lvl 100 or killing Shaper) has nothing to do with "pay2win" and never has. Point to any well-known pay2win game and you will see that it is based on an ongoing-play model, not a clear-the-game-and-be-finished model. So this literal interpretation of the "win" in "pay2win" that people use is really just a straw man.

Once again going to disagree on the response of - div cards - currency stacks

Its pretty simple.. to trade up currency into exalts im sure if you spend all your currency to do chaos trades (currency you dont burn on mapping)

You wont have a problem with currency space

Div cards? Please they stack and theres only a handful worth picking up

I filter out a majority of them since 90% of them have no value

The few that do wont suck up that much space if you're trading in the cards and not being a hoarder..

But at the end of the day...

This game is free 2 play, free to try

If you plan on spending hundreds of hours you shouldnt qq about spending a normal game cost to buy stashes

Ive already outlined exactly how much money it costs to buy 1 of every important stash and compare that to the cost of a regular 60 dollar game.

This game is not pay 2 win

If you wanna see pay 2 win go look @ rotmg/black desert online/ etc


If GGG gave us only 1 character slot/ 1 stash

Then I could say okay , they are essentially forcing people to buy character slots and stashes

But they dont, you get a handful of stashes, a free guild stash, and a large amount of free character slots.

You only feel compelled to buy stashes if you actually play alot and enjoy the game, and again... its not expensive relative to an actual 60 dollar game.

Now I can tell you the value of this game is far above a 60 dollar game

Most people have thousands of hours of fun and game time

Im sure my account is close to 10,000 hours

Ive spent maybe 600 USD (mostly on skins) and maybe 70 - 90 USD on stashes

Over the course of 5 years? Its really nothing

You can cry and whine and QQ all you want saying its pay2win

You dont win by having stash space and you can enjoy the game on a very small budget

You want more QOL fork over some cash plebeian the game costs money to run and maintain expansions and content.

If you cant afford 10 bucks a month on gaming you should re-evaluate your life honestly

"

benjaminbona wrote:

Spoiler

Once again going to disagree on the response of - div cards - currency stacks

Its pretty simple.. to trade up currency into exalts im sure if you spend all your currency to do chaos trades (currency you dont burn on mapping)

You wont have a problem with currency space

Div cards? Please they stack and theres only a handful worth picking up

I filter out a majority of them since 90% of them have no value

The few that do wont suck up that much space if you're trading in the cards and not being a hoarder..

But at the end of the day...

This game is free 2 play, free to try

If you plan on spending hundreds of hours you shouldnt qq about spending a normal game cost to buy stashes

Ive already outlined exactly how much money it costs to buy 1 of every important stash and compare that to the cost of a regular 60 dollar game.

This game is not pay 2 win

If you wanna see pay 2 win go look @ rotmg/black desert online/ etc


If GGG gave us only 1 character slot/ 1 stash

Then I could say okay , they are essentially forcing people to buy character slots and stashes

But they dont, you get a handful of stashes, a free guild stash, and a large amount of free character slots.

You only feel compelled to buy stashes if you actually play alot and enjoy the game, and again... its not expensive relative to an actual 60 dollar game.

Now I can tell you the value of this game is far above a 60 dollar game

Most people have thousands of hours of fun and game time

Im sure my account is close to 10,000 hours

Ive spent maybe 600 USD (mostly on skins) and maybe 70 - 90 USD on stashes

Over the course of 5 years? Its really nothing

You can cry and whine and QQ all you want saying its pay2win

You dont win by having stash space and you can enjoy the game on a very small budget

You want more QOL fork over some cash plebeian the game costs money to run and maintain expansions and content.

If you cant afford 10 bucks a month on gaming you should re-evaluate your life honestly

I never mentioned div card stash tabs. And I happen to agree with you that they provide almost zero benefit over a standard stash tab.

That's why I didn't mention them.

Tabs are p2w. Time is a commodity in PoE, and anything you can buy with $$$ instead of ex that affects said commodity is naturally p2w.

Not that it matters all that much. I'm just posting here because I dislike people who claim tabs aren't p2w. Tabs' existence as p2w goodies is all fine and dandy to me.

"

Anonymous1749704 wrote:

Tabs are p2w. Time is a commodity in PoE, and anything you can buy with $$$ instead of ex that affects said commodity is naturally p2w.

Not that it matters all that much. I'm just posting here because I dislike people who claim tabs aren't p2w. Tabs' existence as p2w goodies is all fine and dandy to me.

I feel more or less the same way, mostly because their p2w nature doesn't scale in the way p2w mechanics in many other games scale.

That said, I do prefer that companies sell their products honestly.

"

GGG wrote:

The game is completely free and will never be "pay to win".

If not for that, I'd have no issues at all.

Tabs are pay to win as they give you indirect advantage in less time needing to spend with your inventory stash, and so more time grinding and getting more and better loot.

But still I am ok with it, because the advantage is not that big, and just getting few tabs fixes this problem.

My bigger problem that has nothing to do with pay to win, is that GGG is constantly adding all type of crap to manage, and at the same time adding new type of premium stash tabs for that crap. They are adding problems and to fix the problem you need to pay. Thats something that I am not a huge fan of.

GGG need to fix fossils--it is outrageous they became part of main game and they still do not stack. I bought all special tabs, I have 40 premium tabs but I will not buy fossil tab unless GGG makes fossils stack first. I simply refuse to be blackmailed into buying MTX by designing items, ie. fossils, in a way they are now. Fossils have no reason to be treated as stand-alone objects, they do not have special traits, each fossil of the same type is identical to any other from the same type.

"

Baron01 wrote:

GGG need to fix fossils--it is outrageous they became part of main game and they still do not stack. I bought all special tabs, I have 40 premium tabs but I will not buy fossil tab unless GGG makes fossils stack first. I simply refuse to be blackmailed into buying MTX by designing items, ie. fossils, in a way they are now. Fossils have no reason to be treated as stand-alone objects, they do not have special traits, each fossil of the same type is identical to any other from the same type.

I read in some interview somewhere that this wasn't deliberate but rather a consequence of natural engine limitations.

...

Yeah, I don't buy it either.