Donald Trump and US politics

“If you put the federal government in charge of the Sahara Desert, in 5 years there’d be a shortage of sand.”

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TheWretch wrote:

^ Unreal. Fuckin shameful man. Whenever someone brings up our system as something to aspire to i laugh

It's still miles better than the US system.

The US system is a reactionary system instead of a preventive system. Reacting to a problem cost way WAY more than preventing said problem from happening. In Canada, that means that the cost per person is considerably lower than in the US. Resulting in a higher cost for the US residents for their healthcare, even if they aren't taxed for it.


Now, is the current response rate for the canadian healthcare system acceptable? No. It needs huge improvements to cut down the waiting times to a more acceptable level.


Keep in mind that a lot of lower income americans couldn't even afford to go to an hospital to get treated (before Obamacare). I'd be curious to see the rate of illness related death in the US, especially based on income.

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faerwin wrote:

Keep in mind that a lot of lower income americans couldn't even afford to go to an hospital to get treated (before Obamacare).

even if they are "covered" by obamacare a lot of people still can't.


the government shouldn't have a big hand in healthcare

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faerwin wrote:

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TheWretch wrote:

^ Unreal. Fuckin shameful man. Whenever someone brings up our system as something to aspire to i laugh

It's still miles better than the US system.

The US system is a reactionary system instead of a preventive system. Reacting to a problem cost way WAY more than preventing said problem from happening. In Canada, that means that the cost per person is considerably lower than in the US. Resulting in a higher cost for the US residents for their healthcare, even if they aren't taxed for it.


Now, is the current response rate for the canadian healthcare system acceptable? No. It needs huge improvements to cut down the waiting times to a more acceptable level.


Keep in mind that a lot of lower income americans couldn't even afford to go to an hospital to get treated (before Obamacare). I'd be curious to see the rate of illness related death in the US, especially based on income.

Id rather have the option to pay outright and not die on the ER floor because others can't afford their treatments.

Yes, its cheaper per person. Know what the results of that are? We get the worst service and a massive shortage of qualified medical professionals because they can go literally anywhere else to practice medicine and get alot more money for alot less strain and stress.

From a single person perspective, it makes sense. From a governing perspective, it does not. You want to save as many lives as possible (because alive people = more tax money/workforce). It's also logical from a society point of view to give equal access to health treatment to everyone.

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Yes, its cheaper per person. Know what the results of that are? We get the worst service and a massive shortage of qualified medical professionals because they can go literally anywhere else to practice medicine and get alot more money for alot less strain and stress.

While I don't disagree entirely with this, it's not entirely true either. It's not because it's cheaper that it make doctors go elsewhere but because they get more money due to unregulated health system elsewhere.


Personally, I'd be up for a medicla option to pay a certain sum of money (1000 to 2500 I'd say) to skip the waiting line for non life threatening visits and then use 100% of the money generated from that to improve the health system. That should be a win-win.

premiums are sky high.... deductibles are ludicrous, and if you don't want anything to do with it the government steals your money at gunpoint, it's not pretty!

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Manocean wrote:

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faerwin wrote:

Keep in mind that a lot of lower income americans couldn't even afford to go to an hospital to get treated (before Obamacare).

even if they are "covered" by obamacare a lot of people still can't.

the government shouldn't have a big hand in healthcare

I genuinely love free-market capitalism, but I simply don't see it working here.

Here's a fairly common story: While performing official duties, an officer of the government discovers an unconscious customer. Without the customer's consent, she is transported to a health care facility. Then, without the approval of an estimate of charges, services are rendered for which the customer is financially responsible.

You can't apply free market principles to situations where customers (or suppliers) have no volition, where customers cannot reject one seller in favor of another, where competitive pricing is moot. True capitalism rests firmly upon the principle of mutual agreement, and can go nowhere without it. When dealing with emergency healthcare​, it's absurd to pretend anything but a heavy government solution will do.

Every time I see a story about the horrors of Canadian healthcare, there are common elements. The patient is conscious; the situation may be urgent but not emergent; there is time for researching options and choosing among many different providers. It is precisely in these situations where a little free market competition would do a lot of good.

The best solution here isn't socialized or free-market medicine, but both. In emergency care, "free market solutions" are illusions hiding crony capitalist corruption, as free market solutions are de facto impossible in many instances; therefore, the solution is single-payer government intervention. In non-emergency care, government intervention is a tool for Big Pharma to strangle competition via lobbyist takeover of government, and what we need are pro-free-market regulations that would protect newbie innovators who would compete against the corporatist hegemony.

However, this would involve politicians drawing a line of principle through the healthcare industry and agreeing to control only that within their proper jurisdiction, never attempting to expand the bureaucracy beyond it. And lel to that.

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Vhlad wrote:

This is what Americans CANNOT allow the US health care system to become:

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/nova-scotia/overcrowded-hospital-death-halifax-infirmary-emergency-room-1.4084567

This is the same story in every socialized healthcare system. The poster child of "democratic socialism", Sweden, has the longest waiting lines & the most overcrowded hospitals / overextended staff. Yeah, healthcare is "free", but the quality of the service reflects that.

When the shit hits the fan for our politicians, they usually go to threat themselves abroad (good ole US of A), instead of waiting months/years for a tomography scan in our little socialist countries, like the proletariat has to. ;)

Like everything else that is under governmental control, healthcare is also very susceptible to corruption and waste. Like Scrotie said, a combination of both principles, would be the best option. But to get that you'd first need the gov to let go the bone... bad gov, bad!

Good work in Berkeley:

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4chan is Hunting Antifa

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DTlyOB_I7yc

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/pol/ is hunting down the Antifa rioters from Berkeley, and it turns out a bunch of them are radicalised professors.

There is apparently NO hiding from /pol/ and their "weaponized autists." This amazing line of investigation of a serious assault at the recent rally has led to prosecution of the identified offender, a professor at a nearby college. =^[.]^=

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Raycheetah wrote:

Good work in Berkeley:

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4chan is Hunting Antifa

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DTlyOB_I7yc

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/pol/ is hunting down the Antifa rioters from Berkeley, and it turns out a bunch of them are radicalised professors.

There is apparently NO hiding from /pol/ and their "weaponized autists." This amazing line of investigation of a serious assault at the recent rally has led to prosecution of the identified offender, a professor at a nearby college. =^[.]^=

Sargon of Akkad also did a extensive report about a particular agitator among the Antifa Sturmabteilung (SA). Not surprisingly, she is a teacher. TL,DW: He traced her back to a SJW loony bin called BAMN ("By Any Means Necessary"), which perfectly fits the very base archetype of a classical cult. The BAMN cult is tightly tied to both Antifa and also the major of Berkley (he is a friend with the cult leaders and also belongs to their FB group). Kind of puts the cops inactivity during the street fights in a new light.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZQwfTPqn5kc&t=3s