The Son of God:

"

cipher_nemo wrote:

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Kamchatka wrote:

Creating theology based on just a few Bible passages, and ignoring everything else in the Bible that contradicts your invented theology is a poor form of theology, that is all you have done in this thread.

"invented theology"? Hundreds of millions, if not a billion followers of Christ would disagree with you.

The book of Peter gives us some wonderful defenses against false teachings and satan...

His divine power has given us everything we need for a godly life through our knowledge of him who called us by his own glory and goodness. - 2 Peter 1:3 [NIV]

But there were also false prophets among the people, just as there will be false teachers among you. They will secretly introduce destructive heresies, even denying the sovereign Lord who bought them—bringing swift destruction on themselves. Many will follow their depraved conduct and will bring the way of truth into disrepute. In their greed these teachers will exploit you with fabricated stories. Their condemnation has long been hanging over them, and their destruction has not been sleeping. - 2 Peter 2:1-3

Be alert and of sober mind. Your enemy the devil prowls around like a roaring lion looking for someone to devour. Resist him, standing firm in the faith, because you know that the family of believers throughout the world is undergoing the same kind of sufferings. - 1 Peter 5:8-9

On a different topic, I have noticed pages ago that Kamchatka is pretty much a shell account. A ghost. Why do you post under this account and not your real account? What are you hiding?

So you are saying that the first 1500 years of Christian belief on salvation was wrong, and they were led by false prophets, and we should ignore every passage in the Bible contradicting the "faith alone" theology, and only Christians in the last 500 years "have the holy spirit" and really understand salvation?

You create a salvation theology based on a few Bible passages, ignore most of the Bible, and just start bashing Catholics and the Orthodox churches as 2000 years of false prophets?

Not much more to say here, You can either believe the Bible or not, ultimately your choice.

Also, I played HC, and havent made a new character in a while, but still read forums.

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Kamchatka wrote:

Also, I played HC, and havent made a new character in a while, but still read forums.

Not on this account. Zero achievements, but registered since 2014. And you didn't start posting on the forums until last month.

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cipher_nemo wrote:

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Kamchatka wrote:

Also, I played HC, and havent made a new character in a while, but still read forums.

Not on this account. Zero achievements, but registered since 2014. And you didn't start posting on the forums until last month.

Correct. Played on different account on HC, forgot I made this one to trade.

Your recent attempts at deflection are noted, BTW

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Kamchatka wrote:

Your recent attempts at deflection are noted, BTW

or not...

"

Kamchatka wrote:

So you are saying that the first 1500 years of Christian belief on salvation was wrong, and they were led by false prophets, and we should ignore every passage in the Bible contradicting the "faith alone" theology, and only Christians in the last 500 years "have the holy spirit" and really understand salvation?

And forgiveness of sins was only achieved by sacrificing a goat in the Old Testament. And now in the New Testament, forgiveness is given through repentance alone. Does that mean teachings of the time before the New Testament was "wrong"? No. But the real problem is where you equate salvation through faith alone to being a new concept. It's not. It existed the moment that thief died on the cross, and has been part of Christianity ever since. The Catholic church was not the only "church" after the death and resurrection of Jesus. Churches were often much smaller, just several households getting together during those earlier periods of civilization

"

Kamchatka wrote:

"

cipher_nemo wrote:

"

Kamchatka wrote:

Also, I played HC, and havent made a new character in a while, but still read forums.

Not on this account. Zero achievements, but registered since 2014. And you didn't start posting on the forums until last month.

Correct. Played on different account on HC, forgot I made this one to trade.

Forgot what account is what? Oh, how convenient. I dare you to link your other account. And I can almost guarantee you won't and accuse me of deflection again. I'd happily eat those words if you do. :-)

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cipher_nemo wrote:

"

Kamchatka wrote:

Your recent attempts at deflection are noted, BTW

or not...

"

Kamchatka wrote:

So you are saying that the first 1500 years of Christian belief on salvation was wrong, and they were led by false prophets, and we should ignore every passage in the Bible contradicting the "faith alone" theology, and only Christians in the last 500 years "have the holy spirit" and really understand salvation?

And forgiveness of sins was only achieved by sacrificing a goat in the Old Testament. And now in the New Testament, forgiveness is given through repentance alone. Does that mean teachings of the time before the New Testament was "wrong"? No. But the real problem is where you equate salvation through faith alone to being a new concept. It's not. It existed the moment that thief died on the cross, and has been part of Christianity ever since. The Catholic church was not the only "church" after the death and resurrection of Jesus. Churches were often much smaller, just several households getting together during those earlier periods of civilization

Faith alone is a new concept in the history of Christianity, starting with the protestant revolt. It is approximately 500 years old. What the Catholic and Orthodox churches currently teach on salvation is what was taught for the first 1500 years.

If you are going to start to re-write history, we are getting into comedy-land here.

