Development Manifesto: Changes to the Labyrinth

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steven0006 wrote:
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Bamzyniigata wrote:
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Rakiii wrote:
I see people are just lazy to do anything these days. They want toys without an effort.
Labyrinth is an optional thing and whoever wants a treasure must deal with it. It´s simple as that.


Remember, its just a game, and game have to bring fun and lab isn t fun.


Still nobody cares about the treasure or the helm enchants they arent worth the pixels they are drawn on. All we want is our ascendancy points and to move on to map farming/atziri farming/shaper farming/etc, you know where the real end game is.


You are sadly, sadly mistaken.

Also, everyone that says shit like "nobody likes X" needs to knock it the hell off. You don't speak for everyone. State your opinion, keep it to that. You have no damned idea what everyone, or the majority of people even, like or don't like.

Remember that people are much more inclined to report when unhappy than when happy and that what is seen here on this forum is a small fraction of what's going on in the game in terms of experiences.

Finally, I like the lab.
Support a free Hong Kong.

I do not feel obliged to believe that the same God who has endowed us with
sense, reason, and intellect has intended us to forgo their use.
-Galileo Galilei
I used to dislike the big RNG in lab regarding the helm enchants, then i started flipping and exploiting lack of knowledge and i can buy anything so i stopped caring :)
I represent only myself, my own thought and believes. I am individual, not a representative of the community.
I am not speaking on behalf of someone else and I don't get offended by things that have nothing to do with me.
ING: Marxone
Ty for scam <3
Personally, I dislike endgame labyrinth due to two reasons:
1) too small arena, where you fight Izaro, so boss fight is clunky and you don't see many actions of your character and boss/minions. For more evasive-like characters, there is no room for maneuvers.
2) some traps are too big problem for characters with no life regeneration (sometimes you have to open new endgame labyrinth so you get different setup). Some of these traps are placed to close each other.

Definitely endgame labyrinth need some tweaks.

Last edited by SevenKnives on May 16, 2017, 8:47:05 AM
It thematically makes no sense to remove the difficulties from the game by now having 10 full unique acts, then keep the 3 times repeated lab/trials thing. Will we still be facing Brutus, Merveil, Malachai, etc 3 times?

It's bad game design, honestly.
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Astealoth wrote:
The lab is extremely problematic and shortening the trivial early ones is not helpful or wanted.

The content is broadly hated, but the rewards are so insanely powerful that you have very little choice but to participate in it. You can't just ignore them and go on with your life and have a competitive character, considering that the other content is tuned with the expectation that you have done the lab. The problem is, the rest of the game is much more diverse and inclusive. Every tier of map up to T17 has something for just about every kind of build and every skill level of player to tackle.

The lab is extremely specific in what is required to finish it. The traps and boss require precise twitch movement beyond what the majority of the game requires or extreme physical resistance beyond what the majority of the game requires. This makes the lab itself very build and/or player dexterity exclusive. This is not in line with the majority of the game's content, yet much of the game's content benefits significantly from the rewards of the lab. There is a terribly abusive design problem going on here just in the core mechanics of combat and traps in the lab.

Then there is the reward structure beyond the basic skill point progression. You simply can not expect to enchant your own helmet with something relevant to your primary skill within the time spans of a league. It is not possible, you would have to devote 100% of your time to the lab for the entire league to even dream of a hint of a chance. So, no SSF enchanting, period. Not going to happen, maybe 1 in 1000 SSF players might get a relevant enchant on the timescale of a league. So we're forced to trade for our helmets and sell the helmets we enchant. That's fine for most people perhaps, but what if you use an uncommon helmet? Oh my goodness, someone dares to play a suboptimal self designed build in this game? String them up by the heels and flog them in the eye until they vomit blood! That scrub wears a T2 helmet, HA! Is this really what the game needs? Who at GGG genuinely believes that this enchant system makes sense?



