Trading in-game currencies and goods for some store items with GGG assistance

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I'm so glad I started my new job today. I have no energy left to try to beat into OP that he is wrong. Just going to sit back and snicker now...


I should keep their profile bookmarked in Google though. Stay up to date when they get banned..

It is just sad that he tries to change the subject by claiming it is a "gift" even though it is clearly not. It is mtx for in game currency which equals RMT no exceptions. "But, but, but... Mah Gift..." -.-

Man, support said it is legal. If other player want to help - it is his choice.
I will share other sentence from that respone:
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Also, please be aware that real money transactions, otherwise known as RMT, is against our Terms of Use which can be found here: https://www.pathofexile.com/legal/terms-of-use-and-privacy-policy

This means: If you want to help - do it via support.
It is gift just because there is no exchange rate.
RMT has some values of exchange. Gifting has not any.

If support says "YES", it means - yes. Also, I was born in USSR. It was socialism, where people help each others. Not like you - capitalists.
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Sarno wrote:
If you will only give your "gift" in return for a specific item, it is a trade.

Stop using the word gift - it is a lie.

Right. I do not give my friend specific items. I give him items which I needn't. However, i would give them to somebody.

Also, trade always some kind or rate. Within gifting system there is not any exchange rate.
Support didn't say it was legal. They said they might be able to help with a gift. If they knew you were really trading they'd not allow it. Try it more than once and you'll find out.
Guild Leader The Amazon Basin <BASIN>
Play Nice and Show Some Class www.theamazonbasin.com
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Uranist wrote:
Things I was describing are normal for business. If you sell goods, you do not care who will pay. While you are the only one who gets profit - it is OK.

RMT makes situations where player gets profit secretly.

Full logical chain of this "gifting system":
1 "Mercenary" wants to get some armor and weapons but cannot pay for them. he is from small, poor country. But he knows his job.
2 "Boss" have enough money to buy armor and weapon for "mercenary".
3 "Boss" comes to landlord/"king" and pays some money to fill "mercenary" account.
4 "King" gets profit. "Boss" gets service. "Mercenary" gets weapon and armor.
No laws violated. Only "king" allows such operations. But such operations are profirable for "king". "King" gets money and favor.

This was "king" can devastate or at least break any "grey" or "black" market.

The only way to fight RMT for real is to legalize economic relationships.


There is no "secrecy" involved in rmt. Technically RMT isn't inherently wrong, hence you had D3's auction house. But GGG explicitly does not allow it in PoE. So secret or not, rmt is rmt.

And in your scenario you literally described pay to win, which GGG tries to avoid by banning RMTers. You are allowing somebody who got lucky/has more playtime to feed in game goods to somebody who doesn't have has much play time, to instantly get where they want to go with no actual effort other than "I have a good real life job."

Yeah it might be profitable for the "king" as GGG in your hypothetical, but it is unethical as shit in their view so it better not happen. Because again. It would be pay to win on the person "buying" the other players in game items. So yeah, pretend in your little fantasy a company as reputable as GGG will let that happen. Because if it did, the population it grew out of players who trusted GGG to be ethical and prevent P2W would be gone overnight. Game dead in a month tops.

And the bolded part: We should let everyone bot to their hearts content? Every game should open a auction house like D3 where the company gets a cut (look how well that mess turned out)?

Or lets go real world. Can't stop political corruption from happening so we should get ready to vote Putin in as 45.5th US President? Can't stop people from dying so we should load up some bazookas and speed up the process? Haven't found a 100% treatment for cancer so far, better start shooting cancer patients right upon diagnosis. Can't proactively stop people from domestically abusing their spouses so we better decriminali- oh...
wait wait wait
i thought ggg only sells NON-p2w mtxes... was I wrong?
And worst change is putting almost all bosses in new version of maps into fucking small areas, where you can't kite well or dodge stuff. What a terrible idiot invented that I want say to him: dude flick you, seriously flick you very much.
if you want other players legally gift you with shop points just make a guild, invite them and let them spend points to the guild. the points and stash tabs you buy with te points are basically yours because you can kick these players from the guild after some time (or they leave themselves).

other player to player gifts are decided case by case by ggg support. there should be a reason you want to gift those players and there is no guarantee ggg will do the point transfer.

players paying ingame favours with points probably is one of the reasons ggg will not do the point transfer :-)

age and treachery will triumph over youth and skill!
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silumit wrote:
wait wait wait
i thought ggg only sells NON-p2w mtxes... was I wrong?

Some people think that buying stash tabs for another player is RMT. But in fact there is no any shop item that is pay-to-win. They are just cosmetic or useful for playing(more space).

Also, they think that I am RMT seller. I didn't say that people help each other. I spared like 300chaos orb to friend, helping him to achieve 40/40. But I didn't ask him to buy smth for me because we live in ex-USSR. So price is the same for me and for him.
P2w and RMT are two different things. It doesn't matter if stash tabs are p2w. If something costs real money, and you trade time or in game items for that thing that costs real money, it is RMT. The R stands for Real and the M stands for Money. When GGG starts allowing you to buy mtxes for in game currency, it will no longer be RMT. I don't see that ever happening because they can't pay for servers with exalted orbs.
Guild Leader The Amazon Basin <BASIN>
Play Nice and Show Some Class www.theamazonbasin.com
I have said. RMT means: YOU ARE GETTING MONEY.
And RMT does NOT mean only money. If I washed your car for a weapon effect, that is still RMT. You are trading out of game goods and services for in game items. That is not allowed.

Don't worry though, I have more than made Support aware of this thread in case they weren't aware of it already.
"Programming today is a race between software engineers striving to build bigger and better idiot-proof programs, and the Universe trying to produce bigger and better idiots. So far, the Universe is winning."

"Your mother was a hamster and your father smelt of elderberries!"
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mark1030 wrote:
If something costs real money, and you trade time or in game items for that thing that costs real money, it is RMT.


exactly.

gifting other players with ingame currency is "pay to win". question is, is it "borderline ptw" as stash tabs are?

i think, dependent on the game's health, we will see official ingame gifting with points sooner or later. the fact that guilds already exploit that topic to the extreme is a sign it's not a total taboo for ggg.


age and treachery will triumph over youth and skill!

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