"

cipher_nemo wrote:

Forgot what account is what? Oh, how convenient. I dare you to link your other account. And I can almost guarantee you won't and accuse me of deflection again. I'd happily eat those words if you do. :-)

I dont see how this changes anything, but are you happy? And looks like i still have some HC guys

And i just reset a forgotten PW for you, youre welcome

"

Kamchatka wrote:

Faith alone is a new concept in the history of Christianity, starting with the protestant revolt. It is approximately 500 years old. What the Catholic and Orthodox churches currently teach on salvation is what was taught for the first 1500 years.

If you are going to start to re-write history, we are getting into comedy-land here.

From Wikipedia: "Protestants base [sola fide] on the fact that the New Testament contains almost two hundred statements that appear to imply that faith or belief is sufficient for salvation"

More importantly, a nice Bible Study on this: https://bible.org/seriespage/lesson-14-salvation-grace-through-faith-alone-ephesians-28-9

Also, quoted from Wikipedia...

"Several passages in the Bible specifically mention churches meeting in houses. "The churches of Asia greet you, especially Aquila and Priscilla greet you much in the Lord, along with the church that is in their house." I Cor 16:19. The church meeting in the house of Priscilla and Aquila is again mentioned in Romans 16:3, 5. The church that meets in the house of Nymphas is also cited in the Bible: "Greet the brethren in Laodicea, and Nymphas, and the church which is in her house." Col 4:15.

For the first 300 years of Early Christianity, people met in homes until Constantine legalized Christianity, and the assembly moved out of houses into larger buildings creating the current style church seen today."

As such, there was no Catholic "priest" to preside over believers, no confessionals, no idols of mother Mary, no rosary, no pews and communions, and no concept of "we must attend church to ensure our salvation".

You are the one trying to re-write history with the Catholic church and Orthodoxy being the foundation of Christianity.

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Khoranth wrote:

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cipher_nemo wrote:

Forgot what account is what? Oh, how convenient. I dare you to link your other account. And I can almost guarantee you won't and accuse me of deflection again. I'd happily eat those words if you do. :-)

I dont see how this changes anything, but are you happy? And looks like i still have some HC guys

And i just reset a forgotten PW for you, youre welcome

Ah, thank you! I will eat those words now and deal with the heartburn later. :-)

"

cipher_nemo wrote:

"

Kamchatka wrote:

Faith alone is a new concept in the history of Christianity, starting with the protestant revolt. It is approximately 500 years old. What the Catholic and Orthodox churches currently teach on salvation is what was taught for the first 1500 years.

If you are going to start to re-write history, we are getting into comedy-land here.

From Wikipedia: "Protestants base [sola fide] on the fact that the New Testament contains almost two hundred statements that appear to imply that faith or belief is sufficient for salvation"

More importantly, a nice Bible Study on this: https://bible.org/seriespage/lesson-14-salvation-grace-through-faith-alone-ephesians-28-9

Also, quoted from Wikipedia...

"Several passages in the Bible specifically mention churches meeting in houses. "The churches of Asia greet you, especially Aquila and Priscilla greet you much in the Lord, along with the church that is in their house." I Cor 16:19. The church meeting in the house of Priscilla and Aquila is again mentioned in Romans 16:3, 5. The church that meets in the house of Nymphas is also cited in the Bible: "Greet the brethren in Laodicea, and Nymphas, and the church which is in her house." Col 4:15.

For the first 300 years of Early Christianity, people met in homes until Constantine legalized Christianity, and the assembly moved out of houses into larger buildings creating the current style church seen today."

First point: 200 statements appear to imply... I am stating the entire Bible is true and fits together perfectly, and none of it can be ignored. The only reason they "appear too" is they are taken out of context by protestants to prove a false theology. You cannot ignore anything in the Bible, it is all true, not just the parts you want to be true.

Second point: are you actually suggesting the apostles did not all teach the same teachings? All the churches in the first 300 years were united under the same teachings. And after the persecution ended, all the churches were able to openly unite and start putting together what the apostles taught. Never was faith alone taught in the first 1500 years.

"

Kamchatka wrote:

Second point: are you actually suggesting the apostles did not all teach the same teachings? All the churches in the first 300 years were united under the same teachings. And after the persecution ended, all the churches were able to openly unite and start putting together what the apostles taught. Never was faith alone taught in the first 1500 years.

The Catholic church did not have the same teachings as the first 300 years of the household church meetings, because the constructs to support the teachings of the Catholic church did not exist within those households. As I said before, no rosary, no worship of (or through) mother Mary, no confessionals (Catholics have a strict routine here), no Catholic saints (yet), etc.

...

"Catholic (from Ancient Greek: καθολικός katholikos "universal") was first used to describe the church in the early 2nd century.[18] The first known use of the phrase "the catholic church" (he katholike ekklesia) occurred in the letter from Saint Ignatius of Antioch to the Smyrnaeans, written about 110 AD.[note 2] In the Catechetical Discourses of Saint Cyril of Jerusalem (circa 350), the name "Catholic Church" was used to distinguish it from other groups that also call themselves the church"