Thank you , spot on !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
yes lab is the least joyable part of this game. Would not mind if it was optional. Rather have it as a nice addition to the game than a forced speedbump.

Enchants are awsome and fit well in the lab but ascendancy points are to valuable for any build to have locked behind timeconsuming content only beatable to specific builds.
Last edited by Walltrigger on May 16, 2017, 3:13:39 PM
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Archwizard wrote:


You are sadly, sadly mistaken.

Also, everyone that says shit like "nobody likes X" needs to knock it the hell off. You don't speak for everyone. State your opinion, keep it to that. You have no damned idea what everyone, or the majority of people even, like or don't like.

Remember that people are much more inclined to report when unhappy than when happy and that what is seen here on this forum is a small fraction of what's going on in the game in terms of experiences.

Finally, I like the lab.


Not mistaken or lazy as i have done the trash you call labs and its not fun nor is it worth the time invested period. You can quote your opinion same as I have done mine and the majority as you can see on forums concurs with me that the Lab is just a giant waste of time. 1 out of 10000 player run lab for loot because its annoying, dc's make you start over and to top it off if you get a lag spike because of the trash servers you die and repeat.

It's ok the blind will always follow the blind.
Disappointing to hear. Repeating the lab 4 times is incredibly boring when you've already played 30+ characters considering it's forced content. This is a bad decision.
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steven0006 wrote:
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Archwizard wrote:


You are sadly, sadly mistaken.

Also, everyone that says shit like "nobody likes X" needs to knock it the hell off. You don't speak for everyone. State your opinion, keep it to that. You have no damned idea what everyone, or the majority of people even, like or don't like.

Remember that people are much more inclined to report when unhappy than when happy and that what is seen here on this forum is a small fraction of what's going on in the game in terms of experiences.

Finally, I like the lab.


Not mistaken or lazy as i have done the trash you call labs and its not fun nor is it worth the time invested period. You can quote your opinion same as I have done mine and the majority as you can see on forums concurs with me that the Lab is just a giant waste of time. 1 out of 10000 player run lab for loot because its annoying, dc's make you start over and to top it off if you get a lag spike because of the trash servers you die and repeat.

It's ok the blind will always follow the blind.


For starters, the forums do not reflect the totality of player opinion.

Second, other than forums, what sources do you use? I run a guild with 174 people in it, so I have a decent size sample pool in addition to the forums, other friends, etc.

Third, have you ever even looked at poe.trade for prices of certain enchants? They can be very lucrative and there are many people that run the lab just to farm them.

You don't like the lab, that's fine. If the servers and game experience are so bad, find something else that doesn't upset you so much.

But stop being a judgmental ass towards people that enjoy different things than you.
Support a free Hong Kong.

I do not feel obliged to believe that the same God who has endowed us with
sense, reason, and intellect has intended us to forgo their use.
-Galileo Galilei
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Nicksiren wrote:
Disappointing to hear. Repeating the lab 4 times is incredibly boring when you've already played 30+ characters considering it's forced content. This is a bad decision.



Yes, it really is a bad decision. The community is also on its way of becoming split in 2 ( feels like ). This also creates more hostile community towards each other ( it's already hostile and toxic enough imo by far ). Why not come up with a solution that both parts can live with and try to unite us ggg? Seriously !!!

I have stopped spending dollars on this game, I know I am not the only one lol. It's a reason for this. As long as ggg do stupid unnecessary decisions and slowly destroy this game I am not spending money, simple.
I have been hoping that ggg would grow to become a big company. Big as in one of the biggest game companies in the world, its great developers in ggg, what a shame. I believe this company could make many good games just like Blizzard for example. The lab, for example, could be an own game, it's a great concept if it was just that another game.

I think "the haters" are in majority, probably like 70/30 ish but realistically more like 80/20. Most players don't bother reading or/and voice their opinions in the forums, twitter etc and just plays the game and when it becomes shit they just leave. My impression of what the players i have been talking to think about the lab and wants for the game.

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